New photo released from night of shooting

[dolphinocean]

Somehere keep railing on how no Z blood was found on TM's hands.

The explanation is simple, no blood or DNA test was done on TM's hands, just fingernail scrapings.

If there was no blood or DNA to be found or detected then why test for something that was not there?

 

[spanky]

I've seen worst nose bleed that is spontaneous (not caused by injury). People see worst in contact sports, wrestling, MMA and boxing. Zimmerman's nose bleed is just chicken sh-boo-boo.

Then maybe you could suggest to the pross that they call you as an expert nose blood witness and you can testify as to all your observations at MMA wrestling?

My take on why the prosecutor only released the B&W photocopy of the color photo: to prevent the predictable propensity of the imminent hyperbolic response coming from Zimmerman's supporters to blow the minor nose bleed injury completely out of proportion to make Trayvon the brutal aggressor and Zimmerman the helpless innocent victim. And thus contaminating the jury pool even further down in favor of Zimmerman.

That's not their job. Your saying the pross released an obviously manipulated photo (B&W) on order NOT to contaminate the jury pool. Do you know how absurd that sounds? The fact is they released a manipulated photo to contaminate the jury pool in their favor.

Take a look at all the responses from Yahoo news to all the main stream media news report. The way most of Zimmerman's supporters reacted you'd think this poor guy was brutally pummated into a pulp beyond any recognition. At least that was the impression I got when hearing the news reported by the radio talk show.

Seems to me all the news in the first couple of weeks was aimed at hanging Zimm before he got a fair trial. But that just shows how 2 different people can arrive a 2 opposite conclusions from the same evidence.

Also, the prosecutors were given what they were given by the sloppy job of SPD. What else can they do? Accuse SPD of sloppy or mischievous job before the jury and throw all their evidence and their case under the bus? I don't know how they're going to handle it, but the damage done by the SPD surely put a big dent into this case. Given the damaged and contaminated evidence besides those that the SPD failed to collect or looked into and the widely divided jury pools who have essentially made their minds up without waver, Zimmerman may well walks.

Please list the contaminated/failed to collect evidence. Besides the blood/dna evidence from TM's hands that so many of you are claiming as proof that TM didn't hit Z.

 

[spanky]

If there was no blood or DNA to be found or detected then why test for something that was not there?

Uhhh, because you don't know it's not there until you test? Just a guess...but you know, I'm stoopid.

 

[spanky]

Like everyone else here, we are not privy to all the facts. There may be evidence that he pursued TM after being told not to that has been uncovered. That's my point, it is all wild speculation until all the facts come out to the public during the trial.

So you're saying we should consider an alternative for which there is absolutely no facts in evidence?

Then you imply we shouldn't engage in wild speculation?

 

[Catawba]

So you're saying we should consider an alternative for which there is absolutely no facts in evidence?

.....that you know of. That's my point.

Then you imply we shouldn't engage in wild speculation?

Speculate wildly to your hearts content my friend, just keep in mind that is all it is.

 

[spanky]

.....that you know of. That's my point.



Speculate wildly to your hearts content my friend, just keep in mind that is all it is.

Which is exactly what I do as I read your posts.

 

[Caine]

Nobody is claiming "Tennessee = Florida". Corrupt cops are corrupt and the same everywhere you go.

What I am saying is that it is desperate for you, someone living in Tennessee and would have no reason to know JACK **** about a small town like Sanford, Could possibly have any knowledge of Sanford except for "OMG THEY DON'T AGREE WITH MY SIDE SO THEY MUST BE CORRUPT"!!! EVIL!!111!!113231!!!!!111!!!!!!

Get over yourself. Its pathetic to believe that you know Sanford Police Department top to bottom and can make the claim that they are corrupt just because they don't agree with your view on this case. Which they investigated, and you've only attempted to sway people with pictures of different bloody noses.

HINT: I've had a bloody nose that didn't run all the ****ing way down my goddamned chin too.... I guess I faked it.

