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Liberals: The True Minority

SouthernDemocrat said:
Kids know about contraceptives. However, access to them is a different story. Moreover, they may know how to put on a condom, but I doubt that most inner city girls know about all the different contraceptive options available, much less have real access to them.

The problem to correcting that is that the Religious Right, has made sure that teaching anything other than pure abstinence in sex education classes and or providing access to contraceptives or teaching about them disqualifies schools from receiving any federal funding for sex ed.

As to your other assertions, frankly you are living in a dream world. They remind me of the old joke: “Vote Republican, it’s easier than thinking”. I did some CASA volunteer work back when I was single. We don’t have the funding or the social infrastructure to start taking away kids from lazy parents even if we wanted to. To take a child away from its parents, you have to prove the parents to be completely unfit to parent that child. Reasons for this would be things like imprisonment, chronic and sustained drug addiction, physical or sexual abuse of the child, or the parents lacking the mental capabilities to take care of the child. Laziness alone simply does not qualify.

So what are you going to do then, just start taking kids away from lazy sit on their *** parents? The problems in doing so are numerous. For one, the costs would far exceed the costs of welfare. Two, the psychological damage inflicted children who are taken away from their parents and placed as wards of the state are very severe. Three, there are not nearly enough foster families to house them all. Four, they would be virtually impossible to adopt out. Few people are looking to adopt entire families of inner city children. Five, it only makes the problem worse, children who are taken from their parents are statistically much more likely to use drugs or become pregnant at an early age. Finally, many of these children are not with their birth parents anyway, but rather their grandparents and in some cases even great-grandparents are stuck raising them.

Deadbeat parents drawing welfare pisses me off as much as the next guy, but unfortunately welfare is a necessary evil. The only alternative would be all the children of those deadbeat parents walking the streets on the brink of starvation looking for handouts like some scene out of Sub-Saharan Africa or something.

It seems to me that the better option is to pragmatically attack the causes of poverty. Less poverty = Less welfare. Less unintended pregnancies = Less poverty = Less welfare = Lower crime = Better schools = More Economic Opportunity = Less unintended pregnancies and the cycle continues.

We have tried simply locking people up. Being that we now have the highest incarceration rate on earth, it obviously doesn’t work. We have tried just ignoring the problem, that doesn’t work either. Prior to all these social programs, the poverty rate was well over 30%, since the 60s, it has never been above 13% or so. Obviously, those social programs have had some success. At this point, the answer is attacking the causes of poverty, not the safety net.

“Vote Republican, it’s easier than thinking”.:roll:

This is your f**king answer for everything, I'm done trying to have an intelligent discussion with you sir, you are an arrogant prick. You obviously have no idea how the world works, or how welfare has destroyed the very fabric of our nation. Goldwater had it right, and it was the liberals that started to call him a racist, among other things, for his efforts. This country has become what he feared most, people don't want a hand up, they want a hand out, and he could see this reality, while liberals trashed him for speaking the truth. Now you arrogant pricks have the nerve to try and talk like he is in your camp today, or would be, oh brother, the nerve, more crust then a f**king pie factory.:roll:

You were the last person on the left I thought worth debating here, I guess I don't need to come here anymore.
 
Deegan said:
“Vote Republican, it’s easier than thinking”.:roll:

This is your f**king answer for everything, I'm done trying to have an intelligent discussion with you sir, you are an arrogant prick. You obviously have no idea how the world works, or how welfare has destroyed the very fabric of our nation. Goldwater had it right, and it was the liberals that started to call him a racist, among other things, for his efforts. This country has become what he feared most, people don't want a hand up, they want a hand out, and he could see this reality, while liberals trashed him for speaking the truth. Now you arrogant pricks have the nerve to try and talk like he is in your camp today, or would be, oh brother, the nerve, more crust then a f**king pie factory.:roll:

You were the last person on the left I thought worth debating here, I guess I don't need to come here anymore.

Deegan, that was a joke. The fact is, you have not offered up anything really for debate. You claim that welfare has destroyed this nation.

How?

Did the poverty rate all of a sudden jump when the welfare program start? No, in fact, it is about 11% right now. Prior to welfare and social programs, it was as high as 30%.

Does welfare make people want to have sex outside of marriage? Of course not, the fact that sex is fun makes people want to have sex outside of marriage.

Does welfare make people want to have sex without using contraceptives? No, I think we can logically chock that up to ignorance.

Were minorities doing better prior to welfare? No, back then they pretty much all lived in sharecropper shacks lacking even so much as a floor on the other side of the tracks.

It seems to me like I made a case for why we cant just take kids away from lazy parents, and you got mad about the case I made.

By the way, I grew up poor, my mother worked two jobs to support us and we never took a dime of welfare. I know how the world works, it just not as simple and as black and white as you seem to want it to be.
 
jallman said:
So basically, you made an egregious claim that NAMBLA was invited to the gay pride parades, and then when I called you to task, you found my need for you to back up your claim to be...what was the word...oh yeah, stupid. How much more trifling can you be...


