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Israel calls on 1.1 million Gazans to evacuate south in order UN warns is ‘impossible’

Nomad4Ever said:
I'm sorry, but this is a completely unreasonable request from Israel and is clearly meant to give them some kind of cover for how many civilians are about to get killed. It isn't possible to comply with. There is no fuel, even if there was the roads are impassible to cars. The largest hospital is north of where they told people to move from. Most people will be moving as families with small children. On top of that the UN refugee camps that house more than half the population are already running out of food/water as it is and it is not possible to transport what little they have with them in 24h given the state of the infrastructure. Gaza is already one of the densest populated places on Earth. Packing another million people into the bottom half the the country would kill tens of thousands.
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IDF said to move south of Wadi.
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The river in question is less than 10 miles from just about anywhere in the evacuation zone.
Almost anyone, who is allowed could walk out this weekend.
The question is will they be allowed to leave?
 
reinaert said:
This was confirmed?
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Was what confirmed? The decapitation of babies? Journalists and soldiers who say they've seen the video and photographs aren't super thrilled about posting pics of of babies with their heads cut off, which...I'm grateful for.

So fast forwarding to the next response: "Then how do you know it's real if you haven't seen the photos for yourself?" I'll answer: first of all, I don't want to see those photos. Secondly, is this something that Hamas would do? Considering that there is no question that Hamas indiscriminately murdered civilians (media isn't squeamish about showing the bodies of adults), yes, it seems reasonable to assume for the time being that the reports are true.

Edit: one more point: is the Israeli government responding as if Hamas had just decapitated 40 babies? Yes, I would say that they are. The IDF isn't responding as if HAMAS had "merely" murdered hundreds of adults. They're responding as if some super special red line has just been crossed.
 
Nomad4Ever said:
I'm sorry, but this is a completely unreasonable request from Israel and is clearly meant to give them some kind of cover for how many civilians are about to get killed. It isn't possible to comply with. There is no fuel, even if there was the roads are impassible to cars. The largest hospital is north of where they told people to move from. Most people will be moving as families with small children. On top of that the UN refugee camps that house more than half the population are already running out of food/water as it is and it is not possible to transport what little they have with them in 24h given the state of the infrastructure. Gaza is already one of the densest populated places on Earth. Packing another million people into the bottom half the the country would kill tens of thousands.
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IDF said to move south of Wadi.
Click to expand...

I remain unconvinced there is an alternative now, I mean other than appeasing Hamas by giving them more time and more quarter to prepare if not go after more of Israel at their exclusive choice.
 
longview said:
The river in question is less than 10 miles from just about anywhere in the evacuation zone.
Almost anyone, who is allowed could walk out this weekend.
The question is will they be allowed to leave?
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I highly doubt Hamas has the ability to prevent a million people leaving.

This isn't as simple as just move. Over 600,000 people's homes have already been destroyed. Before the war started half the population lived in refugee camps and now a good chunk that wasn't has moved into those camps as thousands of homes have been destroyed.

Think about this for just like, 30-45 seconds I beg you. You need to move whatever food stockpiles the UN has left that is feeding 1,000,000 people WITHOUT vehicles. You need to move the stored fresh water the UN is using to keep 1,000,000 people dying of dehydration WITHOUT vehicles. You need to somehow find a way to house 1,000,000 people in an area where the UN camps are overflowing and people are living in schools. The largest hospital is in the evacuation zone and trying to move many of those people would be a death sentence.

"just walk out" is a staggering simplification of the situation.
 
CaughtInThe said:
And a bunch of Evangelical Republicans want Christianity to rule our government.

They can't even look to the Middle East to see what hardline religious governments do to people.
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We can look at Stalinist Russia and wonder if it's it better or worse than what hardline atheist governments do to people.

It's almost like religion isn't the common factor in government brutality.
 
Grizzly Adams said:
We can look at Stalinist Russia and wonder if it's it better or worse than what hardline atheist governments do to people.

It's almost like religion isn't the common factor in government brutality.
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which is why there is so much peace in the Middle East and the Crusades didn't happen.
 
PoS said:
So theyre essentially saying that every man, woman and child still in the area after the deadline passes will be killed regardless...
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No. You're overstating the case. Those who can get to safety will. Those who can't will take their chances - just as civilians who remain in any war zone take their chances.
 