 

[celticwar17]

It's my opinion based on my experience dealing with open wounds and dealing with spontaneous nose bleeding. Nose bleeding comes fast and can occur spontaneously. When it drips it goes down fast and thus makes a solid flowing line or lines with the tip end roundly tapered as seen here:

View attachment 67138921
Source: nose bleed - Bing Images


View attachment 67138922
Source:nose bleed - Bing Images




View attachment 67138923
Source: FESSDRRAJINI: EPISTAXIS(BLEEDING FROM THE NOSE)





BUT NOT a wide and broadly spread out thin film of red blood stains that just stopped short and squarely on the border of the lower lip as seen in Zimmerman's picture below. Zimmerman's nose bleed looks weird and out of natural order. Look at the blood stain on his lower lip.
　
View attachment 67138924
　
Source: Photo appears to show Zimmerman bleeding after Trayvon Martin killing - CNN.com
　
　
Notice the blood stain span out so broad and evenly spread out like a laying of film, especially the lower lip. It's not even consistent with dripping or flowing down with gravity. Nose bleeding flow and drip but Zimmerman's didn't. Zimmerman's looked more like somebody tried to paint it or brush it on him. Go figure.

This is just wrong, sure that is what happends most the time... but I have had nose bleeds behave much differently...

 

[dolphinocean]

What I am saying is that it is desperate for you, someone living in Tennessee and would have no reason to know JACK **** about a small town like Sanford, Could possibly have any knowledge of Sanford except for "OMG THEY DON'T AGREE WITH MY SIDE SO THEY MUST BE CORRUPT"!!! EVIL!!111!!113231!!!!!111!!!!!!

Get over yourself. Its pathetic to believe that you know Sanford Police Department top to bottom and can make the claim that they are corrupt just because they don't agree with your view on this case. Which they investigated, and you've only attempted to sway people with pictures of different bloody noses.

HINT: I've had a bloody nose that didn't run all the ****ing way down my goddamned chin too.... I guess I faked it.

SPD had a history of corruption. The latest was just a few months prior to Zimmerman's case. This case is so corrupted that it's stench smells to high heaven. Only people who are in and with the stench will smell it. You don't have to have nose bleed that drip all the way to the chin or neck or chest. But, with a broken nose plus being repeatedly pummeled on the face and with someone's hand pressing hard to smother you, there's no way you would have no smear but a weird looking block like looking blood stain that looked like a smack on job. I mean even the swollen nose looked so artificial.

 

[dolphinocean]

Then maybe you could suggest to the pross that they call you as an expert nose blood witness and you can testify as to all your observations at MMA wrestling?



That's not their job. Your saying the pross released an obviously manipulated photo (B&W) on order NOT to contaminate the jury pool. Do you know how absurd that sounds? The fact is they released a manipulated photo to contaminate the jury pool in their favor.



Seems to me all the news in the first couple of weeks was aimed at hanging Zimm before he got a fair trial. But that just shows how 2 different people can arrive a 2 opposite conclusions from the same evidence.



Please list the contaminated/failed to collect evidence. Besides the blood/dna evidence from TM's hands that so many of you are claiming as proof that TM didn't hit Z.

Saying I've seen worst nose bleed that is spontaneous as compared to what Zimmerman is showing after being brutally pummeled somehow ilicit a response from you about me suggesting to the prosecutor to call me as an expert? How does that come about? It doesn't make any sense.
　

Tell me, do you not find the following pictures of face injuries from MMA/boxing sports looking much worst than Zimmerman's so-called near death brutal beating?


UFC 131 Results: Shane Carwin's Face after Junior dos Santos Bloodied It | Bleacher Report


The 10 Worst MMA Post-Fight Faces of 2011 | Bleacher Report


'The Artist' KJ Noons has no qualms painting another masterpiece on Nick Diaz's face - MMAmania.com


Or do you still think Zimmerman's looked much worst? Or do you require an expert to tell you what to think?
　

