Job Change Opportunity....

Tigger · Sep 23, 2013

On Friday I had a conversation with the owner of a company who has a job opportunity he wants me to consider. I'm quite undecided on whether or not I should look into it more seriously or not, and I was hoping the DP membership could give me some sage advice....

I currently work in the mapping department of a major electric utility company. It's a Union shop, and I'm the local steward. I make an hourly wage in the mid $30's an hour range with excellent benefits, job security, and a guaranteed raise/bonus structure. However, my next opportunity for advancement is likely to be 10-12 years down the road. I've been with this company in one form or another for the last 12 years. I enjoy the work for the most part, and the people I work with are decent. Unfortunately the atmosphere of the company has decreased significantly over the past 3 years or so.

The new position would be very different than what I do now, but it's very close to my "dream job". It's an opportunity to revamp, rebuild, and upgrade the drafting/CAD department of a small-mid sized residential and light commercial architecture company. For the first year I would be working with the outgoing supervisor of the department and then I would take over the position permanently when that person leaves at the begininning of October, 2014. The position only deals with managing the department, not doing design work. It's a great opportunity for me.

My concern is that it's a salaried position, which would require longer hours than I currently work and keep me away from home a lot longer than I currently am. Additionally, I'm concerned about having to deal with this other supervisor for the next year (we worked on a project last year and didn't get along very well), the fact that the company is still fairly young and in a sector of the market that is not exactly booming at the moment, and that my inter-personal skills can be a little hard for other people to deal with at times.

Basically this comes down to whether or not I stay with a position where I'm very secure but doing a job I don't like as much or taking a huge leap of faith that could lead to me falling flat on my face and being out in the cold if it doean't work out.

MaggieD · Sep 23, 2013

Tigger said:
On Friday I had a conversation with the owner of a company who has a job opportunity he wants me to consider. I'm quite undecided on whether or not I should look into it more seriously or not, and I was hoping the DP membership could give me some sage advice....

I currently work in the mapping department of a major electric utility company. It's a Union shop, and I'm the local steward. I make an hourly wage in the mid $30's an hour range with excellent benefits, job security, and a guaranteed raise/bonus structure. However, my next opportunity for advancement is likely to be 10-12 years down the road. I've been with this company in one form or another for the last 12 years. I enjoy the work for the most part, and the people I work with are decent. Unfortunately the atmosphere of the company has decreased significantly over the past 3 years or so.

The new position would be very different than what I do now, but it's very close to my "dream job". It's an opportunity to revamp, rebuild, and upgrade the drafting/CAD department of a small-mid sized residential and light commercial architecture company. For the first year I would be working with the outgoing supervisor of the department and then I would take over the position permanently when that person leaves at the begininning of October, 2014. The position only deals with managing the department, not doing design work. It's a great opportunity for me.

My concern is that it's a salaried position, which would require longer hours than I currently work and keep me away from home a lot longer than I currently am. Additionally, I'm concerned about having to deal with this other supervisor for the next year (we worked on a project last year and didn't get along very well), the fact that the company is still fairly young and in a sector of the market that is not exactly booming at the moment, and that my inter-personal skills can be a little hard for other people to deal with at times.

Basically this comes down to whether or not I stay with a position where I'm very secure but doing a job I don't like as much or taking a huge leap of faith that could lead to me falling flat on my face and being out in the cold if it doean't work out.

Well, let's see. What do I know about Tigger? He's stranger than the average bear. He loves rules and regulations. He reads everything in terms of black-and-white. I have no reason to believe his social skills have been honed to anything beyond marginal.

Taking that into account, I'd recommend you stay where you are. You've found a niche for yourself that works. I've never heard you say you have problems with co-workers. You have a strong identity within the company as a union steward.

If you put just half the effort into your present circumstances that you'll have to put into a new career, you can shorten that 12 years by more than half, I'll bet.

Grass often looks greener from across the street. Sometimes when we get there, we find the yard's full of weeds.

Tigger · Sep 23, 2013

MaggieD said:
Well, let's see. What do I know about Tigger? He's stranger than the average bear. He loves rules and regulations. He reads everything in terms of black-and-white. I have no reason to believe his social skills have been honed to anything beyond marginal.

