Nintendo sues Yuzu, arguing emulation itself is unlawful.

[Nomad4Ever]

How strong is Nintendo’s legal case against Switch-emulator Yuzu?

Nintendo is "basically taking the position that emulation itself is unlawful."

arstechnica.com

the company's most expansive and significant argument yet against emulation technology that it alleges "turns general computing devices into tools for massive intellectual property infringement of Nintendo and others' copyrighted works."

If successful, the arguments in the case could help overturn years of legal precedent that have protected emulator software itself, even as using those emulators for software piracy has remained illegal.

"Nintendo is still basically taking the position that emulation itself is unlawful,"

In its lawsuit, Nintendo argues that "there is no lawful way to use Yuzu to play Nintendo Switch games.

Nintendo goes directly after this argument in its lawsuit, arguing that buying a Switch game only means you "have Nintendo's authorization to play that single copy on an unmodified Nintendo Switch console." Any other copy is, by definition, an "unauthorized copy," Nintendo says, even if it's made by the original purchaser for their own personal use.

I genuinely despise Nintendo as a company. They are trying to set a legal precedent that would make emulation itself unlawful. It isn't hard to see why they would do this, as they have taken to reselling decades old Nintendo games ported to their current console through a subscription service.

Sorry Nintendo. I'm not spending hundreds of dollars on another electronic device, creating unnecessary waste, that runs the games WORSE than the hardware I already have.

Apparently the only Nintendo Approved way to play Breath Of The Wild is at 720p with frames per second frequently dropping into the low teens. Nintendo is literally arguing it is/should be illegal to play their games at a smooth 60 FPS at 4k on the electronics you already own. Meanwhile Sony has taken the opposite direction recently and has been releasing Play Station games and even Play Station exclusives on PC (and even some on iOS/Mac).

Nintendo has a lot of money and good lawyers. Depending on how this case goes we could end up seeing emulation declared illegal across the board. But Nintendo likes nothing more than spending hundreds of thousands of dollars on efforts to hurt the fans of their games.

 

[Peter]

For all the good that Nintendo do by making some of the best games ever they constantly shoot themselves in the foot with anti consumer moves.

They have done this in the past by limiting supply of hardware to make prices stay high and not making hardware backwards compatible so fans ended up having to rebuy games they already own if they want to play them on new hardware.
Backwards compatibility should be a given and it's not hard to do as both Sony and Microsoft manage it.

 

[Peter]

I've been on a gaming forum for a few decades now and it used to make me smile watching Nintendo fans during the Wii era claim Nintendo were a tiny company who couldn't possibly afford more manufacturing capacity while at the same time Nintendo was for a while the biggest company in Japan.

The Wii and DS were selling like hot cakes and printing money and they could have made more but they kept production limited so that they always sold out instantly for years and prices remained high well after the consoles would normally see price cuts.

Gaming has come a long way in the 40 years I've been a gamer.

 

[Nomad4Ever]

For all the good that Nintendo do by making some of the best games ever they constantly shoot themselves in the foot with anti consumer moves.

They have done this in the past by limiting supply of hardware to make prices stay high and not making hardware backwards compatible so fans ended up having to rebuy games they already own if they want to play them on new hardware.
Backwards compatibility should be a given and it's not hard to do as both Sony and Microsoft manage it.

100%. Nintendo does a lot of things right. Releases game in full. No micro transactions. Commitment to keeping 1st party games high quality.

But god…they are such pricks. I despise their closed off and controlling mentality. They’d rather spend hundreds of thousands in legal fees to stop people from playing their games on a platform they don’t even sell them on.

You’re going to play Zelda at 540p at 20 FPS on phone hardware from 2013 or you’re not going to play at all.

 

[Lord Tammerlain]

Nintendo has to protect its IP and how it monetize it.

It sells games and gaming systems. If people can take a game and play it on a different system Nintendo potentially loses out on the sale of the game system

It certainly is a draconian company but I certainly understand what they are doing.

Emulation software should not be illegal, emulator designed to run Nintendo games without a license should be, ( provided the copyright or patent is still valid)

 

[Lethargic Aptitude]

How strong is Nintendo’s legal case against Switch-emulator Yuzu?

Nintendo is "basically taking the position that emulation itself is unlawful."

arstechnica.com

I genuinely despise Nintendo as a company. They are trying to set a legal precedent that would make emulation itself unlawful. It isn't hard to see why they would do this, as they have taken to reselling decades old Nintendo games ported to their current console through a subscription service.

Sorry Nintendo. I'm not spending hundreds of dollars on another electronic device, creating unnecessary waste, that runs the games WORSE than the hardware I already have.

