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New York Times: Guilty Of Treason

Caine said:
Umm... why are you bringing up Karl Rove?????? The title of this thread is..
New York Times: Guilty of Treason


Duh.

Because you are acting as if the determining factor in whether or not there is anything to talk about here is whether or not the NYT has been charged. You don't see things that way when the shoe's on the other foot.

Want proof?...

From "Rove won't be charged in CIA leak case" thread, Post # 51:

Caine said:
Okay......

So Rove won't be charged in the CIA leak case....

WHOOOOPIDY DOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!


Does this REALLY prove he wasn't involved? Not really.


Obviously you don't think indictments are what determines anything...except until now.

Get it? It's called hypocrisy.
 
aquapub said:
Duh.

Because you are acting as if the determining factor in whether or not there is anything to talk about here is whether or not the NYT has been charged. You don't see things that way when the shoe's on the other foot.

Want proof?...

From "Rove won't be charged in CIA leak case" thread, Post # 51:




Obviously you don't think indictments are what determines anything...except until now.

Get it? It's called hypocrisy.

You mind posting the rest of that post by me?
Or are you intentionally trying to be deceitful????
Maybe I'll just do it myself.....
 
Caine said:
Does this REALLY prove he wasn't involved? Not really.
Does it really matter? Nah. At least not to me. The CIA Leak is one thing Im tired of hearing about.

Am I saying that I believe he was? Nah.
Ive decided to stay away from making stupid claims.

Of course, when I made this post, I knew someone would completely ignore the bolded sentence above.
I thought I was wrong, I thought those in that thread actually proved me wrong.

Well, it turns out I was right after all.....sad...
 
Caine said:
Of course, when I made this post, I knew someone would completely ignore the bolded sentence above.
I thought I was wrong, I thought those in that thread actually proved me wrong.

Well, it turns out I was right after all.....sad...

:rofl

What's sad is your inability to comprehend that you contradicted yourself. I left the other crap out because it wasn't relevant.

Let me spell it out for you.

THIS:

Caine said:
Does this REALLY prove [Rove] wasn't involved? Not really

means that you don't think indictments establish validity....

Repeatedly posting THIS:

Caine said:
Has the NYT been charged with Treason yet????

Nope? I'll try back later

means you think indictments do establish validity.
 
aquapub said:
:rofl

What's sad is your inability to comprehend that you contradicted yourself. I left the other crap out because it wasn't relevant.

Let me spell it out for you.

THIS:



means that you don't think indictments establish validity....

Repeatedly posting THIS:



means you think indictments do establish validity.

How? someone has to be indicted before they can be found Guilty.

If the NYT is guilty of treason, wouldn't that be hard to do since they haven't even been charged yet?????

Hmm... NYT charged with treason yet? No? I'll try back later....
 
Caine said:
How? someone has to be indicted before they can be found Guilty.

If the NYT is guilty of treason, wouldn't that be hard to do since they haven't even been charged yet?????

Hmm... NYT charged with treason yet? No? I'll try back later....


And...again, being found guilty in a court of law is not the point at which it is warranted to talk about an issue.
 
aquapub said:
And...again, being found guilty in a court of law is not the point at which it is warranted to talk about an issue.

Innocent until proven guilty, isn't that the phrase you stand by so much in the threads about the recent cases against the murdering rapist soldiers???
 
Caine said:
Innocent until proven guilty, isn't that the phrase you stand by so much in the threads about the recent cases against the murdering rapist soldiers???

There is a huge difference between the two.
The difference is that there is a NYT article revealing the classified informationname written all over a article,but there is no pictures or video of a soldier/marine raping and or killing a Iraqi girl and family.
 
jamesrage said:
There is a huge difference between the two.
The difference is that there is a NYT article revealing the classified informationname written all over a article,but there is no pictures or video of a soldier/marine raping and or killing a Iraqi girl and family.

Hmm....so this "evidence" can be used to convict a party before they are even brought up on charges?
 
Caine said:
Hmm....so this "evidence" can be used to convict a party before they are even brought up on charges?
The NYT article is almost as the same as a self confession.It is no different than some terrorist bragging he blew up such and such building.
 
jamesrage said:
The NYT article is almost as the same as a self confession.It is no different than some terrorist bragging he blew up such and such building.


So....by you saying its OK to blow up an Abortion Clinic, we can infer you will soon be indicted....correct?

Nice knowin' Ya James (not)
 
Caine said:
Innocent until proven guilty, isn't that the phrase you stand by so much in the threads about the recent cases against the murdering rapist soldiers???


And, like I've said over and over now, guilt in a court of law is not the determining factor in whether or not it is ok to TALK about what they did.
 
tecoyah said:
So....by you saying its OK to blow up an Abortion Clinic, we can infer you will soon be indicted....correct?

Nice knowin' Ya James (not)

Oh give me a freaking break, that's not what he was saying at all. The right way to word your comparison to make it the equivalent of what he said would be:

"So....by you saying I BLEW UP AN ABORTION CLINIC, we can infer you are guilty."

Way to think it through.:roll:
 
tecoyah said:
So....by you saying its OK to blow up an Abortion Clinic, we can infer you will soon be indicted....correct?

Saying that you think something is justified is not the same as having a video or self confession.The NYT article telling the whole world our classified programs is there in black and white.They basicly commited the crime of treason right in front of us.If someone stabbed your best friend right in front of you,would you argue that the person who stabbed your friend is only accused and has not be convicted even though you saw with your own eyes the crime being commited?

IN most of these cases it should be innocent until proven guilty,because we were not there and there is no video or confirmed photos circulating around of the accused doing the crime.The NYT article exposing our classified programs is there for the whole world to see,they even admited in the article the program is classified and secret.
 
hipsterdufus said:
How dare a newspaper print the truth! Off with their heads I say.

