earthworm
DP Veteran
- Joined
- Dec 21, 2005
- Messages
- 5,728
- Reaction score
- 904
- Location
- Goldsboro,PA
- Gender
- Male
- Political Leaning
- Progressive
Agree, well stated, but, as an employment condition , in America, one MUST be able to communicate - somehow .Linguistic imperialism is a terrible idea. By the 2nd generation most immigrant groups have willingly incorporated themselves into the English world without the need for social intervention. The Polish, Germans and Chinese immigration waves in the early 20th century are proof of this. "Requiring" people to learn a language for any reason is incredibly naive as it doesn't take into account the very human need to hold on to cultural traits and values that can only be passed down through language. That said, languages should be treated with a free market spirit. A person who speaks 2-3 languages should be more valuable than a monoglot. As that already is the case, I see no reason for any further intervention.
Depends, what year are we in? Were they valuable in the 70s? If yes, then my comment stands. Historically and currently, more languages means more value.
The point is simple. Alabama does not live in a vacuum of its own. I'm sure even in "rural Alabama" you get products that can only be purchased, traded, or produced with the help of people who speak multiple languages. Actually, I can't think of a single thing in my household which could be produced, sold or purchased without there being a middleman who speaks multiple languages thus making the process simpler. The problem with globalization is that not everyone speaks the same language. So people who speak multiple languages (like myself) become a hot commodity. I honestly believe that in the future, there won't be a household where multiple languages aren't spoken. In my household alone we speak 4 different languages at any given time. Not out of necessity but simple pleasure. Once the rest of society in general transcends the fear of "losing" something culturally because of an added language, and sees value in them, knowing additional languages will be as common as eating a sandwich.
So.... i have a question. Should employers have the right to refuse employment because someone cant speak english?
Disclaimer: this is not about any specific "race" or language. Just about legal immigrants who cant speak english.
So, at work today i got really frustrated trying to communicate with someone who didnt speak very much english. Only a tiny bit. Not nearly enough to hold a conversation.
Im a leader in the workplace, so from time to time i have to ask someone to do something or for information. Its really hard to communicate with a person who cant speak english. I asked this person to not throw out the damaged products of the particular job we were doing because i have to keep count and record of them. This person didnt have a clue what i was asking and continued to throw out the damaged products.
Long story short, it made my job a lot harder and a thought hit my head; why are people who cant speak english even hired in the first place? How did this person make it through the process and interview with such little grasp on the language?
I think that employers should be allowed to deny employment to those who cant speak english. Im not saying they shouldnt be allowed to hire them, but i think they deserve a choice in this matter. What do you think?
Well, since I do not have a Tardis in my backyard, obviously I am talking about today, not 40 years ago.
And by the mid 1980's, those languages were becoming obsolete. By the mid 1990's, they were dead other then those working to migrate programs from one soon to be obsolete platform to another (like IBM 360 to C+). But that once again degenerated to worthless once Y2K was over with.
Needless to say, I do not mention on my resume or in interviews that I programmed in COBOL on 360 mainframes. It is a geek merit badge of sorts, and in actual use about as worthless as my still remembering G=C800:5. Critical to know if you worked on computers 20 years ago, worthless today.
Actually, when we needed something made, we used Redneck Engineering most of the time.
If we needed things shipped in (like computer parts), we called our supplier in Atlanta, who called their headquarters in California if they needed more motherboards or cases.
Right now where I work, our lead designer is on the phone almost every other day to China, getting quotes and specs for future products. But he does not know any Chinese language, all conversations are in English. English is much more of an "international language" then any other. And when English is already your primary language, the common person does not have much need to learn another.
but they have the right to speak their mother language at home and teach it to their kids
My brother is married to a Valencian. Their 3-year-old twins speak Spanish at home with Mum, English to Daddy and at playgroup. When they are with both parents they speak their own mixture of the two. Kids are amazing!
If it bothers you that much why don't you talk to them about it?
I'm sure that they will be glad to discuss this with you.
So in China, somebody found it a necessity to learn English in order to do business, effectively adding a second language to their resume. When your company expands its market to South America, it will need people who speak both English and Spanish to sell its product. Adding a 3rd language to its resume. You're not doing much to disprove my statement that more languages are becoming the norm out of both economic and cultural necessity.
Because it's a skill, and having it makes you worth more as an employee.Why must they be more valuable? I see no reason for that to be the case, only that they can be more valuable, depending on the other language.
Latin is not of much use, unless you need to talk to priests as part of your employment. And if you live and work in rural Alabama, guess how much use knowing Hebrew would be?
An additional language is only as valuable as the need for the language is. It is not valuable in and of itself.
Because it's a skill, and having it makes you worth more as an employee.
You could translate, if necessary.