Apparently the only Nintendo Approved way to play Breath Of The Wild is at 720p with frames per second frequently dropping into the low teens. Nintendo is literally arguing it is/should be illegal to play their games at a smooth 60 FPS at 4k on the electronics you already own. Meanwhile Sony has taken the opposite direction recently and has been releasing Play Station games and even Play Station exclusives on PC (and even some on iOS/Mac).

Nintendo has a lot of money and good lawyers. Depending on how this case goes we could end up seeing emulation declared illegal across the board. But Nintendo likes nothing more than spending hundreds of thousands of dollars on efforts to hurt the fans of their games.

The last gasp of a dead gaming giant.

 

[Lethargic Aptitude]

Nintendo has to protect its IP and how it monetize it.

It sells games and gaming systems. If people can take a game and play it on a different system Nintendo potentially loses out on the sale of the game system

It certainly is a draconian company but I certainly understand what they are doing.

Emulation software should not be illegal, emulator designed to run Nintendo games without a license should be, ( provided the copyright or patent is still valid)

And with that marketing strategy they will fade away. But then they have not made a good game since super.

 

[Lord Tammerlain]

And with that marketing strategy they will fade away. But then they have not made a good game since super.

I don't like their games but fully understand they have to make money to stay in business. If people emulate their games, Nintendo will lose out on sales.

 

[Glitch]

How strong is Nintendo’s legal case against Switch-emulator Yuzu?

Nintendo is "basically taking the position that emulation itself is unlawful."

arstechnica.com

I genuinely despise Nintendo as a company. They are trying to set a legal precedent that would make emulation itself unlawful. It isn't hard to see why they would do this, as they have taken to reselling decades old Nintendo games ported to their current console through a subscription service.

Sorry Nintendo. I'm not spending hundreds of dollars on another electronic device, creating unnecessary waste, that runs the games WORSE than the hardware I already have.

Apparently the only Nintendo Approved way to play Breath Of The Wild is at 720p with frames per second frequently dropping into the low teens. Nintendo is literally arguing it is/should be illegal to play their games at a smooth 60 FPS at 4k on the electronics you already own. Meanwhile Sony has taken the opposite direction recently and has been releasing Play Station games and even Play Station exclusives on PC (and even some on iOS/Mac).

Nintendo has a lot of money and good lawyers. Depending on how this case goes we could end up seeing emulation declared illegal across the board. But Nintendo likes nothing more than spending hundreds of thousands of dollars on efforts to hurt the fans of their games.

It is not unlawful, and companies have been doing this for decades.

A good example is the Atari ST PCs that were sold in the mid-1980s. It's operating system was called GEMDOS, developed by Digital Research, and could also emulate MS-DOS and thereby run software written specifically for the IBM PC. Because the Atari ST used Motorola's 68000 CPU, it could also emulate Apple's SOS and the Mac OS and run software written for the Apple III, and the Macintosh.

Atari's ability to emulate the two biggest PC brands on the market was a key selling point to its success. It was also the only PC that had MIDI ports built-in, which was a big plus if you were into music.

During the 1990s, after Apple dumped Motorola and started using Intel CPUs instead, they also had the ability to emulate MS-DOS and could run software written for that O/S.

So this sort of thing has been happening for quite some time, by both large and small businesses alike.

 

[Lethargic Aptitude]

I don't like their games but fully understand they have to make money to stay in business. If people emulate their games, Nintendo will lose out on sales.

Most people using emulators were not going to be customers at all.

 

[Peter]

The last gasp of a dead gaming giant.

The Nintendo Switch has been a huge seller and Nintendo has enough money that even if the next couple of generations of machines are huge flops they will be fine.

Money really isn't a problem for Nintendo and even if it was they have the most valuable IP in gaming with Mario and Zelda.
Any Mario or Zelda game is going to be a best seller.

I'm not even a particular Nintendo fan with my last console being the 3DS but Nintendo are here to stay.

 

[Nomad4Ever]

Nintendo has to protect its IP and how it monetize it.

It sells games and gaming systems. If people can take a game and play it on a different system Nintendo potentially loses out on the sale of the game system

It certainly is a draconian company but I certainly understand what they are doing.

Emulation software should not be illegal, emulator designed to run Nintendo games without a license should be, ( provided the copyright or patent is still valid)

Then they should give people a way to legally pay them and play on the hardware they already have. And you can just download brand new PC games on PC without even needing an emulator. If the emulator is the problem then Windows is also a problem.

