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I'm Pro-Life: Change My Mind

I know that facts can be selected to support whatever opinion you may desire to have supported.

I also know that a woman in Indiana who had been previously divorced and was between jobs had no income and no prospect of having an income very soon.

She took advantage of the Healthy Indiana Plan which is a Medicaid extension program initiated by Mike Pence when he was governor here.

She was fully insured at either no cost or a cost so low it might as well have been free.

She has since gained full time employment and has insurance through her employer.

In the US, the programs of health insurance are most often based on Employers.

As such, the best thing to do to provide HEALTH INSURANCE, not healthCARE, in the US is to fire up the economy as Trump had done before the covid shut downs.

Our health "experts" fumbled around on all sides of all questions and the willing dupes in our media parroted their insanity without question or review.

The problem(s) with our healthcare system are largely political.
Actually no, you will find that the anti abortion crowd does not have facts it only has emotional pleading and out right lies.

No, again, your system of health care helps only the employed but your system of capitalism means that by the rule of economics there must be a pool of unemployed. They are left with no health system to fall back on and what is given is inadequate. You have a three tier health system where the poor get very little the middle get only what is offered through private insurance which is more interested in profit than health and the rich who can afford anything the system offers. That is not a fair or equitable system.
 
There we have it. The heart of the problem, your understanding of the english language is abysmal. ( That means really bad) .

Neither of those two are euphemisms. Zef is an acronym (zygote, embryo, fetus.) While zygote is an actual word in its own right.
Talk about an abysmal understanding of English. LOL.

A euphemism is an expression (acronym, term or word) that replaces one considered to brutal, honest or unpleasant.

ZEF replaces baby. That is the euphemism. ZEF is a way to impersonalize the growing human life.
 
Talk about an abysmal understanding of English. LOL.

A euphemism is an expression (acronym, term or word) that replaces one considered to brutal, honest or unpleasant.

ZEF replaces baby. That is the euphemism. ZEF is a way to impersonalize the growing human life.
no, zef is a acronym. Nothing more or less. It might sound like an made up word being used as a euphemism but that would only be the case if someone found the acronym to be offensive in the first place. otherwise it is an accurate term for the unborn.
It is no more a euphemism than is calling a baby a child.
 
no, zef is a acronym. Nothing more or less. It might sound like an made up word being used as a euphemism but that would only be the case if someone found the acronym to be offensive in the first place. otherwise it is an accurate term for the unborn.
It is no more a euphemism than is calling a baby a child.
Nothing here refutes what I said and, if anything, supports it instead. Thank you.
 
Nothing here refutes what I said and, if anything, supports it instead. Thank you.
Of course it disputes what you said. Zef is no more a euphemism than is calling a baby a child. It is merely what all acronyms are, a shorter way of saying something.
 
Of course it disputes what you said. Zef is no more a euphemism than is calling a baby a child. It is merely what all acronyms are, a shorter way of saying something.
I will assume that one day you will understand what a euphemism is.
 
While I will go on accepting the fact that you are clueless about the meaning.
I pretty much wrote what the definition is in my explanation to you regarding my examples... LOL

You just got about as thorough a shellacking as anybody can receive 😆 🤭 😆

a mild or indirect word or expression substituted for one considered to be too harsh or blunt when referring to something unpleasant or embarrassing.
https://www.google.com/search?q=def...nMBHThEAiQQ4dUDCA4&uact=5&safe=active&ssui=on
 
I pretty much wrote what the definition is in my explanation to you regarding my examples... LOL

You just got about as thorough a shellacking as anybody can receive 😆 🤭 😆

a mild or indirect word or expression substituted for one considered to be too harsh or blunt when referring to something unpleasant or embarrassing.
https://www.google.com/search?q=def...nMBHThEAiQQ4dUDCA4&uact=5&safe=active&ssui=on
But your definition is not the case here. Anti abortions might find the word zef offensive but only because they prefer to lie and call it a baby instead so that they can give an emotional plea.
However the acronym zef is an accurate description of the life in a womb.

If you find the contents of a pregnant woman womb to be something that is unpleasant or embarrassing to you then you have a problem not the english language.
 
If you find the contents of a pregnant woman womb to be something that is unpleasant or embarrassing to you then you have a problem not the english language.
I am pro-choice playing devil's advocate.
But your definition is not the case here. Anti abortions might find the word zef offensive but only because they prefer to lie and call it a baby instead so that they can give an emotional plea.
However the acronym zef is an accurate description of the life in a womb.
So is baby. I am arguing that calling it a ZEF instead of a baby, to them, is a euphemism to make an emotional detachment from a baby. You think that calling it a baby is a euphemism trying to add an emotional attachment to a ZEF. You are both right. That is the point.

...and yes, it can be honestly considered a baby. A baby is a child and a child can be an unborn. Follow the definitions.

BABY
an extremely young child

CHILD
an unborn
 
I am pro-choice playing devil's advocate.

So is baby. I am arguing that calling it a ZEF instead of a baby, to them, is a euphemism to make an emotional detachment from a baby. You think that calling it a baby is a euphemism trying to add an emotional attachment to a ZEF. You are both right. That is the point.

