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'Islamic takeover plot' in Birmingham schools investigated

mbig said:
EVERY Muslim school pupil will come out Rejecting Evolution.
Their teachers are Islamists/Muslim fundamentalists/literalists and are unqualified to teach science.
Wonder what they learn about Jews.

Mins 7:20-10:30
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Youtube can't show the video in the UK. :(
 
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Crusader.png
 
Gardener said:
"as it should be" including more British people defending their liberal culture against those who wish to destroy it, hopefully.
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I'm afraid in this case Britain was battling an Education Minister whose dangerous intention was to turn all schools into" Academies" which the report states "In theory, academies are accountable to the secretary of state, but in practice the accountability can almost amount to benign neglect where educational and financial performance seems to indicate everything is fine."

What we've had in Birmingham was islamists bent on radicalising their schools, concerned whistle-blowers ignored by local and central govt and a Minister who wanted more Academies, faster - whatever the cost.

Thankfully the lid has been lifted and I hope the islamists are named, shamed and banned from going anywhere near British schools again.

It's probably too much to hope we can remove them from the country at the same time.
 
Infinite Chaos said:
I'm afraid in this case Britain was battling an Education Minister whose dangerous intention was to turn all schools into" Academies" which the report states "In theory, academies are accountable to the secretary of state, but in practice the accountability can almost amount to benign neglect where educational and financial performance seems to indicate everything is fine."

What we've had in Birmingham was islamists bent on radicalising their schools, concerned whistle-blowers ignored by local and central govt and a Minister who wanted more Academies, faster - whatever the cost.

Thankfully the lid has been lifted and I hope the islamists are named, shamed and banned from going anywhere near British schools again.

It's probably too much to hope we can remove them from the country at the same time.
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It will be 'refreshing' if 'community sensibilities' are ignored--in favour of community cohesion, and as you say, someone is brought to account.

Paul
 
Disturbing' findings from Trojan horse inquiry

There is "disturbing" evidence that people with a "shared ideology" were trying to gain control of governing bodies in Birmingham, says Education Secretary Nicky Morgan.

She was responding to the Trojan horse report from former counter-terror chief Peter Clarke into allegations of a hardline Muslim take-over of schools.

Mr Clarke found evidence of an "aggressive Islamist agenda".

Ms Morgan highlighted "intolerant" messages between school staff.

Teachers could face misconduct inquiries, she told the House of Commons, after Mr Clarke's report found a social media group called the "Park View Brotherhood" used by male senior staff at Park View School. Link.
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The sad thing is that the original letter seems highly likely to have been a hoax - but it was done by someone who had probably tried repeatedly to get seniors in the council or education to listen to his or her warnings and was ignored.

"Community cohesion" here was simply a polite word for "appeasement" of hardline conservative muslim governors and leaders in the Birmingham muslim community. All covered up by an Education secretary whose dogmatic approach to his favoured free schools and academy conversion policy meant he defended the very lack of oversight which allowed muslim extremists to gain such ground.

It's obviously not just Michael Goves to blame but previous Education Secretaries in Labour and city councillors in Birmingham who failed the schools and children they were responsible for.
 
Infinite Chaos said:
The sad thing is that the original letter seems highly likely to have been a hoax - but it was done by someone who had probably tried repeatedly to get seniors in the council or education to listen to his or her warnings and was ignored.

"Community cohesion" here was simply a polite word for "appeasement" of hardline conservative muslim governors and leaders in the Birmingham muslim community. All covered up by an Education secretary whose dogmatic approach to his favoured free schools and academy conversion policy meant he defended the very lack of oversight which allowed muslim extremists to gain such ground.

It's obviously not just Michael Goves to blame but previous Education Secretaries in Labour and city councillors in Birmingham who failed the schools and children they were responsible for.
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Religion poisons everything and those who use their 'moderation' as an excuse for facilitating the drip, drip, drip of religiosity into the State are just as culpable in this. All of the three main parties in the UK come out of this with nothing to their credit.
 
William Rea said:
-- All of the three main parties in the UK come out of this with nothing to their credit.
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Hi Will, I agree the main point you make however particular scorn must be aimed at Michael Gove for his obsession with a system of education that deliberately removed oversight from school governance. Previous parties appeased religions whereas Gove's plans encouraged fundamentalists to feel they could push their agendas and without any fear of inspectors checking to make sure children weren't being brainwashed.
 
Infinite Chaos said:
I'm afraid in this case Britain was battling an Education Minister whose dangerous intention was to turn all schools into" Academies" which the report states "In theory, academies are accountable to the secretary of state, but in practice the accountability can almost amount to benign neglect where educational and financial performance seems to indicate everything is fine."