Treason!!!!

Give me a break...
You see the New York Times obviously doesnt have devotion to its own country, becuase if it honestly did care about the well being of its fellow americans it wouldnt have run the story. It may be the truth, but it didnt need to be told, it was doing good, but now it cant really be used, or atleast effectively since you know terrorists now are going to try to go down a different avenue that we perhaps havent seen.
 
How dare a newspaper print the truth! Off with their heads I say.

Treason!!!!

Give me a break...

Reckless and irresponsible, but not treason...

As noted in previous posts, the administration was quite public with the existence of the terrorist finances tracking program. Consequently, some now say that the NYT didn't tell the terrorist anything that they didn't already know. I don't think thats true.

Far from revealing the vague outline of the program, the Times disclosed such key details as: American investigators have a hard time tracking ATM transactions in the U.S.; they can’t track wire transfers in real time; and the United Arab Emirates is cooperating with the program. All good stuff to know — if you want to evade U.S. scrutiny.

Dennis Lormel is a former FBI agent who was instrumental in establishing and running this program. He said,

It was an innovative and remarkable program. As custodian of the program, Treasury provided the SWIFT information to the CIA, who managed the program. The FBI, in conjunction with the CIA and Treasury, exploited financial information to thwart terrorists, exposing them to areas of financial vulnerability.

For my colleagues who have been skeptical of the U.S. Government’s efforts in terrorist financing, this program, the cooperation with other financial providers, such as First Data Corporation and Western Union, contributed significantly to the A- grade given the Government for Terrorist Financing by the 9/11 Commission. Many of the successes achieved in terrorist financing have not reached the public domain. The anonymity afforded, up until this point, has provided the interagency community the opportunity to continue to exploit terrorists through their financial vulnerabilities.
[emphasis added]

Paraphrasing some thoughts from a recent editorial at NRO...

While I believe the NYT exercised terrible judgment in publishing the story, I don't question the paper’s legal right to do so. But I also do not question the government’s legal right — indeed, its obligation — to find, prosecute, and punish those who are responsible for leaking details of this highly classified program. IMO, they have recklessly harmed an important program in the GWOT. It used to be thought that leak investigations always went nowhere, but now we have the experience of the Fitzgerald investigation to show us that reporters can be subpoenaed and leakers found out.

So far, judging by news reports, there is no such investigation going on. Perhaps there’s action we don’t know about, but the Plame precedent is instructive. When the CIA first referred the matter to Justice, nothing happened. It was only when then–CIA director George Tenet personally pushed for an investigation and his intervention was leaked to the press that DoJ began to move. I would like to see the same aggressiveness in this case from new treasury secretary Henry Paulson.

If the Bush administration’s complaints about the damage done by the NYT story are to be taken seriously — and they should be — it must pursue the government leakers who are the ultimate source of the damage. The administration shouldn not let this one go by.
 
aquapub said:
And, like I've said over and over now, guilt in a court of law is not the determining factor in whether or not it is ok to TALK about what they did.

Yes, there is nothing wrong with talking about it.
But your the title of this thread leads one to believe they have been found guilty of treason.

So, has the NYT been convicted of treason yet?
No? Okay, I'll try back later.....
 
Lazel said:
You see the New York Times obviously doesnt have devotion to its own country, becuase if it honestly did care about the well being of its fellow americans it wouldnt have run the story. It may be the truth, but it didnt need to be told, it was doing good, but now it cant really be used, or atleast effectively since you know terrorists now are going to try to go down a different avenue that we perhaps havent seen.

Oh Jesus. :roll:
 
aps said:
Oh Jesus. :roll:
To which part of Lazel's post, exactly, are you delivering this articulate, elaborate, compelling counterpoint?

-That terrorists will use different funding methods now that the NYT has needlessly exposed the inner-workings of a classified anti-terror funding program?

-That just because something's true doesn't mean the NYT has a right to broadcast it (like our troop movements or other classified information)?

Please fill us all in on what exactly is so outrageous about this post?:waiting:
 
Caine said:
So, has the NYT been convicted of treason yet?
No? Okay, I'll try back later.....


And, since we can all plainly see that the NY Times DID violate the Espionage Act (with or without a jury verdict), we will continue to disregard this utterly pointless observation. :clap:
 
aquapub said:
And, since we can all plainly see that the NY Times DID violate the Espionage Act (with or without a jury verdict), we will continue to disregard this utterly pointless observation. :clap:

:beatdeadhorse

I thought we already discussed this.

Unless you again are saying that people are not "innocent until proven guilty in a court of law"

I guess that phrase only works when you are defending the acts of Rapist and Murderous troops in Iraq. Yes, those who tarnish the same uniform that hundreds of thousands of sailors, soldiers, marines, and airmen wear everyday.
 
Caine said:
:beatdeadhorse

I thought we already discussed this.

Unless you again are saying that people are not "innocent until proven guilty in a court of law"

I guess that phrase only works when you are defending the acts of Rapist and Murderous troops in Iraq. Yes, those who tarnish the same uniform that hundreds of thousands of sailors, soldiers, marines, and airmen wear everyday.


Legally you ARE considered innocent until proven guilty.

But in case you haven't noticed, this isn't a courtroom, and we are allowed to state the obvious here without having a jury verdict to back it up. So please, give it a rest and debate the issue or go away.
 
aquapub said:
Legally you ARE considered innocent until proven guilty.

But in case you haven't noticed, this isn't a courtroom, and we are allowed to state the obvious here without having a jury verdict to back it up. So please, give it a rest and debate the issue or go away.

I demand the title of this thread be changed!
 
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