So i mispelled the names of foreign countries. Im sure you can spell the name of every country on earth
Well, it would be a great idea before starting a thread entitled, 'Learn English first', that you did.
To answer your question, yes I can, spelling the names of countries isn't difficult.
I obviously know english well enough to communicate effectively.
It's not THAT important.Unfortunately you don't know it well enough to know that English requires a capital letter.
It's not THAT important.
You still knew what he meant.
Well then, perhaps whomever hired this person you could not communicate with effectively did not care about effective employee communications. Or perhaps other qualifications trumped that.Picking at my every mistake in typing is easier than debating valid points with logic.
It's not THAT important.
You still knew what he meant.
Sounds as if taking a course in conversational or workplace Spanish will be very helpful to you.
Admittedly they should learn English first, but that would require at least 2 more years of work on top of the already months, even years it takes to get in here in the first place. Are you really going to deny a person the right to even make money because they can hold a conversation with you?
Also as a leader in a work place with people who speak other language, didn't you have to take a class or something? I know my dad did when he got a managerial spot.
So.... i have a question. Should employers have the right to refuse employment because someone cant speak english?
Disclaimer: this is not about any specific "race" or language. Just about legal immigrants who cant speak english.
So, at work today i got really frustrated trying to communicate with someone who didnt speak very much english. Only a tiny bit. Not nearly enough to hold a conversation.
Im a leader in the workplace, so from time to time i have to ask someone to do something or for information. Its really hard to communicate with a person who cant speak english. I asked this person to not throw out the damaged products of the particular job we were doing because i have to keep count and record of them. This person didnt have a clue what i was asking and continued to throw out the damaged products.
Long story short, it made my job a lot harder and a thought hit my head; why are people who cant speak english even hired in the first place? How did this person make it through the process and interview with such little grasp on the language?
I think that employers should be allowed to deny employment to those who cant speak english. Im not saying they shouldnt be allowed to hire them, but i think they deserve a choice in this matter. What do you think?
Sounds as if taking a course in conversational or workplace Spanish will be very helpful to you.
Really? I'm a native speaker of English and I've no idea what you're talking about. What's napalian or samolian? If you mean Nepali or Somali you should say so. Those are English words; learn them.
It's important to note that you learned your host nation's language, as I did mine. There's a difference between respectable immigrants and lazy ones.
This is true. When you move to a country you should learn their language, but isn't there a bit of confusion in parts of the States where you'd need to learn two languages: English and Spanish? That's a tall order for a lot of people, and will take time. In the meantime, should those people be excluded from the workforce? Also, whilst you should learn the host language, you'll never learn it well enough for some people's taste. That's why I tend to get annoyed at apparently semi-literate types on DP attempting to criticise others' use of English when their own can hardly be a source of pride.
The whole 'Grammar Nazi' thing shows up a cultural difference, not between nationalities, but between mindsets. I, and many friends, family and acquaintances, would not agree with the view that you only need to speak or write English well enough for someone else to understand your meaning. While that is fine for speakers of English as a second language, for native speakers I'd hold them to a higher requirement. If you believe that a language is something more than merely a means of communicating basic information, that it encompasses art and conveys character and nuance and permits the expression of imagination and the metaphysical, then the phrase, 'y'know what I mean?' should not be required.
So.... i have a question. Should employers have the right to refuse employment because someone cant speak english?
Disclaimer: this is not about any specific "race" or language. Just about legal immigrants who cant speak english.
So, at work today i got really frustrated trying to communicate with someone who didnt speak very much english. Only a tiny bit. Not nearly enough to hold a conversation.
Im a leader in the workplace, so from time to time i have to ask someone to do something or for information. Its really hard to communicate with a person who cant speak english. I asked this person to not throw out the damaged products of the particular job we were doing because i have to keep count and record of them. This person didnt have a clue what i was asking and continued to throw out the damaged products.
Long story short, it made my job a lot harder and a thought hit my head; why are people who cant speak english even hired in the first place? How did this person make it through the process and interview with such little grasp on the language?
I think that employers should be allowed to deny employment to those who cant speak english. Im not saying they shouldnt be allowed to hire them, but i think they deserve a choice in this matter. What do you think?
I do believe that English is the language of our nation and it annoys me that my neighbors, who are good folks, speak Spanish to their little kids.
Also, being bi-lingual adds value to the employee because, well, so many people come here and don't bother learning English and we have accommodated this to the point of absurdity. Now in some jobs, I suppose it doesn't matter but I would not likely hire a non-english speaking employee. But all it takes is one good amnesty and Spanish will become our primary language. I suppose this is continent appropriate but I still dread the day.
For English press 4.
We use cookies and similar technologies for the following purposes:
Do you accept cookies and these technologies?
We use cookies and similar technologies for the following purposes:
Do you accept cookies and these technologies?