Taking that into account, I'd recommend you stay where you are. You've found a niche for yourself that works. I've never heard you say you have problems with co-workers. You have a strong identity within the company as a union steward.

If you put just half the effort into your present circumstances that you'll have to put into a new career, you can shorten that 12 years by more than half, I'll bet.

Grass often looks greener from across the street. Sometimes when we get there, we find the yard's full of weeds.

Thanks for the input, Maggie. My social skills are actually better than you might think, when they need to be. I know the greener grass analogy all too well.

The advancement schedule isn't going to change. There are two Senior Techs in the Department and two more individuals with Seniority over me at my level before I can get to that Senior Tech level. At best, I'm looking at 8-10 years before enough of those people are retired to get to that level myself.

Gardener · Sep 23, 2013

Are there any women in management positions at this new company?

If there are, you should definitely stay in your current job.

Fisher · Sep 23, 2013

I wouldn't if I were you and couldn't afford to end up unemployed unless my mortgage were paid and/or my spouse had a job that could cover survival or I had a pension/IRA that I could cash out in an emergency to meet the mortgage.

Tigger · Sep 23, 2013

Gardener said:
Are there any women in management positions at this new company?

If there are, you should definitely stay in your current job.

Actually that IS one of the considerations. The individual that I would be replacing after the change-over is a woman. I would be working in conjunction with her for the next year and we already know that we have very different management styles.

Tigger · Sep 23, 2013

Fisher said:
I wouldn't if I were you and couldn't afford to end up unemployed unless my mortgage were paid and/or my spouse had a job that could cover survival or I had a pension/IRA that I could cash out in an emergency to meet the mortgage.

That's my biggest concern. My fiance doesn't work and we're planning a wedding for next July. Ending up with no job would be pretty disastrous for us.

Gardener · Sep 23, 2013

Tigger said:
Actually that IS one of the considerations. The individual that I would be replacing after the change-over is a woman. I would be working in conjunction with her for the next year and we already know that we have very different management styles.

That looks like a red flag to me, all things considered.

CanadaJohn · Sep 23, 2013

Tigger said:
On Friday I had a conversation with the owner of a company who has a job opportunity he wants me to consider. I'm quite undecided on whether or not I should look into it more seriously or not, and I was hoping the DP membership could give me some sage advice....

I currently work in the mapping department of a major electric utility company. It's a Union shop, and I'm the local steward. I make an hourly wage in the mid $30's an hour range with excellent benefits, job security, and a guaranteed raise/bonus structure. However, my next opportunity for advancement is likely to be 10-12 years down the road. I've been with this company in one form or another for the last 12 years. I enjoy the work for the most part, and the people I work with are decent. Unfortunately the atmosphere of the company has decreased significantly over the past 3 years or so.

The new position would be very different than what I do now, but it's very close to my "dream job". It's an opportunity to revamp, rebuild, and upgrade the drafting/CAD department of a small-mid sized residential and light commercial architecture company. For the first year I would be working with the outgoing supervisor of the department and then I would take over the position permanently when that person leaves at the begininning of October, 2014. The position only deals with managing the department, not doing design work. It's a great opportunity for me.

My concern is that it's a salaried position, which would require longer hours than I currently work and keep me away from home a lot longer than I currently am. Additionally, I'm concerned about having to deal with this other supervisor for the next year (we worked on a project last year and didn't get along very well), the fact that the company is still fairly young and in a sector of the market that is not exactly booming at the moment, and that my inter-personal skills can be a little hard for other people to deal with at times.

Basically this comes down to whether or not I stay with a position where I'm very secure but doing a job I don't like as much or taking a huge leap of faith that could lead to me falling flat on my face and being out in the cold if it doean't work out.

For what my advice may be worth, I'll freely offer it.

For me, it depends on a few things:

1. Your age and place in life. If you're in your 40's, now may not be the time to start a new career if you've been planning for retirement or if you've got a family to consider. Particularly if you're married, your wife's imput in your decision will be critical because you need to be partners in any big lifestyle change. If you're in your 30's or younger, particularly if you're single and/or no kids, you've got plenty of time to recover if the new plan doesn't work out.

