Let them in!

[Old Trapper]

So the real reason they are leaving their country is not to avoid persecution because they leave their children behind. Its to expedite their visa process.

So, with your limited knowledge of the situation you are saying they are not being threatened with death, violence, etc., not even in the murder capital of the world, Hondurus? It is all a scheme to get their children here.

Where do the mental midgets come up with crap like that.

Try to educate yourself:

https://www.wola.org/analysis/fact-sheet-united-states-immigration-central-american-asylum-seekers/

 

[jdog21]

So, with your limited knowledge of the situation you are saying they are not being threatened with death, violence, etc., not even in the murder capital of the world, Hondurus? It is all a scheme to get their children here.

Where do the mental midgets come up with crap like that.

Try to educate yourself:

https://www.wola.org/analysis/fact-sheet-united-states-immigration-central-american-asylum-seekers/

Then why leave their children behind to be murdered?

 

[itsforthekids]

We agreed to the International Law as signatories (do you know what that means?), and then we passed our own law based on the International Law. In your world, and that of Trumpkins everywhere, the law means nothing unless you want it to.

I do know that no other nation have the right to tell American's who we should take in. Isn't it the progressive mantra that "an unjust law shouldn't be followed"?

 

[Captain Adverse]

You do NOT need a social security number to file Federal taxes. The IRS will provide you with an ITIN number which has the same effect as a S/S number. Do remember that of the billions that are paid in taxes each year by undocumented residents, they will never be able to earn certain benefits like social security and Medicare.

Really?

[T]he following people are lawfully in the country and must pay taxes but may not be eligible for a SSN and may obtain an ITIN:

A non-resident foreign national who owns or invests in a U.S. business and receives taxable income from that U.S. business, but lives in another country.

A foreign national student who qualifies as a resident of the United States (based on days present in the United States).

A dependent or spouse of a U.S. citizen or lawful permanent resident.

A dependent or spouse of a foreign national on a temporary visa.

https://www.americanimmigrationcoun...out-individual-tax-identification-number-itin

There were an estimated 11 million illegal aliens in the USA as of 2017. 5 facts about illegal immigration in the U.S. | Pew Research Center

As of 2013 there were over 800,000 foreign students in the USA, and that number is growing. https://www.usnews.com/education/be...cord-number-of-international-college-students

There was over $2.9 trillion in foreign direct investments in the USA between 2004-2014 alone. https://ofii.org/sites/default/files/Foreign Direct Investment in the United States 2016 Report.pdf

1 in 5 married households had a foreign-born spouse's per the last Census and 39% were non-citizens. https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation/2013/09/06/stateline-marriages-foreign-spouse/2775271/

There were 4.35 million people who paid over 13.7 billion in net taxes using an ITIN. https://www.americanimmigrationcoun...out-individual-tax-identification-number-itin

Even if all 4.3 million people using an ITIN were "illegals" that leaves 7 Million who did NOT use and ITIN and thus DID NOT pay income taxes.

But that 4.3 million number shrinks when you deduct students, married spouses, dependents, and foreign investors...to the tune of another million or so (at least).

So say 3.3 million illegals use ITIN's to "pay taxes," that still leaves 8 million who don't. MOST don't pay income taxes. Game over. :coffeepap:

 

[Old Trapper]

Then why leave their children behind to be murdered?

You obviously have not watched the news, and seen all of the children. Then too, would you drag your child over a thousand miles with no food, no water, and not knowing what the lying coward at the other end was going to do? Well, since right wingers could not care less about children you probably would.

 

[Old Trapper]

I do know that no other nation have the right to tell American's who we should take in. Isn't it the progressive mantra that "an unjust law shouldn't be followed"?

That was the mantra of James Madison in Marbury v Madison, and several other cases. However, is that going to be your pathetic excuse for ignoring the law? I thought all of you hypocrites on the right were whining consistently about Obama not following the law. Now you want to justify your god for not doing so?

And no one is telling the US who to take in. It is the law passed by the legislative body. Change it if you don't like it. Why not read the Refugee Act of 1980?

 

[JMR]

No, they all do not. :no:

I keep hearing this false claim, when the fact is you are referencing sales taxes, not income taxes. Everyone who buys something over-the-counter is subject to sales taxes, whether citizen or non-citizen.

However, income taxes require a valid social security number and direct deductions from one's payroll. Many illegals work under-the-table, and thus no income taxes. Other's use false ID, but still work at the lower income jobs where they pay minimal income tax which is almost entirely refundable. Some using this system even qualify for Earned Income Tax Credit...at least until they get caught. Meanwhile, when they use stolen ID those earnings are erroneously credited to American citizens, which increase THEIR taxes burden, having been lifted into a higher tax bracket than their actual wages would require.


Meanwhile don't shrug off Identity Theft. It is still a crime, and having been the victim of it myself I am here to tell you it has significant effects on the victims.