The prosecutor had to released their evidence by Florida law. They didn't take the picture nor manipulated the picture. The SPD did. They simply made a B&W photocopy for release and kept the orignal submitted by SPD in their evidence file. That's not releasing a manipulated photo to contaminate the jury pool in their favor.

　
It may seem to you that all the news in the first couple of weeks was aimed at hanging Zimm before he got a fair trial. But that was your wrong take of what actually occurred. What actually happened was that Zimmerman wasn't arrested for weeks and the police chief was siding with Zimmerman's claim of SYGL. He then said all evidence were consistent with Zimmerman's account of self-defense. People knew it wasn't true.Thus the outcry for arrest and justice.

　
Here's the list of just some of the SPD blunders:
　

1. Failure to secure Zimmer's vehicle and ascertain where it was parked.

　
2. Failure to control the crime scene. Thus allowing witnesses to interact with Zimmerman and containminated witnesses' integrity. Remember Zimmerman's buddy wrote a book telling us he went to the crime scene and spoke briefly with an officer he knew and was assured it was a clean case, meaning the shooting was self-defence?
　

3. Failure to take pictures of Zimmerman's head front and back, clothed body front and back, hands and shoes front and back with proper digital camera or video camera at the crime scene.

　
4. Failure to require Zimmerman to go to the hospital ER for evaluation and documentation of injuries. If he was under arrest, he could not refuse.

　
5. Failure to locate blood evidence on the concrete pathway where Zimmerman claimed his head was smashed into it by Trayvon. Even if the rain had washed the blood away, application of luminol forescent technique could still pin point where the blood was if it was previously stained.


These are just a few.

 

[Caine]

SPD had a history of corruption. The latest was just a few months prior to Zimmerman's case. This case is so corrupted that it's stench smells to high heaven. Only people who are in and with the stench will smell it. You don't have to have nose bleed that drip all the way to the chin or neck or chest. But, with a broken nose plus being repeatedly pummeled on the face and with someone's hand pressing hard to smother you, there's no way you would have no smear but a weird looking block like looking blood stain that looked like a smack on job. I mean even the swollen nose looked so artificial.

Seriously..... You need to take whatever psycho problems you have and apply them elsewhere. You aren't getting anywhere in this conversation by making stuff up.

 

[dolphinocean]

Uhhh, because you don't know it's not there until you test? Just a guess...but you know, I'm stoopid.

Do you not think when you response?

 

[dolphinocean]

This is just wrong, sure that is what happends most the time... but I have had nose bleeds behave much differently...

Yeah, Zimmerman is always so different and extraordinary and defies the norm in every which way.

 

[dolphinocean]

Seriously..... You need to take whatever psycho problems you have and apply them elsewhere. You aren't getting anywhere in this conversation by making stuff up.

I don't need to. You just have to examine yourself.

 

[Grim17]

Yeah, Zimmerman is always so different and extraordinary and defies the norm in every which way.

With all the software available to detect a doctored image, and all the digital imaging experts around these days, I expect if that photo is a fake, we probably would have heard about it by now... Don't you think?

It's funny how people who's beliefs are only justified if things are out of the ordinary, always manage to find those out of the ordinary things... It's amazing how many things a person can find when common sense is taken out of the equation.

 

[ric27]

SPD had a history of corruption. The latest was just a few months prior to Zimmerman's case. This case is so corrupted that it's stench smells to high heaven. Only people who are in and with the stench will smell it. You don't have to have nose bleed that drip all the way to the chin or neck or chest. But, with a broken nose plus being repeatedly pummeled on the face and with someone's hand pressing hard to smother you, there's no way you would have no smear but a weird looking block like looking blood stain that looked like a smack on job. I mean even the swollen nose looked so artificial.

I'm sorry....but there's no evil genius plot here. You gotta stop trying to remake what's already perfectly rational into something less rational that better fits your agenda.