What we've had in Birmingham was Islamists bent on radicalising their Schools, concerned whistle-blowers ignored by local and central govt and a Minister who wanted more Academies, faster - whatever the cost.

Thankfully the lid has been lifted and I hope the Islamists are named, shamed and banned from going anywhere near British schools again.It's probably too much to hope we can remove them from the country at the same time.
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Well it's Nice to know you've come to learn "Islamist" doesn't mean "terrorist" as was your Stupendous Misunderstanding last we discussed it:

http://www.debatepolitics.com/europ...s-target-youth-internet-9.html#post1061109792

mbig said:
Infinite Chaos said:
....
So, is there an islamist threat - yes there is; do islamists exist in the UK- yes there will be simply due to international communications and perceived grievances against islam.
Are security services monitoring islamists - yes they are and there are occasionally arrests made against suspected Cells and the
Mi5 website gives us a daily threat level warning which at the moment puts an Islamist / International terrorist threat of attack against the UK as substantial but the threat from an IRA offshoot as severe. There will be similar actions by security forces in other parts of Europe and we mostly as posters would prefer to leave security to security specialists.
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No, No, Not again.

"islamists" aren't the ones being monitored by the security services; Islamists ARE Devout Muslims who don't necessarily all need monitoring but who are a more long term Cultural threat and indeed spawn those who Are dangerous/more likely to act on those precepts many hold.

For the 1000th time, You are conflating/Strawmanning 'Islamist' with 'Terrorist' for the purpose of minimizing the amount of the former.
NOT AGAIN!
There are few terrorists while Islamists are at least a Significant Minority. (as determined by their opinions in many polls cited here).This is Self-delusion or plain Disingenuous perversion (I believe the former after so many of your mindblowing/denialist posts) and after so many discussions that have made this painstakingly clear.

Yet more clarification. (as if it will do any good)
Egypt's Islamist parties (MB/Salafis) won 70% of the vote. They ARE Islamists but clearly most are not dangerous nor terrorist.
Islamist is NOT "terrorist".
Shall we do this weekly?
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So NOW, AS I said, YOU understand "Islamist" isn't synonymous with "terrorist," but merely devout Muslims, especially those, as I said, are "cultural", NOT "terrorist" threats.

I can't wait for THIS answer either.
 
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mbig said:
Well it's Nice to know you've come to learn "Islamist" doesn't mean "terrorist" as was your Stupendous Misunderstanding last we discussed it:

http://www.debatepolitics.com/europ...s-target-youth-internet-9.html#post1061109792


So NOW, AS I said, YOU understand "Islamist" isn't synonymous with "terrorist," but merely devout Muslims, especially those, as I said, are "cultural", NOT "terrorist" threats.

I can't wait for THIS answer either.
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I'm only posting sporadically now because of life in the real world but I think I answered this last time...

http://www.debatepolitics.com/europ...s-target-youth-internet-9.html#post1061109842

Infinite Chaos said:
I can't even begin to fathom what you're saying here.
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Infinite Chaos said:
I'm only posting sporadically now because of life in the real world but I think I answered this last time...

http://www.debatepolitics.com/europ...s-target-youth-internet-9.html#post1061109842
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Yes, and that was a NON-answer then too.
The point, AGAIN, was that you clearly had the Bizarro idea "Islamist" was synonymous with "terrorist".

"Did they exist in the UK, Yes".... As if you thought there was even a question that Devout/political Muslims/Islam existed as a significant minority!
If you had even a vague understanding of the word, you would not have made this sentence/claim.

NO, you were grudgingly admitting/Botching the word as if there were Only a Few "Islamists" because you were ClueLess that it was thousands of times more common than "terrorist" you conflated it with.
And... claiming that these people became "Islamists" because of "grievances" and that they "were being monitored buy MI5".
It showed you Thought "Islamist" meant "terrorist".

Most Islamists aren't caused by "grievances", nor do they have to be "monitored by MI5".
It was and still is Deluded, though as I pointed out, you have Only recently learned the difference and are now using the term correctly.

Citing your Old Vacuous non-answer AS an answer, just points out your trouble with the term, language, or worse. (likely the last)
 
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mbig said:
Yes, and that was a NON-answer then too.
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No, it was a polite way of saying your question was unintelligible. I speak English - Queen's English. Questions plainly put with correct grammar are easy to understand.

mbig said:
The point, AGAIN, was that you clearly had the Bizarro idea "Islamist" was synonymous with "terrorist".
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I don't recall saying that - terrorists come in all sorts of politics, some not even political. We have wide experience of a variety of terrorist in the UK - through the IRA to al-Q, Combat 18 and others.

mbig said:
"Did they exist in the UK, Yes".... As if you thought there was even a question that Devout/political Muslims/Islam existed as a significant minority!
If you had even a vague understanding of the word, you would not have made this sentence/claim.