Show me where I said anyone was invited to any gay pride parade. :liar2

It's pretty bad when you have to start making stuff up like this. And either way, I DID prove that NAMBLA was distinctly welcomed by gay pride marchers.
 
SouthernDemocrat said:
1) Then why being that Republicans have held congress for 12 years, and the Whitehouse for 6, have you been unable to enact zero of the Social Conservative Agenda?

2) the two presidents in the last 100 years that made the largest impact upon the United States in terms of getting their agenda enacted was FDR and LBJ. Virtually the entire public sector, and largely our society is their doing. As far as lasting Republican Accomplishments, you have Eisenhower and the Interstate Highway System, Nixon and the EPA and opening up China, and Reagan and ending the Cold War. Those are all certainly no small accomplishment. Especially on the part of Reagan. However, virtually every other aspect of government is the work of Liberals and Progressives. Weekends off, Medicare, Social Security, Child Labor Laws, Worker Protections, The Minimum Wage, National Parks, National Forests, Clean Air, Clean Water, Civil Rights, The Marshall Plan, Women's Sufferage, Public Radio and Television.... the list goes on and on. Our entire society is built upon the work of those liberals and progressives you love to hate. Hell, even Ronald Reagan's favorite President and Childhood Hero was none other than FDR, probably the most liberal president in the history of the United States.

1) I believe conservatives HAVE enacted numerous core parts of their agenda.

2) Several of these examples are negatives, several of them are not products of liberals, and several of them you are just plain wrong about.

Example:

Eisenhower (R) integrated the schools. George Wallace (D) said, "segregation now, segregation forever," and refused to cooperate until the National Guard forced him to.

There are tons of holes like this in your exhaustive (if not panicked) spin job here.
 
I still have yet to see any liberal here even attempt to confront the ugly indications of McCain-Feingold or of liberal book, radio sales always going down the toilet (mentioned in the intro).
 
aquapub said:
1) I believe conservatives HAVE enacted numerous core parts of their agenda.

2) Several of these examples are negatives, several of them are not products of liberals, and several of them you are just plain wrong about.

Example:

Eisenhower (R) integrated the schools. George Wallace (D) said, "segregation now, segregation forever," and refused to cooperate until the National Guard forced him to.

There are tons of holes like this in your exhaustive (if not panicked) spin job here.

History lesson. George Wallace was a very conservative Democrat. Eisenhower was a liberal Republican. You seem to think that party affiliation alone determines ideology. If Eisenhower, Nixon, or for that matter even Goldwater were around today, they would be some of the most liberal members of the Republican party, more liberal than even some Democrats.

The fact is, every time a conservative today even attempts to touch Social Security, Medicare, Farm Subsidies, or really any social program at all, they pay dearly at the polls. If this is such a conservative nation, then why is that the case?
 
aquapub said:
I still have yet to see any liberal here even attempt to confront the ugly indications of McCain-Feingold or of liberal book, radio sales always going down the toilet (mentioned in the intro).

Uh, your liberal book argument as absurd as it is has already been throughly debunked by everyone in your thread devoted to it. I don't even think you had a conservative on here agree with it.

As to radio, what about NPR and its 30 million listeners?

Aquapub, you seem like an intelligent individual but your intelligence is quite under utilized do to your irrational and pathological hatred of liberals. Basically, you are a like a Klansman, where liberals are your Black or Jew. Its unfortunate, it really is.
 
SouthernDemocrat said:
1) Uh, your liberal book argument as absurd as it is has already been throughly debunked by everyone in your thread devoted to it. I don't even think you had a conservative on here agree with it.

2) As to radio, what about NPR and its 30 million listeners?

3) Aquapub, you seem like an intelligent individual but your intelligence is quite under utilized do to your irrational and pathological hatred of liberals.

4) Basically, you are a like a Klansman, where liberals are your Black or Jew. Its unfortunate, it really is.

1) "Debunked" is not the right word for how liberals respond to the fact that liberal books nearly always bomb while conservative books always sell like hot cakes...I believe the correct wording is "denial." :notlook:

2) 650 million Americans, 30 million is well within the liberal fringe.

3) I love how "presenting evidence liberals can't refute," when translated into liberal means, "irrational and pathological hatred of liberals." Yawn. :roll:

4) Bigot: a conservative winning an argument with a liberal. :lol:
 
SouthernDemocrat said:
History lesson. George Wallace was a very conservative Democrat.

1) Yes, and you might remember this the next time you're trying to debunk the reality that America is right of center by claiming Congress has had so many Democrats over the last 60 years or by claiming that Democrats have more registered voters....

The South is filled with Zell Miller conservative Democrats who never vote for Democrats. THAT'S what enables you to perpetuate the false notion that liberals are anything but a fringe minority who have nothing in common with Middle America.

2) And spin it how you want, but it was Republicans who freed the slaves, Republicans who integrated the schools, and it is Democrats who have the only Klansman in a public office-Robert Byrd.

SouthernDemocrat said:
The fact is, every time a conservative today even attempts to touch Social Security, Medicare, Farm Subsidies, or really any social program at all, they pay dearly at the polls. If this is such a conservative nation, then why is that the case?

