When people say this, 9/10 times what they really mean is you think there should be no separation.......as long as it is a religion YOU support. I doubt you would want laws based on Islam or Satanism. And freedom of speech goes out the window with blasphemy laws. No thank you. If you want a theocracy, there are plenty of countries like Iran for you to choose from that have religion as the state.
Jefferson, Madison, and Adams vehemently disagreed with you.
No, we were not founded on religion.
How about instead of an "I say so, so it's true" argument you give some solid evidence that our country was founded on religion
The US was not founded on religious belief but instead of equal religious freedom for all people regardless of their religious beliefs or lack thereof. Jefferson and Madison were adamant about this idea.How about instead of an "I say so, so it's true" argument you give some solid evidence that our country was founded on religion
His declaration to Benjamin Rush that “I have sworn upon the altar of god eternal hostility against every form of tyranny over the mind of man,” was made in the context of religious freedom: any government effort to control religious beliefs was “tyranny over the mind of man.”3
Jefferson saw religious freedom as essential for a functioning republic. Without religious freedom and a strict separation of church and state, “kings, nobles, and priests” threatened to create a dangerous aristocracy. As Peter Onuf explains, “Jefferson defined the old regime as an unholy alliance of ‘kings, nobles, and priests’ that divided the people in order to rule them.
Jefferson (serving in Paris as ambassador). Beating back the effort to impose religious taxes in a sometimes bitter legislative battle, the triumphant Madison was able to have Jefferson’s Statute adopted, one of the great successes of Jefferson’s life. Jefferson reported triumphantly that the legislative effort to insert “Jesus Christ” in the preamble to the Virginia Statute was defeated, establishing that religious freedom was “meant to comprehend, within the mantle of it’s protection, the Jew and the Gentile, the Christian and Mahometan, the Hindoo and infidel of every denomination.”
The state cannot enforce a religious morality because there are as many ideas of what is moral as who is or isn't god/s or what sect you belong to and obey. That action would be a blatant violation of both religious clauses of the First Amendment because the state would be enforcing a religious idea, which violates the strict separation of chich and state and it would be trampling on the religious and secular rights of people who were not a member of the religion or sect views being enforced.
No our country was not founded on religion. Just ask the folks who founded it:
Ignoring the obvious. The United States when it was founded was overwhelmingly Christian and the founders had no reason to think it would ever be otherwise.The US was not founded on religious belief but instead of equal religious freedom for all people regardless of their religious beliefs or lack thereof. Jefferson and Madison were adamant about this idea.
1) Wow, you found four of the founding fathers to quote. One of which (Jefferson) is hideously overrated.No our country was not founded on religion. Just ask the folks who founded it:
"The purpose of separation of church and state is to keep forever from these shores the ceaseless strife that has soaked the soil of Europe in blood for centuries...Who does not see that the same authority which can establish Christianity, in exclusion of all other Religions, may establish with the same ease any particular sect of Christians, in exclusion of all other Sects?"
"During almost fifteen centuries has the legal establishment of Christianity been on trial. What have been its fruits? More or less in all places, pride and indolence in the Clergy, ignorance and servility in the laity, in both, superstition, bigotry and persecution...In some instances they have been seen to erect a spiritual tyranny on the ruins of the Civil authority; in many instances they have been seen upholding the thrones of political tyranny: in no instance have they been seen the guardians of the liberties of the people. Rulers who wished to subvert the public liberty, may have found an established Clergy convenient auxiliaries. A just Government instituted to secure & perpetuate it needs them not.”
"It was the belief of all sects at one time that the establishment of Religion by law, was right & necessary; that the true religion ought to be established in exclusion of every other; and that the only question to be decided was which was the true religion. The example of Holland proved that a toleration of sects, dissenting from the established sect, was safe & even useful. The example of the Colonies, now States, which rejected religious establishments altogether, proved that all Sects might be safely & advantageously put on a footing of equal & entire freedom.... We are teaching the world the great truth that Govts do better without Kings & Nobles than with them. The merit will be doubled by the other lesson that Religion flourishes in greater purity, without than with the aid of Gov. "
"The experience of the United States is a happy disproof of the error so long rooted in the unenlightened minds of well-meaning Christians, as well as in the corrupt hearts of persecuting usurpers, that without a legal incorporation of religious and civil polity, neither could be supported. A mutual independence is found most friendly to practical Religion, to social harmony, and to political prosperity."
"Mingling religion with politics may be disavowed and reprobated by every inhabitant of America...All national institutions of churches, whether Jewish, Christian, or Turkish, appear to me no other than human inventions set up to terrify and enslave mankind, and monopolize power and profit."
"'The government of the United States of America is not in any sense founded on the Christian Religion"
"Christianity neither is, nor ever was a part of the common law."
-Thomas Jefferson, letter to Dr. Thomas Cooper, February 10, 1814
"History, I believe, furnishes no example of a priest-ridden people maintaining a free civil government. This marks the lowest grade of ignorance of which their civil as well as religious leaders will always avail themselves for their own purposes."
-Thomas Jefferson to Alexander von Humboldt, Dec. 6, 1813.
"I am for freedom of religion, & against all maneuvres to bring about a legal ascendancy of one sect over another."
-Thomas Jefferson, letter to Elbridge Gerry, 26 January 1799
"The United States of America have exhibited, perhaps, the first example of governments erected on the simple principles of nature: and if men are now sufficiently enlightened to disabuse themselves of artifice, imposture, hypocrisy, and superstition, they will consider this event as an era in their history... It will never be pretended that any persons employed in that service had any interviews with the gods, or were in any degree under the inspiration of heaven... it will for ever be acknowledged that these governments were contrived merely by the use of reason and the senses... Thirteen governments thus founded on the natural authority of the people alone, without a pretence of miracle or mystery, which are destined to spread over the northern part of that whole quarter of the globe, are a great point gained in favour of the rights of mankind.”
[A Defence of the Constitutions of the United States of America, 1787]”
― John Adams, The Political Writings of John Adams
The founders wanted a system of religious freedom for all people and not an abusive theocracy of various Christian sects because that would have created a situation that was just beginning to be solved in western Europe where the Protestants and Catholics were warring for social and political control.
Two of those quotes are primary framers Of the Constitution. The other two are considered founding fathers. In case you’re counting, that’s four, not two.1) Wow, you found two of the founding fathers to quote. One of which (Jefferson) is hideously overrated.
2) They're dead. No one cares anymore. A dead dog is greater than a living lion.
There is no evidence that the US was ever envisioned as a Christian country, despite your attempts to spin it in that manner.1) Wow, you found four of the founding fathers to quote. One of which (Jefferson) is hideously overrated.
2) They're dead. No one cares anymore. A dead dog is greater than a living lion.
It was never intended to be a Christian nation. They have had enough of religion being used as a political club to beat everyone else over the head with.