2. Your threshhold for risk. If you like to play the stock market, if you risk your savings in high yield investments rather than the safe but low yield options, that kind of thing, and you don't stay awake nights worrying you're going to lose everything, then you're risk threshhold is high and you'll easily recover if things don't work out.

3. How much you enjoy the people you work with where you work now? Starting a new job, particularly if you're older than a lot of people you're going to be working with, can be socially taxing and isolate you from people you may have taken for granted at your old job but who provided a level of social support for you. Where you work now, both the company and the people there, have a lot invested in you and you in them and that can take a hell of a long time to replace.

4. What's the upside of the new job as opposed to the downside of leaving your current job? Factor in all the benefits of your current job and give them a financial value - hours of work, vacation time you now get versus what you will get, health and other benefits - old and new - that kind of thing. Often, the bump in salary isn't as great as it seems when you factor in all the other costs/benefits of moving.

For me, personally, once I settled on a place I stayed there for 30 years and retired with a nice indexed pension that keeps me comfortable. But I like routine, I liked being known and respected, I liked the security of having my retirement taken care of, and even though I was offered other tempting proposals, I always came back to what I knew was most sure. As the old saying goes, "a bird in the hand is worth two in the bush".

Whatever you chose, I wish you all the best of luck and no regrets either way. Have fun deciding!

Tigger · Sep 23, 2013

Gardener said:
That looks like a red flag to me, all things considered.

Yeah, probably.

CanadaJohn said:
1. Your age and place in life. If you're in your 40's, now may not be the time to start a new career if you've been planning for retirement or if you've got a family to consider. Particularly if you're married, your wife's imput in your decision will be critical because you need to be partners in any big lifestyle change. If you're in your 30's or younger, particularly if you're single and/or no kids, you've got plenty of time to recover if the new plan doesn't work out.

2. Your threshhold for risk. If you like to play the stock market, if you risk your savings in high yield investments rather than the safe but low yield options, that kind of thing, and you don't stay awake nights worrying you're going to lose everything, then you're risk threshhold is high and you'll easily recover if things don't work out.

3. How much you enjoy the people you work with where you work now? Starting a new job, particularly if you're older than a lot of people you're going to be working with, can be socially taxing and isolate you from people you may have taken for granted at your old job but who provided a level of social support for you. Where you work now, both the company and the people there, have a lot invested in you and you in them and that can take a hell of a long time to replace.

4. What's the upside of the new job as opposed to the downside of leaving your current job? Factor in all the benefits of your current job and give them a financial value - hours of work, vacation time you now get versus what you will get, health and other benefits - old and new - that kind of thing. Often, the bump in salary isn't as great as it seems when you factor in all the other costs/benefits of moving.

1. I'll be 40 next July. I don't ever expect to retire. Not with the way the US Economy is. My fiance's take has been that she'd probably prefer I stay where I am but considering the nearly 50% pay increase once I took over the supervisory role, she's slightly conflicted.

2. I have almost ZERO threshold for risk. I don't invest in the stock market or things like that.

3. My co-workers are not my social friends and really never have been anywhere I work. I'm not that social. I work with great people but they're only in my life 40 hours a week. I've dealt with that sort of thing my entire life. It's not that big of a consideration.

4. The upside.... a nearly 50% pay raise on 10/1/2014 and the chance to be a supervisor/manager rather than the underling. The job is almost exactly what I've dreamed of my entire life. However, it's going to mean a 50-55 hour week, no more Friday's off (I currently work a 4-10 hour schedule), and a lot more headaches in trying to change the culture at the new place.

CanadaJohn · Sep 23, 2013

Tigger said:
Yeah, probably.

1. I'll be 40 next July. I don't ever expect to retire. Not with the way the US Economy is. My fiance's take has been that she'd probably prefer I stay where I am but considering the nearly 50% pay increase once I took over the supervisory role, she's slightly conflicted.

2. I have almost ZERO threshold for risk. I don't invest in the stock market or things like that.

3. My co-workers are not my social friends and really never have been anywhere I work. I'm not that social. I work with great people but they're only in my life 40 hours a week. I've dealt with that sort of thing my entire life. It's not that big of a consideration.

