Group wnats Prophet Mohammad ads on trains. [W:381, 439]

[Unrepresented]

Re: Group wnats Prophet Mohammad ads on trains.

If you want to promote civility then direct your suggestions to those who would commit murder to stop others from speaking.

Why take the bait?

 

[Zyphlin]

Group wnats Prophet Mohammad ads on trains.

Nope, thats according your complete misunderstanding of my statements. Here is a suggestion Zyphlin - which you have refused to even consider - if this lady wants the pictures to be shown, she should start handing out window stickers to her supporters that way those who hold that mentality can be easily identified and no one else is associated with them. That allows her free speech to exist and people who are riding buses are not put at risk because she wants to get some cheap shots at Muslims. Do you agree? Or should people riding these buses be put at risk because of her opinion?

I've already said, I don't agree with the notion of putting this on a bus as a form of protest. It's a childish, juvenile, purposefully offensive thing that I find to be ridiculous. However, I don't believe it's significantly putting anyone's life at risk and it absolutely doesn't rise to a level where she should be legally disallowed from purchasing said ad space.

That's the seeming difference between you and I, despite how many times you attempt to misrepresent and distort what I am saying.

We both disagree with the action.

The difference is you seem to think it shouldn't be allowable under the law and or be considered constitutionally protected means of speech. I think it should be.

My "support" of her legal right to do this is not hte same as "support" for the actual action being done.

I'd much prefer she went about this in a different fashion for a multitude of reasons, though public safety is low on that list as I don't believe it's a significant threat to public safety. But that doesn't mean I feel like she should be legally barred from doing such.

 

[Hatuey]

Re: Group wnats Prophet Mohammad ads on trains.

I've already said, I don't agree with the notion of putting this on a bus as a form of protest.

Great, neither do I. I haven't even been on a bus since I was in my teens and yet I recognize that this kind of 'protest' (which let's face it, is thinly veiled xenophobia and anti-Muslim sentiment ) would make those riding a bus targets for any muslim extremist who can't afford C4. Again, this is VASTLY different than that which the Muslim community would even care about. The vast majority of Muslims in the US have acknowledged that xenophobia and anti-Muslim sentiment have become koscher. However, it's that small 1% that would take such sentiment to the extreme that is the problem.

It's a childish, juvenile, purposefully offensive thing that I find to be ridiculous. However, I don't believe it's significantly putting anyone's life at risk and it absolutely doesn't rise to a level where she should be legally disallowed from purchasing said ad space.

That's the seeming difference between you and I, despite how many times you attempt to misrepresent and distort what I am saying.

We both disagree with the action.

The difference is you seem to think it shouldn't (benefit of the doubt you're not ignorant of the law enough to think that it actually isn't) be allowable under the law and or be considered constitutionally protected means of speech. I think it should be.

My "support" of her legal right to do this is not hte same as "support" for the actual action being done.

I'd much prefer she went about this in a different fashion for a multitude of reasons, though public safety is low on that list as I don't believe it's a significant threat to public safety. But that doesn't mean I feel like she should be legally barred from doing such.

That's great, I oppose it based on reality and the real risks which the people riding the bus would face, you support it based on some absurd notion of the world. As I said, if she wants to make a public statement, she has every right to do so, what she doesn't have a right to do is risk the safety of others while doing so. Any bus company that is even remotely aware of the potential dangers and liability would deny her request to use these spaces and I wouldn't fault them for it. Her freedom of speech is not more important than the safety of passengers.

 

[jmotivator]

Re: Group wnats Prophet Mohammad ads on trains.

Why take the bait?

What bait?

 

[Unrepresented]

Re: Group wnats Prophet Mohammad ads on trains.

What bait?

Mocking their religion is mutually destructive. Being respectful is mutually beneficial.

This is basic game theory in action: both sides gain with peace, both sides loose with provocation.

 

[rocket88]

Re: Group wnats Prophet Mohammad ads on trains.

So Piss Christ is OK and Christians should just get over it, but a drawing of Mohambone should be avoided because someone might be offended and homocidal? Maybe Christians need to step up their game. Evidently we're not being taken seriously.

So holocaust denial is Ok with you? I thought you'd support Israel. Huh...

Ironically, you are supporting Piss Christ as you are totally good with being confrontational. Good for you.

 

[Kobie]

Re: Group wnats Prophet Mohammad ads on trains.

it sounded like that's where you were going by arguing she doesn't have a right to a forum for her speech...why else mention it?