Dang it, you keep beating me to the punch!

I'm not addressing the argument of whether or not these people should be allowed in. What I do question is the accuracy of the statement that illegal immigrants use stolen ID's and raise the tax burden of unsuspecting Americans. How does that work? Do I receive a W-2 from an employer I have never heard of? The IRS has reported income for me, and I don't examine it? I've never seen this discussed before, and it truly doesn't make any sense to me.

 

[Captain Adverse]

I'm not addressing the argument of whether or not these people should be allowed in. What I do question is the accuracy of the statement that illegal immigrants use stolen ID's and raise the tax burden of unsuspecting Americans. How does that work? Do I receive a W-2 from an employer I have never heard of? The IRS has reported income for me, and I don't examine it? I've never seen this discussed before, and it truly doesn't make any sense to me.

Here's some info:

An identity thief may use your Social Security number to get a tax refund or a job. Contact the IRS if they send you a notice saying their records show:

a. you were paid by an employer you don't know

b. more than one tax return was filed using your Social Security number.

If someone uses your SSN to get a job, the employer may report that person’s income to the IRS using your SSN. When you file your tax return, you won’t include those earnings. IRS records will show you failed to report all your income. The agency will send you a notice or letter saying you got wages but didn’t report them. The IRS doesn’t know those wages were reported by an employer you don’t know.

https://www.consumer.ftc.gov/articles/0008-tax-related-identity-theft

Happens enough to warrant such a warning.

 

[jdog21]

You obviously have not watched the news, and seen all of the children. Then too, would you drag your child over a thousand miles with no food, no water, and not knowing what the lying coward at the other end was going to do? Well, since right wingers could not care less about children you probably would.

No your getting off topic. Im talking about the thousands of parents that leave to the US and claim asylum then apply for visas for the unmarried under 18 children. Why would a parent leave to the US seeking protection from persecution and leave their kids behind to be subjected to such persecution?

 

[GDViking]

Don't believe we're discussing trump here but, I know you can't quit thinking about him.

What I said was the way it is. Don't like it, vote in someone who'll change it.

Umm yes we discussing trump, he is ordering these refugees to not be legally processed while at the same time he expedited immigrants to work at his resorts. He could end this tomorrow.

 

[kageman4444]

Let the immigrants at the border in...with this stipulation. Release them into the custody of someone who will stand up for them. Have their sponsor sign legal documents stating that they're fully responsible for those sponsored and that they will be fully responsible for ANY illegal actions performed by their charge. Such as if they commit a crime, YOU are charged. It shouldn't be a problem for those who claim that they're just good people coming in.

By allowing them in only contributes to a problem our government has let go on far too long. Only allow those who can prove they need asylum. We already have between 11 and 13 million illegal immigrants into our country. Because our government over the years have allowed them to stay, they should be offered a path to a green card and eventually citizenship with the exception of those who have committed crimes. They need to go. From here on forward we should allow only those who come legally. I'm not a big fan of his personality, but it's nice to finally have someone in office who is willing to try and make things right the United States.

 

[bluesmoke]

If I understand the OP correctly, the subject is on those assembling at the border whom are seeking asylum in the US, which is a right afforded by our constitution. No one on this thread has shown that such a group has statistically worse experience of any kind, whether crime or net cost to society, than the average citizen.

But, yes, Trump only has a problem with immigrants and asylum seekers unless he or his family personally benefits. Like, from the EB5 visa program that allows green cards to foreigners, in Trump’s case Chinese, that purchase real estate, in Trump’s case through a $50M loan to Kushner Co’s for a condo project. What a lying, fake of a hypocrite Trump is.

 

[washunut]

Let the immigrants at the border in...with this stipulation. Release them into the custody of someone who will stand up for them. Have their sponsor sign legal documents stating that they're fully responsible for those sponsored and that they will be fully responsible for ANY illegal actions performed by their charge. Such as if they commit a crime, YOU are charged. It shouldn't be a problem for those who claim that they're just good people coming in.

I am just wondering should we let in all people who would have a materially better life in America. Should we allow India for example to ship/airlift all of their lowest caste folks who would have a materially better life as the poorest American as they do at home. How about a couple hundred million people in Africa whose life would be bettered here. Same can be said for millions of Russians and eastern Europeans.

So do we let them all in? Or should we care only about the folks who are born on our Southern border.

 

[itsforthekids]

I am just wondering should we let in all people who would have a materially better life in America. Should we allow India for example to ship/airlift all of their lowest caste folks who would have a materially better life as the poorest American as they do at home. How about a couple hundred million people in Africa whose life would be bettered here. Same can be said for millions of Russians and eastern Europeans.

So do we let them all in? Or should we care only about the folks who are born on our Southern border.

I was being sarcastic. I would like to shut off the valve for all immigration for a while.

 

[JMR]

Here's some info:

https://www.consumer.ftc.gov/articles/0008-tax-related-identity-theft

Happens enough to warrant such a warning.