NO, you were grudgingly admitting/Botching the word as if there were Only a Few "Islamists" because you were ClueLess that it was thousands of times more common than "terrorist" you conflated it with.
And... claiming that these people became "Islamists" because of "grievances" and that they "were being monitored buy MI5".
It showed you Thought "Islamist" meant "terrorist".

Most Islamists aren't caused by "grievances", nor do they have to be "monitored by MI5".
It was and still is Deluded, though as I pointed out, you have Only recently learned the difference and are now using the term correctly.
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Gobbledegook.

mbig said:
Citing your Old Vacuous non-answer AS an answer, just points out your trouble with the term, language, or worse. (likely the last)
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Look, I'm busy and enjoying a very busy summer holiday. Trying to decipher your posts is an exercise in patience at the best of times. My response at busy times is short and curt - I'll repeat myself - "it was a polite way of saying your question was unintelligible. I speak English - Queen's English. Questions plainly put with correct grammar are easy to understand."

If English is not your native language, there are translators that can help.
 
Seems we have more IslamISM at IslamIC schools
Of course, many non-violent Muslims, a significant minority, are IslamISTS.
The issue isn't going away.
At least the UK Govt seems much more on top of the issue now and it seems more a 'private' school issue.

21 November 2014
'Radicalisation risk' at six Muslim private schools, says Ofsted
By Hannah Richardson
BBC News education reporter
BBC News - 'Radicalisation risk' at six Muslim private schools, says Ofsted
Pupils at six small Muslim private schools in east London are at risk of extremist views and radicalisation, says Ofsted's chief inspector.

Sir Michael Wilshaw said the pupils' "physical and educational welfare is at serious risk" following a series of emergency inspections.
He said all the schools focused too heavily on Islamic teachings.

One of the schools called Ofsted "unprofessional", while another said its findings did not reflect reality.
Education Secretary Nicky Morgan says the schools will be closed down if changes are not made quickly.[.......]
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Muslim Pupils Confused Over Sharia And UK Law
Pupils at a Muslim school told inspectors it was a woman's job to stay at home and many could not say which laws to follow.
Ofsted inspectors found that pupils at a private London Muslim school were not able to tell the difference between Sharia law and English law.
Muslim Pupils Confused Over Sharia And UK Law
11/21/14


Inspectors concluded that young people at Mazahirul Uloom School in Tower Hamlets were being taught a narrow curriculum regularly focusing only on the Islamic faith and culture.
Many pupils told Ofsted that learning about other religions was wrong.

Some pupils told the watchdog that it was a woman's job to "stay at home and clean and look after the children", while others, when talking about Sharia law and English law, were unable to say which laws they should follow and which were more important.
Ofsted said pupils at the schools may be vulnerable to Extremist influences

The report, in which the watchdog concluded that children were not being prepared for life in a "diverse British society", is one of seven published on schools in the east London borough, including one STATE school - Sir John Cass Foundation and Redcoat Church of England School - and six independent schools, all of which have links to Islam.
[.......
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the Mirror
Muslim boy told Ofsted inspectors: If I study music I'll go to hell
Nov 21, 2014 23:27
By Martin Bagot
Inspectors were looking into schools after fears of Islamic extremism and one little boy in Year 1 said he believed he would go to hell if he took music or dance lessons
Muslim boy told Ofsted inspectors: If I study music I'll go to hell - Mirror Online
 
mbig said:
Seems we have more IslamISM at IslamIC schools
Of course, many non-violent Muslims, a significant minority, are IslamISTS.
The issue isn't going away.
At least the UK Govt seems much more on top of the issue now and it seems more a 'private' school issue.

21 November 2014
'Radicalisation risk' at six Muslim private schools, says Ofsted
By Hannah Richardson
BBC News education reporter
BBC News - 'Radicalisation risk' at six Muslim private schools, says Ofsted



Muslim Pupils Confused Over Sharia And UK Law
Pupils at a Muslim school told inspectors it was a woman's job to stay at home and many could not say which laws to follow.
Ofsted inspectors found that pupils at a private London Muslim school were not able to tell the difference between Sharia law and English law.
Muslim Pupils Confused Over Sharia And UK Law
11/21/14



the Mirror
Muslim boy told Ofsted inspectors: If I study music I'll go to hell
Nov 21, 2014 23:27
By Martin Bagot
Inspectors were looking into schools after fears of Islamic extremism and one little boy in Year 1 said he believed he would go to hell if he took music or dance lessons
Muslim boy told Ofsted inspectors: If I study music I'll go to hell - Mirror Online
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As I mentioned in another thread, it does seem the government are at last recognising the need for a joined up response. Communities, schools and colleges /Universities are expected to help to stem the spread of radicalization.

Paul
 
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