Imo there are minimal losses of sales. The vast majority of people buy games on Steam when they could more easily pirate them than pirating Nintendo games. Nintendo are losing their own sales by going out of their way to make sure people cannot legally buy and play their game on systems that are more than capable of doing so.

 

[Lord Tammerlain]

Then they should give people a way to legally pay them and play on the hardware they already have. And you can just download brand new PC games on PC without even needing an emulator. If the emulator is the problem then Windows is also a problem.

Imo there are minimal losses of sales. The vast majority of people buy games on Steam when they could more easily pirate them than pirating Nintendo games. Nintendo are losing their own sales by going out of their way to make sure people cannot legally buy and play their game on systems that are more than capable of doing so.

Nintendo makes money selling the games and the console to play them. If they put the game up for use on other devices they lose the console sales

 

[Nomad4Ever]

Nintendo makes money selling the games and the console to play them. If they put the game up for use on other devices they lose the console sales

For sure.

But Nintendo has created a situation where the best way to play their games is to pirate them. Pirates are getting a better experience than they paying customers. The games run better, at a higher resolution, on the electronics they already have without creating pointless waste on an electronic device they don't need or want.

I think Gabe Newell from valve once said something like, "piracy is a service problem not a price problem". And this is definitely a case of that. The issue isn't people not wanting to pay for them games, at least no more so than any game on PC, the issue is that Nintendo has a stick so far up their ass that they are trying to make it illegal to have the best possible experience playing their games. Their two big Zelda games this gen barely run at all on their own platform with massive performance issues and at a super low resolution. Meanwhile pirates can run the game at 60 FPS and 4k. Emulating is somehow the definitive way to experience the game. And that is the real issue.

 

[samiam5211]

Nintendo only makes games for the money.

 

[Nomad4Ever]

Nintendo only makes games for the money.

That's why they use to go after the sites where you could illegally download game like everyone else.

Now they are going after emulators.

Sony might as well try to sue Windows for allowing people to play pirated Sony games.

 

[beefheart]

BTW, I found a great website that has many hundreds of old PC games, windows and DOS, Atari 2600, Genesis, and SES, all playable, for free in your browser.

Play CLASSIC games online

Play the best DOS or classic console games here, in a web browser!

playclassic.games

 

[Superfly]

How strong is Nintendo’s legal case against Switch-emulator Yuzu?

Nintendo is "basically taking the position that emulation itself is unlawful."

arstechnica.com

I genuinely despise Nintendo as a company. They are trying to set a legal precedent that would make emulation itself unlawful. It isn't hard to see why they would do this, as they have taken to reselling decades old Nintendo games ported to their current console through a subscription service.

Sorry Nintendo. I'm not spending hundreds of dollars on another electronic device, creating unnecessary waste, that runs the games WORSE than the hardware I already have.

Apparently the only Nintendo Approved way to play Breath Of The Wild is at 720p with frames per second frequently dropping into the low teens. Nintendo is literally arguing it is/should be illegal to play their games at a smooth 60 FPS at 4k on the electronics you already own. Meanwhile Sony has taken the opposite direction recently and has been releasing Play Station games and even Play Station exclusives on PC (and even some on iOS/Mac).

Nintendo has a lot of money and good lawyers. Depending on how this case goes we could end up seeing emulation declared illegal across the board. But Nintendo likes nothing more than spending hundreds of thousands of dollars on efforts to hurt the fans of their games.

I’ve been a fan of emulation for years. I can’t play any first-person games. They make me super motion sick. My best games are the old school NES and SNES games, because for the most part, they aren’t 1st person.

I have a PSP that I have an emulator and roms on. I have the NES and SNES, and the games, so I’m not breaking any rules or anything.

Nintendo has always been shit when it comes to doing the right thing by their customers. Just like they release shit around the holidays, and deliberately short-stock the stores, to drive up demand.

 

[TheGoverness]

How strong is Nintendo’s legal case against Switch-emulator Yuzu?

Nintendo is "basically taking the position that emulation itself is unlawful."

arstechnica.com

I genuinely despise Nintendo as a company. They are trying to set a legal precedent that would make emulation itself unlawful. It isn't hard to see why they would do this, as they have taken to reselling decades old Nintendo games ported to their current console through a subscription service.

Sorry Nintendo. I'm not spending hundreds of dollars on another electronic device, creating unnecessary waste, that runs the games WORSE than the hardware I already have.

Apparently the only Nintendo Approved way to play Breath Of The Wild is at 720p with frames per second frequently dropping into the low teens. Nintendo is literally arguing it is/should be illegal to play their games at a smooth 60 FPS at 4k on the electronics you already own. Meanwhile Sony has taken the opposite direction recently and has been releasing Play Station games and even Play Station exclusives on PC (and even some on iOS/Mac).