I can see that it can happen...but the unsuspecting American has to be not paying any attention to actually have their tax burden increased. Also, by reporting the incorrect earnings, it would seem the suspect can be easily caught.

 

[Old Trapper]

No your getting off topic. Im talking about the thousands of parents that leave to the US and claim asylum then apply for visas for the unmarried under 18 children. Why would a parent leave to the US seeking protection from persecution and leave their kids behind to be subjected to such persecution?

Sorry you cannot understand the response I gave, and then you have to deflect from reality to cover up for your lack of knowledge. Since you have posted no source for your comment I will assume it is something your heard from one of your gods on Faux.

 

[Checkerboard Strangler]

Aren't a large portion of native Americans already gainfully employed in casino's and other business?

Working in them but not building them. President Trump employed large numbers of illegals to build his properties. Many of them had to sue in order to get PAID.

 

[Mason66]

I'm not addressing the argument of whether or not these people should be allowed in. What I do question is the accuracy of the statement that illegal immigrants use stolen ID's and raise the tax burden of unsuspecting Americans. How does that work? Do I receive a W-2 from an employer I have never heard of? The IRS has reported income for me, and I don't examine it? I've never seen this discussed before, and it truly doesn't make any sense to me.

YOu don't get the W-2 because the employer of the illegal doesn't have your address.

When you file your taxes, the amounts will be wrong and you will probably be audited.

At the very least you will have to pay the taxes owed by the work of the illegal.

 

[Checkerboard Strangler]

Not yet, they are waiting at the border to do just that.

Hell this is not even a big deal, trump brought in far more immigrants to work his resorts than the than the two hundred that are sitting on top of the fence at the border. (Apparently Mexico has discovered ladders who knew???).

Trump could just hire them, end of crisis...

Many of the big agra companies are itching to do just that right now, just as they always have.
At certain points in our RECENT history they were referred to as GUEST WORKERS.

And yes, they are coming in AS refugees, not as illegal aliens. They are applying for asylum.
Look, the optics on this are not going to end well unless they are processed by the system one way or the other. No president wants a humanitarian crisis on their hands, and certainly not when crops are rotting in fields at the same time.

 

[Mason66]

I am just wondering should we let in all people who would have a materially better life in America. Should we allow India for example to ship/airlift all of their lowest caste folks who would have a materially better life as the poorest American as they do at home. How about a couple hundred million people in Africa whose life would be bettered here. Same can be said for millions of Russians and eastern Europeans.

So do we let them all in? Or should we care only about the folks who are born on our Southern border.

My problem with this is that not one of these people can prove their story of persecution is true.

 

[Checkerboard Strangler]

It's a real outrage too, isn't it?

Sent from my SM-G920V using Tapatalk

Social Security says that up to eleven billion in extra revenue comes in each year because of it.

 

[Mason66]

I can see that it can happen...but the unsuspecting American has to be not paying any attention to actually have their tax burden increased. Also, by reporting the incorrect earnings, it would seem the suspect can be easily caught.

Actually it would be the real taxpayer that would be caught as that is the real address the IRS has for him.

 

[JMR]

YOu don't get the W-2 because the employer of the illegal doesn't have your address.

When you file your taxes, the amounts will be wrong and you will probably be audited.

At the very least you will have to pay the taxes owed by the work of the illegal.

No, you will be notified that you have not reported income. You then dispute the income. I do not believe you will be obligated to pay taxes until the matter is settled.

 

[Mason66]

No, you will be notified that you have not reported income. You then dispute the income. I do not believe you will be obligated to pay taxes until the matter is settled.

How much are you willing to spend to prove you didn't earn that income?

If you have ever dealt with a government office, you will know you will have to prove you didn't earn it as it was reported iunder your number.

You should talk to people this has happened to and see how easy it was to resolve.

Also your refund will be held up until the situation is resolved, if they don't come after you criminally for not reporting extra income.

 

[PleasantValley]

Let the immigrants at the border in...with this stipulation. Release them into the custody of someone who will stand up for them. Have their sponsor sign legal documents stating that they're fully responsible for those sponsored and that they will be fully responsible for ANY illegal actions performed by their charge. Such as if they commit a crime, YOU are charged. It shouldn't be a problem for those who claim that they're just good people coming in.

While this is a good idea, it will not help the victims of their crimes.
The best way to help any potential victims of their crimes is to keep them out in the first place.

100 yard FREE FIRE ZONE?
Anything caught in that zone is gunned down automatically by automated aimed and fired machine guns.
Then the bodies are left there to rot, along with the gunned down coyotes & birds.
Israel already has these.

I have heard this proposed in discussions.
it REPULSES me!

I can see some on the other side tossing candy out there so little kids get gunned down in this manner to make a point.
We are a big, prosperous and generous country.
We do not need FREE FIRE ZONES.