4. The upside.... a nearly 50% pay raise on 10/1/2014 and the chance to be a supervisor/manager rather than the underling. The job is almost exactly what I've dreamed of my entire life. However, it's going to mean a 50-55 hour week, no more Friday's off (I currently work a 4-10 hour schedule), and a lot more headaches in trying to change the culture at the new place.

Sounds like it won't be an easy choice, but I sense you leaning one way - good luck.

polgara · Sep 23, 2013

CanadaJohn said:
For what my advice may be worth, I'll freely offer it.

For me, it depends on a few things:

1. Your age and place in life. If you're in your 40's, now may not be the time to start a new career if you've been planning for retirement or if you've got a family to consider. Particularly if you're married, your wife's imput in your decision will be critical because you need to be partners in any big lifestyle change. If you're in your 30's or younger, particularly if you're single and/or no kids, you've got plenty of time to recover if the new plan doesn't work out.

2. Your threshhold for risk. If you like to play the stock market, if you risk your savings in high yield investments rather than the safe but low yield options, that kind of thing, and you don't stay awake nights worrying you're going to lose everything, then you're risk threshhold is high and you'll easily recover if things don't work out.

3. How much you enjoy the people you work with where you work now? Starting a new job, particularly if you're older than a lot of people you're going to be working with, can be socially taxing and isolate you from people you may have taken for granted at your old job but who provided a level of social support for you. Where you work now, both the company and the people there, have a lot invested in you and you in them and that can take a hell of a long time to replace.

4. What's the upside of the new job as opposed to the downside of leaving your current job? Factor in all the benefits of your current job and give them a financial value - hours of work, vacation time you now get versus what you will get, health and other benefits - old and new - that kind of thing. Often, the bump in salary isn't as great as it seems when you factor in all the other costs/benefits of moving.

For me, personally, once I settled on a place I stayed there for 30 years and retired with a nice indexed pension that keeps me comfortable. But I like routine, I liked being known and respected, I liked the security of having my retirement taken care of, and even though I was offered other tempting proposals, I always came back to what I knew was most sure. As the old saying goes, "a bird in the hand is worth two in the bush".

Whatever you chose, I wish you all the best of luck and no regrets either way. Have fun deciding!

Very good post with solid advice on things to consider, CJ! :thumbs: I was also there once, and opted to stay where I was. Fortunately, it was the best choice I could have made, and I never once regretted it! :lol:

CanadaJohn · Sep 23, 2013

polgara said:
Very good post with solid advice on things to consider, CJ! :thumbs: I was also there once, and opted to stay where I was. Fortunately, it was the best choice I could have made, and I never once regretted it! :lol:

Good morning Lady P, and thanks.

The best move can often be the one you don't make. But then, I'm not overly adventurous, so I'm biased.

Superfly · Sep 23, 2013

Gardener said:
Are there any women in management positions at this new company?

If there are, you should definitely stay in your current job.

Sorry. Literally made me laugh out loud.

Superfly · Sep 23, 2013

Fisher said:
I wouldn't if I were you and couldn't afford to end up unemployed unless my mortgage were paid and/or my spouse had a job that could cover survival or I had a pension/IRA that I could cash out in an emergency to meet the mortgage.

I'd venture to guess she isn't allowed to work.

Fisher · Sep 23, 2013

Superfly said:
I'd venture to guess she isn't allowed to work.

There is a time; and there is a place. Not sure this is either. I try not to confuse internet political blather with real life issues that do crop up here from time to time.

Superfly · Sep 23, 2013

Fisher said:
There is a time; and there is a place. Not sure this is either. I try not to confuse internet political blather with real life issues that do crop up here from time to time.

Just made a statement to respond to your comment. He has no issues with how his family life runs. He talks of it often. I stand by what I said - that she probably isn't allowed to work.

AlabamaPaul · Sep 23, 2013

Tigger said:
Yeah, probably.

1. I'll be 40 next July. I don't ever expect to retire. Not with the way the US Economy is. My fiance's take has been that she'd probably prefer I stay where I am but considering the nearly 50% pay increase once I took over the supervisory role, she's slightly conflicted.

2. I have almost ZERO threshold for risk. I don't invest in the stock market or things like that.

3. My co-workers are not my social friends and really never have been anywhere I work. I'm not that social. I work with great people but they're only in my life 40 hours a week. I've dealt with that sort of thing my entire life. It's not that big of a consideration.