Tell me again how well the public responded to the left's health care initiative in the 1990s.

And like I said, when the public gets a fair and honest version of the facts, they almost always side with conservatives. Ask the average American if they think liberals are right to help illegal aliens drain Social Security. :roll:
 
With all that has gone wrong for conservatives lately...

...are liberals poised to make historic gains? Nope.
...are liberals poised to make moderate gains? No way.

With all that has gone wrong for conservatives lately, liberals are struggling to gain a razor thin majority. This is why we call it a dying party.

History tells us Democrats should have been in a position of overwhelming dominance in Congress for 6 years now. It is unprecedented for a party to sustain such thorough, consistent rejection from the people as Democrats have.
 
Iriemon said:
Democratic candidates are typically financially supported by populist, grass-roots movements of a broad section of society giving small amounts of money.

I'd like to see you attempt to prove this.
 
aquapub said:
2) 650 million Americans, 30 million is well within the liberal fringe.

The CIA World Factbook puts U.S. population at 298 million as of July 2006.

No big deal, just getting the numbers right :)
 
This is a funny thread.

Look at the political scene over the last 80 years. Are government actions becoming more liberal, or less liberal?

The answer is clear. both the democratic party and the republican party keeps moving further and further left.

Real Conservatives are the true minority.
 
Voidwar said:
I'd like to see you attempt to prove this.

See post #21.
 
Iriemon said:
See post #21.


I know liberals have an aversion to facts and evidence, but post #21 (on page 2) doesn't contain any facts or evidence, just your re-assurances that you're right and you moronically portraying evidence I presented from a non-partisan campaign finance tracking group as me using myself as a source.

:ws

You don't seem very good at this debating thing, so I will show you how to present evidence and facts again:

http://www.debatepolitics.com/gover...rats-rich.html?highlight=democrats+favor+rich

This time you might want to actually try reading. ;)
 
aquapub said:
I know liberals have an aversion to facts and evidence, but post #21 (on page 2) doesn't contain any facts or evidence, just your re-assurances that you're right and you moronically portraying evidence I presented from a non-partisan campaign finance tracking group as me using myself as a source.

:ws

You don't seem very good at this debating thing, so I will show you how to present evidence and facts again:

http://www.debatepolitics.com/gover...rats-rich.html?highlight=democrats+favor+rich

This time you might want to actually try reading. ;)

Since when did quoting referencing yourself become an acceptable source? You don't seem very good at this debating thing...
 
jallman said:
Since when did quoting referencing yourself become an acceptable source? You don't seem very good at this debating thing...

LMFAO! I couldn't make this stuff up! "I'll show you how to present evidence and facts again" hehehheheh
 
Iriemon said:
LMFAO! I couldn't make this stuff up! "I'll show you how to present evidence and facts again" hehehheheh
I wonder what aqua is doing tonight?
 
jfuh said:
I wonder what aqua is doing tonight?

Yea, he was so sure of himself, I was positive he would show up tonight and gloat...... Hmmmm, Navy Pride seems to be MIA as well.:rofl
 
danarhea said:
Yea, he was so sure of himself, I was positive he would show up tonight and gloat...... Hmmmm, Navy Pride seems to be MIA as well.:rofl
Speaking of NP, He's going to need to change his avatar to one of my choice now hehehehe, I'll wait till it's "official".

I'm very glad, the parasitic neocons and bushnevicks have been :beatand voted out. This is a terrrific victory for Americans and, ppl all over. Christmas came early this year:party:2party:
 
Hey aquapub! Liberals in the minority you say?????????? Think again.

The people have spoken, looks like you are wrong.:lol:
 
Indy said:
Aquapub, I totally agree. Liberals are in the minority. Unfortunately for you though conservatives are ALSO in the minority. The truth of the matter is that the MAJORITY consists of moderates.

Nope...conservatives are the MAJORITY. What happened Tuesday was not a rejection of conservativism, it was a rejection of republican party faux conservatism. The appeal of real conservatism was demonstrated in 1994 when real conservatives took over congress. Since then, republicans have relied on folks thinking, wrongly, that they (republicans) were still the folks that swept in 1994. If and when republicans get back to real conservatism, they will return to power, and not until then.

If you think conservatism is dead, look at the backstory in the Tues elections. Dems won seats, but look at issues that were voted on:

Gay marriage...it was on the ballot in 8 states...7 of them rejected gay marriage...a decidedly conservative issue.

Eminant domain...it was on the ballot in 9 states, and all 9 voted overwhelmingly to put strict restrictions on it by WIDE margins.

These, and other, examples show that conservatism was embraced, not rejected...it was the phony conservatism of the current republican party that was rejected.

BubbaBob
 
BubbaBob said:
Gay marriage...it was on the ballot in 8 states...7 of them rejected gay marriage...a decidedly conservative issue.

In the depraved thought processes of a Liberal, Gay marriage or "civil unions" becomes necessary to guarantee sexual freedom and eliminate any moral consequence. With the dicission in these states on gay arriage I would say Consevitism is not dead, it is alive and well. Liberals are nothing more and nothing less than Communists, Socialists and Dictators.
 
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