She DOESN'T have a right to a forum for her speech. While it's legal for her to try to get the ads on the buses, it's also legal for whoever runs said public transit, even if it's a government entity, to tell her to go piss up a tree. She doesn't have the right to hang a picture of Mohammed on the Capitol dome either.

 

[Kobie]

Re: Group wnats Prophet Mohammad ads on trains.

So Piss Christ is OK and Christians should just get over it, but a drawing of Mohambone should be avoided because someone might be offended and homocidal? Maybe Christians need to step up their game. Evidently we're not being taken seriously.

I would hope Christians might someday get over "Piss Christ," since that's from 1987. Apparently a nearly 30-year-old slight (which was less a criticism of religion and more a criticism of the commercialization of religion, for what that's worth) still stings.

 

[Hatuey]

Re: Group wnats Prophet Mohammad ads on trains.

So Piss Christ is OK and Christians should just get over it, but a drawing of Mohambone should be avoided because someone might be offended and homocidal? Maybe Christians need to step up their game. Evidently we're not being taken seriously.

Ah yes, Piss Christ, that example of Christian tolerance. They were so tolerant of it that the artist lost funding, received death threads, had his work attacked across the world and was grossly misunderstood by the hordes of Christian faithful who only heard the words "Piss" and "Christ" in the same sentence. Is that what you're saying Christians should just get over? Wait, I don't think you actually know the history of that piece of work. I think you just bring it up without really having a grasp on just how "tolerant" your religion has been towards it. Carry on. It's absurdly funny.

 

[Kobie]

Re: Group wnats Prophet Mohammad ads on trains.

Ah yes, Piss Christ, that example of Christian tolerance. They were so tolerant of it that the artist lost funding, received death threads, had his work attacked across the world and was grossly misunderstood by the hordes of Christian faithful who only heard the words "Piss" and "Christ" in the same sentence. Is that what you're saying Christians should just get over? Wait, I don't think you actually know the history of that piece of work. I think you just bring it up without really having a grasp on just how "tolerant" your religion has been towards it. Carry on. It's absurdly funny.

But nobody tried to kill him, that we know of. So this is totes different.

 

[Hatuey]

Re: Group wnats Prophet Mohammad ads on trains.

But nobody tried to kill him, that we know of. So this is totes different.

See, the thing is Kobie, Andres Serrano is actually a Christian himself but most people who talk about Piss Christ don't know this. So what do they do? They complain about the guy's work from over 25 years ago and pretend like it is still relevant in art circles today. It really isn't, however when it was, THE LAST THING CHRISTIANS DID was tolerate the guy. I don't fault them for it, people tend to get angry over little **** that I personally don't take all that serious. However, it's extremely funny that people keep bringing up that particular piece of art as an example of Christian tolerance when it's been vandalized by Christians more times than a New York subway station. Talk about not having a grasp of art history.

 

[Kobie]

Re: Group wnats Prophet Mohammad ads on trains.

See, the thing is Kobie, Andres Serrano is actually a Christian himself but most people who talk about Piss Christ don't know this. So what do they do? They complain about the guy's work from over 25 years ago and pretend like it is still relevant in art circles today. It really isn't, however when it was, THE LAST THING CHRISTIANS DID was tolerate the guy. I don't fault them for it, people tend to get angry over little **** that I personally don't take all that serious. However, it's extremely funny that people keep bringing up that particular piece of art as an example of Christian tolerance when it's been vandalized by Christians more times than a New York subway station. Talk about not having a grasp of art history.

Oh, I'm aware. From Wikipedia:

"He has also said that while this work is not intended to denounce religion, it alludes to a perceived commercializing or cheapening of Christian icons in contemporary culture."

That bastard.

 

[Hatuey]

Re: Group wnats Prophet Mohammad ads on trains.

Oh, I'm aware. From Wikipedia:

"He has also said that while this work is not intended to denounce religion, it alludes to a perceived commercializing or cheapening of Christian icons in contemporary culture."

That bastard.

Do you know what type of Christian complains about Piss Christ? The kind who hears Bill O'Reilly and Megan Kelly and really thinks "How dare they try and make Santa anything other than white! There really is a war on Christmas!" That's the sort of Christian who normally talks about Piss Christ. You'll never catch these people at a museum or reading the art section on a newspaper (because I doubt they read anything with the word 'art' in it). They're the type of Americans you catch the Louvre complaining about everything being in French. Know the type? Yeah.

