ICE agents denied entry to Dodger Stadium

[The Brad Dad]

When it comes to those in the country illegally, due process is absolutely circumstantial.

it’s not. You don’t have a foundational understanding of due process, or the constitution’s position on it. You cannot get around “all persons” and there is no case law you can cite that would provide a revocation of that.

 

[Hello My Son]

Due process isn’t fungible. If a child came up to me with ice cream all over his shirt and face and sputtered “Due process is circumstantial” it would be slightly more credible than your post insisting the same.

Aren’t you making the argument that it is fungible—which would mean that different applications of due process are equal and interchangeable?

Non-fungible would mean that different applications of due process are not comparable.

 

[The Brad Dad]

Aren’t you making the argument that it is fungible

No, I’m not. If due process is fungible from person to person. It’s not a process. Judges first and foremost use a basis of comparison, or series of questions to adjudicate the scenario of a person standing in front of them. The questions don’t change. The “if this, then that” tree doesn’t change. The Trump admin has tried to argue, and keeps losing, that essentially whatever it declares as due process is the process in and of itself. That’s unconstitutional.

 

[Hello My Son]

No, I’m not. If due process is fungible from person to person. It’s not a process.

That's not what fungible means. Fungible means that one thing is equally interchangeable with another thing.

Like how US dollars could be exchanged for Euros, gold, or stocks. Those are all fungible and can be equated.

You seem to be arguing that due process is supposed to be equally applied in all circumstances, which would make it a fungible concept.

Non-fungible would mean unequal variables/applications of due process exist and that they are not interchangeable with one another due to differences.

Judges first and foremost use a basis of comparison, or series of questions to adjudicate the scenario of a person standing in front of them. The questions don’t change. The “if this, then that” tree doesn’t change.

Are you suggesting that all judges, in all types of civil and criminal proceedings, rely on the same script to all defendants?

The Trump admin has tried to argue, and keeps losing, that essentially whatever it declares as due process is the process in and of itself. That’s unconstitutional.

That's not correct. The IIRAIRA has been settled for nearly 30 years now.

 

[CimpleMan]

Enough with "new sheriff in town" round ups. You're also harassing Americans just living their lives.

If you went after tax cheats with the same zeal you might actually make dent in the deficit.

 

[The Brad Dad]

That's not what fungible means. Fungible means that one thing is equally interchangeable with another thing.

Like how US dollars could be exchanged for Euros, gold, or stocks. Those are all fungible and can be equated.

You seem to be arguing that due process is supposed to be equally applied in all circumstances, which would make it a fungible concept.



Are you suggesting that all judges, in all types of civil and criminal proceedings, rely on the same script to all defendants?



That's not correct. The IIRAIRA has been settled for nearly 30 years now.

You’re so close. The government is arguing anything they label as a process is the process necessary. They are saying it’s fungible. I am saying it’s not, as that’s not how due process works.

No, I am not suggesting judges do that even a little.

 

[j brown's body]

Lmao, the “kid” who is a 20 year old ADULT and who is now charged with punching a federal official? Yeah, they were following the law.

On the other hand, he wasn’t, which is why he’s now facing a felony. Play stupid games, win stupid prizes.

Funny that you left out his little act of impeding and punching a federal agent. It’s almost as if you’re not making honest posts on purpose…

Feds say man punched agents at Pico Rivera Walmart - security footage shows no punches

Federal agents arrested Adrian Martinez outside a Pico Rivera Walmart after they said he punched two agents. Security footage from the store doesn't appear to show Martinez throwing punches.

www.foxla.com

 

[Hello My Son]

You’re so close. The government is arguing anything they label as a process is the process necessary. They are saying it’s fungible. I am saying it’s not, as that’s not how due process works.

Regardless of what the government is doing and what they are calling it, what is your position? Are you saying that due process should or should not be fungible? You appear to be rushing through your posts and, as a result, what you're trying to say is unclear and it's coming across like you're contradicting yourself in multiple parts of the discussion.

For example, as far as judges go, you said this:

Judges first and foremost use a basis of comparison, or series of questions to adjudicate the scenario of a person standing in front of them. The questions don’t change. The “if this, then that” tree doesn’t change.

So I asked this:

Are you suggesting that all judges, in all types of civil and criminal proceedings, rely on the same script to all defendants?

And then you said this:

No, I am not suggesting judges do that even a little.

Without slowing down and engaging in a more thorough explanation of your position, it's very unclear, and it doesn't help that you're misapplying multiple terms (i.e. fungible, abjudicate, which means "to reject or prohibit" so they aren't "abjudicating the scenario of a person standing in front of them" because one cannot "reject or prohibit" someone else's scenario).