Cardinal said:
Was what confirmed? The decapitation of babies? Journalists and soldiers who say they've seen the video and photographs aren't super thrilled about posting pics of of babies with their heads cut off, which...I'm grateful for.

So fast forwarding to the next response: "Then how do you know it's real if you haven't seen the photos for yourself?" I'll answer: first of all, I don't want to see those photos. Secondly, is this something that Hamas would do? Considering that there is no question that Hamas indiscriminately murdered civilians (media isn't squeamish about showing the bodies of adults), yes, it seems reasonable to assume for the time being that the reports are true.

Edit: one more point: is the Israeli government responding as if Hamas had just decapitated 40 babies? Yes, I would say that they are. The IDF isn't responding as if HAMAS had "merely" murdered hundreds of adults. They're responding as if some super special red line has just been crossed.
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My question has nothing to do with Likud's reaction. Or suppositions about journalistic professionalism. Has the 'decapitated babies' story been confirmed?
 
reinaert said:
My question has nothing to do with Likud's reaction. Or suppositions about journalistic professionalism. Has the 'decapitated babies' story been confirmed?
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I answered your question from a multitude of angles, not merely that one.

For now the reports seem credible to me. If you don't agree then that's fine.
 
They are basically telling the world anyone left is a member of Hamas.

Shoot to kill
 
Nomad4Ever said:
I highly doubt Hamas has the ability to prevent a million people leaving.

This isn't as simple as just move. Over 600,000 people's homes have already been destroyed. Before the war started half the population lived in refugee camps and now a good chunk that wasn't has moved into those camps as thousands of homes have been destroyed.

Think about this for just like, 30-45 seconds I beg you. You need to move whatever food stockpiles the UN has left that is feeding 1,000,000 people WITHOUT vehicles. You need to move the stored fresh water the UN is using to keep 1,000,000 people dying of dehydration WITHOUT vehicles. You need to somehow find a way to house 1,000,000 people in an area where the UN camps are overflowing and people are living in schools. The largest hospital is in the evacuation zone and trying to move many of those people would be a death sentence.

"just walk out" is a staggering simplification of the situation.
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If you are already living in a camp, and your family is going to be in danger, pick up what little you have left, and WALK.
I suspect the UN does have people and vehicles to move supplies, and there may even be busses.
 
Grizzly Adams said:
If you don't care to explain in better detail what your point was supposed to be, it couldn't have been of any import. Probably better if you just deleted it. You still have a few seconds.
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if you can't understand that short post i can't help you.
 
Cardinal said:
I answered your question from a multitude of angles, not merely that one.

For now the reports seem credible to me. If you don't agree then that's fine.
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Your 'angles' are starting to seem like legerdemain. I suggest a more gullible mark. And I did not ask if you are credulous or not. Was it confirmed?
 
CaughtInThe said:
if you can't understand that short post i can't help you.
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You can, actually. You can explain what the **** it's supposed to mean. Because nowhere did I say there was peace in the Middle East, or that the Crusades never happened.

Given those facts, one can't help but be baffled as to why you think your point should be readily evident.

Unless you're trolling, and have no point.
 
reinaert said:
Your 'angles' are starting to seem like legerdemain. I suggest a more gullible mark. And I did not ask if you are credulous or not. Was it confirmed?
Click to expand...

The photos have not been released, but these are the reasons that, when added in their entirety, lead me to think the reports are credible:

1) We have photographic evidence that they've killed children. This is not in dispute. If nothing else, this shows that non-adults aren't off the table.
2) The newness and the uniqueness of the claim is parallel to the newness and uniqueness of Hamas's attack. Hamas's attack is unprecedented, and this would be similarly unprecedented.
3) These are new and unique claims. The IDF and reporters have not made this claim before.
4) Killing civilians was their intent.
5) It makes sense that images of decapitated babies wouldn't be circulated throughout the media.
6) I've been given no reason to not believe the claims by reporters and IDF are false.
7) And finally, as I've said, the scale of the Israeli response is as if babies had been decapitated.
8) I've seen no dispute that babies have, in fact, been killed. It's just the decapitated claim that is being disputed online, though that begs the question why babies killed by bullets is so much more "normal" than killed by decapitation.

So given all this, I have to ask you: why do you doubt the claims, and what is your threshold for the claims being confirmed?
 
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