 

[spanky]

Saying I've seen worst nose bleed that is spontaneous as compared to what Zimmerman is showing after being brutally pummeled somehow ilicit a response from you about me suggesting to the prosecutor to call me as an expert? How does that come about? It doesn't make any sense.
　

Tell me, do you not find the following pictures of face injuries from MMA/boxing sports looking much worst than Zimmerman's so-called near death brutal beating?


UFC 131 Results: Shane Carwin's Face after Junior dos Santos Bloodied It | Bleacher Report


The 10 Worst MMA Post-Fight Faces of 2011 | Bleacher Report


'The Artist' KJ Noons has no qualms painting another masterpiece on Nick Diaz's face - MMAmania.com


Or do you still think Zimmerman's looked much worst? Or do you require an expert to tell you what to think?
　

The prosecutor had to released their evidence by Florida law. They didn't take the picture nor manipulated the picture. The SPD did. They simply made a B&W photocopy for release and kept the orignal submitted by SPD in their evidence file. That's not releasing a manipulated photo to contaminate the jury pool in their favor.

　
It may seem to you that all the news in the first couple of weeks was aimed at hanging Zimm before he got a fair trial. But that was your wrong take of what actually occurred. What actually happened was that Zimmerman wasn't arrested for weeks and the police chief was siding with Zimmerman's claim of SYGL. He then said all evidence were consistent with Zimmerman's account of self-defense. People knew it wasn't true.Thus the outcry for arrest and justice.

　
Here's the list of just some of the SPD blunders:
　

1. Failure to secure Zimmer's vehicle and ascertain where it was parked.

　
2. Failure to control the crime scene. Thus allowing witnesses to interact with Zimmerman and containminated witnesses' integrity. Remember Zimmerman's buddy wrote a book telling us he went to the crime scene and spoke briefly with an officer he knew and was assured it was a clean case, meaning the shooting was self-defence?
　

3. Failure to take pictures of Zimmerman's head front and back, clothed body front and back, hands and shoes front and back with proper digital camera or video camera at the crime scene.

　
4. Failure to require Zimmerman to go to the hospital ER for evaluation and documentation of injuries. If he was under arrest, he could not refuse.

　
5. Failure to locate blood evidence on the concrete pathway where Zimmerman claimed his head was smashed into it by Trayvon. Even if the rain had washed the blood away, application of luminol forescent technique could still pin point where the blood was if it was previously stained.


These are just a few.

Fair enough. Here are some questions I have regarding them, not knowing police procedures.

1. Agreed. I'm not sure how the location of the vehicle changes anything, but it should have been secured and searched.

2. From anything I've seen the only interaction Zimm had with witnesses was before the police arrived and everything said is in the record of witness statements.

3. As for the Ooster guy, him talking with a friend cop he knew at the scene after arriving MUCH later doesn't change anything and if the cop gave him his opinion based on what was known at the time, well that doesn't change anything either.

Zimm was immediately taken into custody and with the exception of being attended to by paramedics I haven't seen or read that he interacted with anyone but police after that. I believe he was then taken to the police station where photos were taken. Again, I don't know it if police procedure is to take such photos immediately at the scene, but considering the cop used his cell phone and wasn't equipped with proper camera equipment to do so i'm going to guess no. We also don't know when the evidence gathering team arrived, before or after Zimm was taken away.

4. The paramedics documented Zimms injuries and also noted he didn't seem to be suffering from any more serious injuries other then his nose and back of his head. I'm not sure if it's required to send someone to the hospital in this instance when they refuse. Also, was Zimm under arrest? I'm not sure if there is a difference to arrest and "taken into custody".

5. From my understanding of the reports, the police weren't aware of the sidewalk issue until Zimm made a statement later at the police station, maybe the next day during the walk through. I think the rain would have washed any evidence away.

Also note there is no indication any investigation was done for blood evidence anwhere else on the ground and considering TM was initially laying face down, there should have been blood on the grass.