 

[X Factor]

Re: Group wnats Prophet Mohammad ads on trains.

I'm sure all the defenders of "Piss Christ" would be equally supportive of "Piss Muhammed". Lol.

 

[Hatuey]

Re: Group wnats Prophet Mohammad ads on trains.

I'm sure all the defenders of "Piss Christ" would be equally supportive of "Piss Muhammed". Lol.

Is there such a thing? Or are you just making another silly hypothetical because you've run out of silly claims that are disproven if you do a simple forum search? Good grief, take a break from DP. Get some new material. Maybe something that doesn't make you look like you need a tampon.

PS: don't worry about reporting this post. I've already done it.

 

[Kobie]

Re: Group wnats Prophet Mohammad ads on trains.

I'm sure all the defenders of "Piss Christ" would be equally supportive of "Piss Muhammed". Lol.

Nobody is "defending" Piss Christ. Good lord, get a grip.

 

[X Factor]

Re: Group wnats Prophet Mohammad ads on trains.

Is there such a thing? Or are you just making another silly hypothetical because you've run out of silly claims that are disproven if you do a simple forum search? Good grief, take a break from DP. Get some new material. Maybe something that doesn't make you look like you need a tampon.

PS: don't worry about reporting this post. I've already done it.

Hey, seriously, don't report yourself for anything you say to me. I'm not offended by your comment and I don't think you should be dinged for it.

 

[X Factor]

Re: Group wnats Prophet Mohammad ads on trains.

Is there such a thing? Or are you just making another silly hypothetical because you've run out of silly claims that are disproven if you do a simple forum search? Good grief, take a break from DP. Get some new material. Maybe something that doesn't make you look like you need a tampon.

PS: don't worry about reporting this post. I've already done it.

Y'know, while this is a bit colorfully stated, you have a fair point. I've been on far too much today and that's rarely a good thing. A break would be a good idea.

 

[jmotivator]

Re: Group wnats Prophet Mohammad ads on trains.

Mocking their religion is mutually destructive. Being respectful is mutually beneficial.

No, by being "respectful" you are following their religious law for fear of reprisal.

This is basic game theory in action: both sides gain with peace, both sides loose with provocation.

Not when the other side is a death cult that believes that war in the Middle East will ring about a divine Caliph who will bring the world under Islamic law.

 

[Unrepresented]

Re: Group wnats Prophet Mohammad ads on trains.

No, by being "respectful" you are following their religious law for fear of reprisal.



Not when the other side is a death cult that believes that war in the Middle East will ring about a divine Caliph who will bring the world under Islamic law.

I recognize that both "sides" and everyone between is harmed by violence and unrest. Wishing to prevent violence is not simply to protect myself but to protect them.

 

[jmotivator]

Re: Group wnats Prophet Mohammad ads on trains.

I recognize that both "sides" and everyone between is harmed by violence and unrest. Wishing to prevent violence is not simply to protect myself but to protect them.

Doing what they say due to threat of violence only encourages more threats and violence.

 

[Montecresto]

Re: Group wnats Prophet Mohammad ads on trains.

Actually, some seem to be arguing that she doesn't...or at the very least that she SHOULDN'T...so I don't think it's that much of a "given" unfortunately.

There's a huge difference between doesn't and shouldn't. She most certainly shouldn't.

 

[Montecresto]

Re: Group wnats Prophet Mohammad ads on trains.

]I'm sure all the defenders of "Piss Christ"[/B] would be equally supportive of "Piss Muhammed". Lol.

Who would this be.

 

[Zyphlin]

Re: Group wnats Prophet Mohammad ads on trains.

There's a huge difference between doesn't and shouldn't. She most certainly shouldn't.

She most certainly should from the context my post was referencing, in that she should have the right to such speech. I don't agree with others on this thread that seem to think we should change the meaning and legal structure of free speech because a significant minority group of a minority group (those who will actually act out of those who are extreme Islamists) MIGHT act in an irrational and unreasonable manner in relation to some speech

 

[Grant]

Re: Group wnats Prophet Mohammad ads on trains.

There's a huge difference between doesn't and shouldn't. She most certainly shouldn't.

That's what the supporters of Sharia Law say, only in stronger terms. But the outcome is still the same.