...and yes, it can be honestly considered a baby. A baby is a child and a child can be an unborn. Follow the definitions.

BABY
an extremely young child

CHILD
an unborn
It is not your pro choice stance I was referring to there. It was your insistence on the definition you gave that is the problem.

But it is a baby only if we agree that word baby is in fact a euphemism for what it actually is while growing in a womb, a zef. A baby is the word used for after the child is born , not before.
No, you are using the word baby or child as a euphemism for a fetus. .
In the example given in the dictionary if it was the case that megan was having an abortion instead of a child then it would be referred to her aborting a fetus not a child. But because she is having a child and wants to, then common courtesy states that the fetus should be referred to as a child.

That is just custom. Accuracy in the language though is another thing. And the accurate term for the life growing in a pregnant woman is zef.

The dictionary is a poor choice to use as it gives only definitions that are customary to the word, ie. the most often used. Dictionaries do not give the only definition. Context also gives definition to words.
 
ANY POINT.
If anyone, not just you, states something as positive, they should provide a link to the information that backs up what they are claiming, otherwise it is JUST opinion.
Nothing wrong with opinion, but when people state opinions and pass them off as "facts", then they are following the Fox News rule: just state opinion as fact and never back up your facts with any evidence.
Example: The Stolen Election. So many, on the Right, saying it was definitely stolen, but never can back that claim up with any evidence.
Funny how that works, isn't it?

Link?
 
To the claims in post 963.

I have no link to show thqt you know anything about the afterlife. You also omitted that from your post.

Here is a link regarding the Number of ICU beds per person in various countries.

Whether it's a Saudi Prince or a European Monarch, when they want the best care for a tricky ailment, they come to the US to get it.

<snip>


Further data from the UK, with very few ICU beds, suggested that their provision of intensive care was too low [30]. This possibility was supported by a number of studies which showed many patients denied intensive care due to a lack of beds [31], many patients discharged from the ICU prematurely [32], and a reduction in mortality (with steady severity of illness) when more ICU beds were built throughout the country [30].

Table 1​

Selected ICU Bed Availability by country with per capita healthcare spending and life expectancy at birth [3, 6, 2227]*
Country​
ICU beds per 100,000 people​
Per Capita Healthcare Cost**​
Life Expectancy at Birth​
United States​
20.0–31.7​
$7,164​
79​
Canada​
13.5​
$3,867​
81​
Denmark​
6.7–8.9​
$3,814​
79​
Australia​
8.0–8.9​
$3,365​
82​
South Africa​
8.9​
$843​
54​
Sweden​
5.8–8.7​
$3,622​
81​
Spain​
8.2–9.7​
$2,941​
82​
Japan​
7.9​
$2,817​
83​
UK​
3.5–7.4​
$3,222​
80​
New Zealand​
4.8–5.5​
$2,655​
81​
China​
2.8–4.6​
$265​
74​
Trinidad & Tobago​
2.1​
$1,237​
70​
Sri Lanka​
1.6​
$187​
71​
Zambia​
--​
$80​
48​

Open in a separate window
*Estimates are pooled from multiple sources and involve different definitions of ICU beds, and different years of data
**includes all public and private expenditures, not limited to critical care
<snip>

As with almost anything you may care to Google, you can also find that the US has almost no ICU beds available by using a different source.

This question rose for me at the early part of the Covid Pandemic when doctors in Italy and the UK were rigging systems to use pon ventilator to serve several patients.

There were also reports of various places in Europe with patients in hallways and garages obviously without ventilators, but also without beds or even rooms.

Here in the US various ventilator ideas were floated, but the chosen solution was a Federal Clearing House to manage distribution of existing ventilators as a "Step 1".

Step 2 was to create the systems needed to manufacture the needed units with capacity exceeding dometic demand by Summer 2020.

Trump and his team did both to great effect and positive impact.
 
How ridiculous are you planning on being. No one is making the argument that a pregnant woman owns the pregnancy or that she can do as she pleases. I have already given you a link that demonstrates that a woman has legal responsibility to the health and welfare of the fetus , post 915# if you care to look again.

Nor is there any state where the recently born is owned by anyone. Those that are born have rights.

This is not explaining how you manage to align to contradictory views.

What are the contradictory views?
 
Actually no, you will find that the anti abortion crowd does not have facts it only has emotional pleading and out right lies.

No, again, your system of health care helps only the employed but your system of capitalism means that by the rule of economics there must be a pool of unemployed. They are left with no health system to fall back on and what is given is inadequate. You have a three tier health system where the poor get very little the middle get only what is offered through private insurance which is more interested in profit than health and the rich who can afford anything the system offers. That is not a fair or equitable system.

Human life is an emotional plea. Okay...

The system is what it is.

I have heard that drugs in the US cost far more than elsewhere.

I have assumed that the excess monies charged in the US help to support research for drugs, equipment and treatments developed world wide.

I could be wrong. One thing is certain: The drug companies here pay plenty to place politicians who favor their price structures in US elected offices.

Our insurance companies here exist to pay the Doctors. They pay what the doctors charge.