4. The upside.... a nearly 50% pay raise on 10/1/2014 and the chance to be a supervisor/manager rather than the underling. The job is almost exactly what I've dreamed of my entire life. However, it's going to mean a 50-55 hour week, no more Friday's off (I currently work a 4-10 hour schedule), and a lot more headaches in trying to change the culture at the new place.

These statements give me reason for concern. If the company is trying to hire you away from your current position, they should be willing to "cough it up" at the front end. If not, I would be concerned going forward...

Tigger · Sep 24, 2013

AlabamaPaul said:
These statements give me reason for concern. If the company is trying to hire you away from your current position, they should be willing to "cough it up" at the front end. If not, I would be concerned going forward...

The intent is to give me about a 10% raise immediately and then when the other Supervisor leaves and I take over that position, to give me the rest. I've already told them that anything like that would have to be in writing, and notarized with both of our signatures. They're a relatively small company, and taking on two Supervisor salaries right now (mine and hers) would be very tough for their bottom line. Especially when my 10/1/2014 salary would be about 140% of what she currently makes.

sangha · Sep 24, 2013

I advise against

When you work for a small company, you can be fired for just about anything. "Politicking" becomes important. People can, and have been, fired simply for not getting along with their co-workers.

You've got a good, secure job that pays relatively well. Count your blessings.

MaggieD · Sep 24, 2013

Tigger said:
The intent is to give me about a 10% raise immediately and then when the other Supervisor leaves and I take over that position, to give me the rest. I've already told them that anything like that would have to be in writing, and notarized with both of our signatures. They're a relatively small company, and taking on two Supervisor salaries right now (mine and hers) would be very tough for their bottom line. Especially when my 10/1/2014 salary would be about 140% of what she currently makes.

One of the best job offers I ever got from Corporate America was from a company that, six months later, was out of business. (I didn't take the job . . . but the offer gave me pause.) I didn't notice that they were only offering 10% more for the first year . . . the first time I suggested you not make the move it was for other reasons. That 10%? That's yet another one.

This company should be understanding what you're giving up. Fourteen years with the same company (# ?), great hours, earned vacation time, seniority (union). That, in my opinion, is too much to give up for 10% in the hand. With benefits? You're actually taking less money. With job security? You're taking a huge hit.

Honestly? My fear would be that they pick my brain and find a reason to weasel. They can't be held to the promise of a salary increase if you're not working there anymore. When that other supervisor leaves, their financial doors are wide open to go out and hire the absolutely perfect candidate. That might not be you.

JumpinJack · Sep 30, 2013

My two cents.

Years ago I had an offer to go work in a branch of a somewhat large company, but in an iffy type of business. Pay was good, benefits were good, but mainly the working environment and hours were much better than my current job (where I was working tons of O.T. and highly stressed out). Also, the new co. was 5 minutes from my home. Very attractive offer. I didn't take the job because my mother passed away suddenly, requiring me to leave town, etc. Fast forward...that company merged with another company, and all the people in that dept I would have gone for were laid off and replaced with the larger company's people. I worked for a stable, large law firm, which was in almost no danger of merging or going away.

Small companies are more likely to be bought out or fail than large utilities. You didn't mention the small company's retirement benefits, that I saw. That is as important as salary. Small companies typically contribute much less to an employee's retirement, whether it's a 401k contribution or whatever.

Job Change Opportunity....

Tigger

MaggieD

Tigger

Gardener

free market communist

Fisher

Tigger

Tigger

Gardener

free market communist

CanadaJohn

Canadian Conservative

Tigger

CanadaJohn

Canadian Conservative

polgara

CanadaJohn

Canadian Conservative

Superfly

Salty, defiant, and completely non-compliant.

Superfly

Salty, defiant, and completely non-compliant.

Fisher

Superfly

Salty, defiant, and completely non-compliant.

AlabamaPaul

Pragmatist

Tigger

sangha

MaggieD

JumpinJack

Job Change Opportunity....

free market communist

free market communist

Canadian Conservative

Canadian Conservative

Canadian Conservative

Salty, defiant, and completely non-compliant.

Salty, defiant, and completely non-compliant.

Salty, defiant, and completely non-compliant.

Pragmatist

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