Nintendo has a lot of money and good lawyers. Depending on how this case goes we could end up seeing emulation declared illegal across the board. But Nintendo likes nothing more than spending hundreds of thousands of dollars on efforts to hurt the fans of their games.

I'd have sympathy for them if they would ****ing release their old games on modern platforms. I play plenty of old Nintendo games through emulation because I have no choice.

They'd be printing more money if they'd make all of their old games available in the Nintendo store. Instead, without emulation, you better hope your 3DS or N64 still works, because then you're shit outta luck.

 

[Nomad4Ever]

I'd have sympathy for them if they would ****ing release their old games on modern platforms. I play plenty of old Nintendo games through emulation because I have no choice.

They'd be printing more money if they'd make all of their old games available in the Nintendo store. Instead, without emulation, you better hope your 3DS or N64 still works, because then you're shit outta luck.

I was arguing with someone on Reddit about it and they actually started arguing that the 540p stuttering FPS experience is "how Nintendo intended it to be played".


Nintendo knows best. If you you want to play at a modern resolution and not be able to count each frame too bad. That isn't a Nintendo sanctioned gaming experience.

Plus the Switch is horrible for accessibility and a lot of accessibility devices only work on PC. But I guess **** those people too, that's not a Nintendo Sanctioned experience.

 

[Nomad4Ever]

I'd have sympathy for them if they would ****ing release their old games on modern platforms. I play plenty of old Nintendo games through emulation because I have no choice.

They'd be printing more money if they'd make all of their old games available in the Nintendo store. Instead, without emulation, you better hope your 3DS or N64 still works, because then you're shit outta luck.

Oh, you can play some of their old games on Switch...

...if you pay an online subscription every month. Lol.

Oh, you wanted to own them? You wanted to play an old game we didn't decide to put in the subscription? Shut up. We know best.

 

[Nomad4Ever]

I have the NES and SNES, and the games, so I’m not breaking any rules or anything.

According to Nintendo, by the language of this lawsuit, you actually are breaking the rules and are committing a crime. LMAO.

I'm convinced Nintendo hates their own fans. I can't think of any other motivation. Behaving like this isn't even helping them financially.

 

[Peter]

I don't like their games but fully understand they have to make money to stay in business. If people emulate their games, Nintendo will lose out on sales.

This is simply not true.
Time and again it's been shown that emulation of old games drives sales of new games on the systems that support it.

People will be drawn back into gaming by the nostalgia but they will then go on and see newer games they wouldn't have ever seen if not for emultion bringing them back into the hobby.
Sony and Microsoft have done a good job at making older games playable on new machines without any extra money from customers as they know these customers are them likely to buy new games.

I know people who were forced by the stupid Nintendo rules into rebuying the same game multiple times to keep playing them without the need to have multiple consoles all plugged in and they shouldn't have to do that.

If Microsoft can make almost all Xbox games from 4 generations available to play on the newest hardware so can Nintendo.

 

[bomberfox]

How strong is Nintendo’s legal case against Switch-emulator Yuzu?

Nintendo is "basically taking the position that emulation itself is unlawful."

arstechnica.com

I genuinely despise Nintendo as a company. They are trying to set a legal precedent that would make emulation itself unlawful. It isn't hard to see why they would do this, as they have taken to reselling decades old Nintendo games ported to their current console through a subscription service.

Sorry Nintendo. I'm not spending hundreds of dollars on another electronic device, creating unnecessary waste, that runs the games WORSE than the hardware I already have.

Apparently the only Nintendo Approved way to play Breath Of The Wild is at 720p with frames per second frequently dropping into the low teens. Nintendo is literally arguing it is/should be illegal to play their games at a smooth 60 FPS at 4k on the electronics you already own. Meanwhile Sony has taken the opposite direction recently and has been releasing Play Station games and even Play Station exclusives on PC (and even some on iOS/Mac).

Nintendo has a lot of money and good lawyers. Depending on how this case goes we could end up seeing emulation declared illegal across the board. But Nintendo likes nothing more than spending hundreds of thousands of dollars on efforts to hurt the fans of their games.

Nintendo cant preserve its game library by itself. Unless Nintendo plans on porting every single game for US and Japan, they need to **** right off. Unless they also plan to port solatorobo and pokemon soul silver as well as all those insanely expensive artificially scarce games over, again **** right off.

 

[bomberfox]

Nintendo only makes games for the money.

Nintendo doesnt make any money off old games they havnt ported over.