Somehow, the doctors charing the exorbitant prices are the good guys and the insurance folks paying the high bills are the bad guys.

I've never understood this public relations triumph. Probably just one more case of confuse to deceive.
 
Very few people find abortion to be pleasant.


PLEASANT?

What a way to describe the horrible torture and killing of a human.
Very few people find personally killing the chicken they're going to eat to be......... "pleasant."


Imho.....for all the leftist talks about compassion and inclusivity.....and, charity and empathy......then, you see a comment like that....

.........................it feels like listening to a Ted Bundy.




Something's terribly broken with people who support abortion.
 
Last edited:
I have no link to show thqt you know anything about the afterlife. You also omitted that from your post.

Here is a link regarding the Number of ICU beds per person in various countries.

Whether it's a Saudi Prince or a European Monarch, when they want the best care for a tricky ailment, they come to the US to get it.

I'm going to respond to the numbers for Canada (my country). Though we have fewer ICU beds per population and spend less per capita, we have a longer life expectancy. That could be due to a healthier population due to universal health care. Everyone can access preventive medicine. Diabetics aren't dying because they are rationing insulin due to high cost etc.

Thank you for the link.
 
PLEASANT?

What a way to describe the horrible torture and killing of a human.
Very few people find personally killing the chicken they're going to eat to be......... "pleasant."


Imho.....for all the leftist talks about compassion and inclusivity.....and, charity and empathy......then, you see a comment like that....

.........................it feels like listening to a Ted Bundy.




Something's terribly broken with people who support abortion.
Nobody is talking about torturing a zef. Not.one.single.person. And I am not a leftist.

Something's terribly broken with people who support forcing women to gestate and give birth against their will.
 
Human life is an emotional plea. Okay...

The system is what it is.

I have heard that drugs in the US cost far more than elsewhere.

I have assumed that the excess monies charged in the US help to support research for drugs, equipment and treatments developed world wide.

I could be wrong. One thing is certain: The drug companies here pay plenty to place politicians who favor their price structures in US elected offices.

Our insurance companies here exist to pay the Doctors. They pay what the doctors charge.

Somehow, the doctors charing the exorbitant prices are the good guys and the insurance folks paying the high bills are the bad guys.

I've never understood this public relations triumph. Probably just one more case of confuse to deceive.
So you are saying that you can not think of even one good reason to care about human life. It's al just emotional pleading rather than good reasoning.

No, your insurance companies main objective is to create profit for its shareholders. That would be the same for pharmacies.
 
Nobody is talking about torturing a zef. Not.one.single.person. And I am not a leftist.

Something's terribly broken with people who support forcing women to gestate and give birth against their will.

Of course you guys don't wanna talk about torturing the fetus.

Something's terribly broken with people who support women who don't prevent unwanted pregnancy.
A lot of them are even doing it repeatedly! It's not only barbaric. It's IDIOTIC!



Read my lips:
THERE IS NO LONGER ANY EXCUSE FOR WOMEN TO HAVE A SINGLE
UNWANTED PREGNANCY.




That excuse is gone.
You carry on like as if you're still way back there, lost in time!


Get into the 21st century!
 
Of course you guys don't wanna talk about torturing the fetus.

Something's terribly broken with people who support women who don't prevent unwanted pregnancy.
A lot of them are even doing it repeatedly! It's not only barbaric. It's IDIOTIC!


Read my lips:
THERE IS NO LONGER ANY EXCUSE FOR WOMEN TO HAVE A SINGLE
UNWANTED PREGNANCY.



That excuse is gone.
You carry on like as if you're still way back there, lost in time!

Get into the 21st century!


I agree, hence why abortion is legal and prochoice laws are typical of first world countries with governments based on rights and freedoms.
the 21st century is already here! LMAO
 
I agree, hence why abortion is legal and prochoice laws are typical of first world countries with governments based on rights and freedoms.
the 21st century is already here! LMAO


Rights and freedom. Funny you should mention that.
Something's terribly broken with our system when we can decide which human can have rights and freedom.

Human Laws can change.
We just saw that happened when the unborn was stripped of his rights as a human being.
 
Rights and freedom. Funny you should mention that.
funny? nope just spot on. the rights and freedoms of women are not going to go backwards in a country lie ours :)
Something's terribly broken with our system when we can decide which human can have rights and freedom.
I agree thats why america is not goint to infringe on woman's legal, human and civil rights and freedoms
Human Laws can change. We just saw that happened when the unborn was stripped of his rights as a human being.
That never happened in america so no worries 🤷‍♂️ 😁
 
Of course you guys don't wanna talk about torturing the fetus.

Something's terribly broken with people who support women who don't prevent unwanted pregnancy.
A lot of them are even doing it repeatedly! It's not only barbaric. It's IDIOTIC!



Read my lips:
THERE IS NO LONGER ANY EXCUSE FOR WOMEN TO HAVE A SINGLE
UNWANTED PREGNANCY.




That excuse is gone.
You carry on like as if you're still way back there, lost in time!


Get into the 21st century!
If you want to debate with me, please stop w/ the coloured huge fonts. Thanks.
 
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