 

[The Brad Dad]

Regardless of what the government is doing and what they are calling it, what is your position? Are you saying that due process should or should not be fungible? You appear to be rushing through your posts and, as a result, what you're trying to say is unclear and it's coming across like you're contradicting yourself in multiple parts of the discussion.

For example, as far as judges go, you said this:



So I asked this:



And then you said this:



Without slowing down and engaging in a more thorough explanation of your position, it's very unclear, and it doesn't help that you're misapplying multiple terms (i.e. fungible, abjudicate, which means "to reject or prohibit" so they aren't "abjudicating the scenario of a person standing in front of them" because one cannot "reject or prohibit" someone else's scenario).

My position is the government has been acting unconstitutionally and denying due process to most of the individuals it’s kidnapping off city streets.

 

[NatMorton]

it’s not. You don’t have a foundational understanding of due process, or the constitution’s position on it. You cannot get around “all persons” and there is no case law you can cite that would provide a revocation of that.

Once again, why should I believe what you say?

 

[Grizzly Adams]

The evidence shows it was due to an operation somewhere else

Like he said.

with no evidence of car trouble.

Other than most of the vehicles departing except a couple left behind... for a picnic?

 

[Absentglare]

No, just asking a question that would seem to have stumped you.

Are you under the laughably false impression that it was necessary for them to break into dodger’s stadium and take private property in order to protect the border?

 

[Absentglare]

When it comes to those in the country illegally, due process is absolutely circumstantial. I've provided a cite that proves this. Let's see your evidence to the contrary.

Due process just means there’s a formal legal process where they can defend themselves.

If anyone can be accused and robbed of the right to defend themselves, then no one has due process.

It’s unconstitutional and a gross violation of rights. Why do you think cops need to break the law?

 

[The Brad Dad]

Once again, why should I believe what you say?

When it’s as important to me as it is to you, you’ll have your answer.

 

[NatMorton]

Are you under the laughably false impression that it was necessary for them to break into dodger’s stadium and take private property in order to protect the border?

No.

 

[j brown's body]

Like he said.


Other than most of the vehicles departing except a couple left behind... for a picnic?

The spokesman did not say that, a person on the scene did.

They could produce evidence as there is no view of any car being worked on or towed for service.

I have evidence - and lack of it in the spokesman's case.. All you have speculation.

 

[The Brad Dad]

Due process just means there’s a formal legal process where they can defend themselves.

If anyone can be accused and robbed of the right to defend themselves, then no one has due process.

It’s unconstitutional and a gross violation of rights. Why do you think cops need to break the law?

Perfect post on the topic.

 

[Absentglare]

No.

Oh good then you debunked your silly argument that it was their job to raid dodger’s stadium.

 

[NatMorton]

When it’s as important to me as it is to you, you’ll have your answer.

Your posts are becoming even more irrational.

 

[NatMorton]

Oh good then you debunked your silly argument that it was their job to raid dodger’s stadium.

Where did I make that claim? Be specific.

 

[NatMorton]

Perfect post on the topic.

Perfectly confused, yes.

 

[j brown's body]

When it comes to those in the country illegally, due process is absolutely circumstantial. I've provided a cite that proves this. Let's see your evidence to the contrary.

As a conservative, conservatives traditionally being suspicious of government power, why wouldn't support a stringent use of due process?

 

[Hello My Son]

Feds say man punched agents at Pico Rivera Walmart - security footage shows no punches

Federal agents arrested Adrian Martinez outside a Pico Rivera Walmart after they said he punched two agents. Security footage from the store doesn't appear to show Martinez throwing punches.

www.foxla.com

Lol grainy security footage from across the parking lot that is spliced and doesn't show the entire series of events, let alone anything close enough to determine whether the suspect took a swing at an agent. One has to ask if the news organization intentionally used the worst footage possible when better footage was already available....and there is undoubtedly more footage from other angles due to body cam footage from the agents involved.

One thing's for sure, he took the fight to the agents, was told multiple times to clear out and go away, but kept aggressively coming toward the agents. That's illegal no matter how you slice it.

As I said before, play stupid games, win stupid prizes. This "kid" is prime evidence that Neanderthal DNA continues to exist in human bloodlines.

 

[Hello My Son]

My position is the government has been acting unconstitutionally and denying due process to most of the individuals it’s kidnapping off city streets.

Is it your position that the IIRAIRA is unconstitutional?

 

[The Brad Dad]

s I said before, play stupid games, win stupid prizes. This "kid" is prime evidence that Neanderthal DNA continues to exist in human bloodlines

You should see what applies to become ICE personnel. There’s a reason they wear masks.