 

[ric27]

Tell me, do you not find the following pictures of face injuries from MMA/boxing sports looking much worst than Zimmerman's so-called near death brutal beating?

To be justified in using deadly force, Z had to be in fear when he shot M. The point in time is CRITICAL by which Z's fear/use of deadly force is measured.

The so called brutal beating does not need to happen.... The fear Z anticipated, need not be real, Z just had to believe it was real, and Z's belief had to be reasonable.

This is what you fail to understand

 

[Grim17]

To be justified in using deadly force, Z had to be in fear when he shot M. The point in time is CRITICAL by which Z's fear/use of deadly force is measured.

The so called brutal beating does not need to happen.... The fear Z anticipated, need not be real, Z just had to believe it was real, and Z's belief had to be reasonable.

This is what you fail to understand

His screams for help seem to confirm just how real it was to him.

 

[ric27]

His screams for help seem to confirm just how real it was to him.

The screams certainly adds gravy for Z's defense

It's a plus

 

[Excon]

No, but stalking someone with a gun, when ordered not to follow, may be considered instigating. Enjoy your speculation of what happened and what the verdict will be.

Your narrative is way off and baseless.

He did not stalk Trayvon.
And he was not "ordered not to follow".

Keeping an eye on a suspicious person until the police you called arrive, is not stalking in any way shape or form.

Secondly, in the City Managers Official release it was pointed out that the Communication Call-Taker's statement of; "We don't need you to do that.", was only a suggestion. A suggestion that Zimmerman was under no obligation to follow. Even though he apparently did follow the suggestion.

Nor does a Communication Call-Taker have any authority over the situation. Even if they were a Police Officer they have no authority to tell/order anything. They are not on site and have no operational control. To give the Communication Call-Takers any authority would open up the Police and City to unneeded liability.

So you believe the penalty for punching some one in nose should be death? We come from two different worlds you and I.

I surely don't believe that. But that isn't all Trayvon did. You seem to be ignoring the fact that he continued his attack, even jumping on a downed Zimmerman. That clearly changes the game.

 

[Excon]

harrasmaent laws, they require many many days of following to kick in. )

Although the facts of this case do not fit any known definition (legal or otherwise), of stalking or harassment, your above statement isn't accurate.

Just saying.

---

It's my opinion based on my experience dealing with open wounds and dealing with spontaneous nose bleeding. Nose bleeding comes fast and can occur spontaneously. When it drips it goes down fast and thus makes a solid flowing line or lines with the tip end roundly tapered as seen here:




BUT NOT a wide and broadly spread out thin film of red blood stains that just stopped short and squarely on the border of the lower lip as seen in Zimmerman's picture below. Zimmerman's nose bleed looks weird and out of natural order. Look at the blood stain on his lower lip.
　

　
Notice the blood stain span out so broad and evenly spread out like a laying of film, especially the lower lip. It's not even consistent with dripping or flowing down with gravity. Nose bleeding flow and drip but Zimmerman's didn't. Zimmerman's looked more like somebody tried to paint it or brush it on him. Go figure.

Really dolphinocean? This **** again? We have already been through this.

Zimmerman was on his back. The blood would have been going down his throat until he was able to get into an up-right position.
And everything happened at a very fast pace.
He got on top of Trayvon immediately after shooting him and then stood up. It probably just started to trickle out as he was getting up and off Trayvon.

And then the Officer was immediately on scene. Took him into custody and sat him in the car.

 

[JackFrost]

Keeping an eye on a suspicious person until the police you called arrive, is not stalking in any way shape or form.

So you are stating Zimmerman was lying when he said he was just looking for an address? He had to follow Martin to keep an eye on him...lying is lying

 

[ric27]

Ad homs:lol:

This coming from a person with baseless accusations that the pic was photo shopped.

ilol

 

[JackFrost]

This coming from a person with baseless accusations that the pic was photo shopped.

ilol

And yet another ad hom. That all you got:lol: