GOP senators steer clear of Trump as rift deepens

[Peacenik]

I'll stop short of using the term 'deplorable', but will very much agree with the content of your post.

Thanks for the reply.

When the 'deplorables' discussion comes up I remind people that Hillary never called the entire Republican party that. She said there was a portion of the Republican party that she would place in what she called a basket of deplorables. And she was right. If fine upstanding Republicans are taking issue with that and believe they were called deplorable that is their own mistake for getting taken in by propaganda.

People really should stop listening to Tucker Carlson. He is definitely deplorable. He spreads hatred. He is just a talk pundit whose job it is to get people angry. He knows that gets attention, hooks viewers, and sells advertising. He is super rich because he gets so many people so angry. And in so doing, he hurts America. He is poison to American politics.

 

[Chomsky]

When the 'deplorables' discussion comes up I remind people that Hillary never called the entire Republican party that. She said there was a portion of the Republican party that she would place in what she called a basket of deplorables. And she was right. If fine upstanding Republicans are taking issue with that and believe they were called deplorable that is their own mistake for getting taken in by propaganda.

People really should stop listening to Tucker Carlson. He is definitely deplorable. He spreads hatred. He is just a talk pundit whose job it is to get people angry. He knows that gets attention, hooks viewers, and sells advertising. He is super rich because he gets so many people so angry. And in so doing, he hurts America. He is poison to American politics.

Yeah - but it was a crappy thing to say about her fellow Americans, especially given she was a Presidential candidate.

 

[RIP U.S. Democracy]

If at all!

As I described above, this appears to be a midterm strategy.

But that mindset may leave open the possibility of a 2024 defection, if the opportunity presented itself, as unlikely as that may seem to be.

Also, remember these are GOP Senators. The house is an entirely different matter.

I don't think it matters if there is a rift. Whoever the Republican Presidential nominee is in 2024 is going to be just as evil and dangerous as Trump.

No Republican is going to win the nomination without talking bat-shit crazy. It's that simple.

 

[Allan]

However, some of us waiting/hoping for a fissure to occur between the GOP Congress and Trump, may find the article interesting.

I hope this rift grows. It would be fantastic to see two competent parties once again in the US.

 

[RIP U.S. Democracy]

Yeah - but it was a crappy thing to say about her fellow Americans, especially given she was a Presidential candidate.

Was it? The people who attacked the Capitol on Jan 6 represent the majority of the Republican Party in my opinion.

 

[Allan]

Here's what I think is basically going on. Yes, all they care about is winning. They recognize that without trump, they lose a lot of his supporters which is most of their voters, and with trump they lose other voters and he's a petty dictator, so they want to have it both ways.

Do they though? Those people aren't going to switch to supporting the Democrats.

 

[Chomsky]

I don't think it matters if there is a rift. Whoever the Republican Presidential nominee is in 2024 is going to be just as evil and dangerous as Trump.

I don't think so.

The only serious GOP Trump contender I see, would be DeSantis. He's a super smart guy, well educated, with what seems like a good sense of his base and Trumpian politics.

Yes, DeSantis will play to Trump's base, and he will say & do some batshit crazy stuff. His policies will be much of everything I do not want.

However, DeSantis is not 'batshit crazy'! He will not go off the rails to the extent Trump may. Trump, is truly crazy. DeSantis just uses it to his advantage. I see a difference, even though they both suck.

No Republican is going to win the nomination without talking bat-shit crazy. It's that simple.

Agreed. Absolutely.

It's going to be Big Lie & CRT all the way . . .

 

[RIP U.S. Democracy]

Do they though? Those people aren't going to switch to supporting the Democrats.

No, that's wishful thinking. The Republicans won't lose a single voter if they abandon Trump. Josh Hawley or Ted Cruz or some other sinister **** will fill the bat-shit crazy void left by Trump.

 

[RIP U.S. Democracy]

I don't think so.

The only serious GOP Trump contender I see, would be DeSantis. He's a super smart guy, well educated, with what seems like a good sense of his base and Trumpian politics.

Yes, DeSantis will play to Trump's base, and he will say & do some batshit crazy stuff. His policies will be much of everything I do not want.

However, DeSantis is not 'batshit crazy'! He will not go off the rails to the extent Trump may. Trump, is truly crazy. DeSantis just uses it to his advantage. I see a difference, even though they both suck.




Agreed. Absolutely.

It's going to be Big Lie & CRT all the way . . .

No, DeSantis is not bat-shit crazy....which makes him more dangerous than Trump.

Every single one of these Republicans is a threat to democracy. Why won't any of them support the new voting rights legislation? Every single one of them is willing to cheat to win in 2022 and beyond.

 

[Chomsky]

Was it? The people who attacked the Capitol on Jan 6 represent the majority of the Republican Party in my opinion.

She said that well before 1/6, though I suspect you're alluding to her having called some of them right.

I see your point here, and the 1/6 crowd are criminals. So in this instance, it's a hard charge to refute, even though I think some of the 1/6 charged were acting in ignorant naiveté'.

But regardless, given the context, I still maintain HRC was wrong in making the comment.

 

[Allan]

No, that's wishful thinking. The Republicans won't lose a single voter if they abandon Trump. Josh Hawley or Ted Cruz or some other sinister **** will fill the bat-shit crazy void left by Trump.

That's what I'm thinking. Fear is a big motivator to turn out the vote. Instilling fear of socialism and of course the fear of minorities achieved by dog whistles and sometimes by even more overt means. The GOP knows how to trigger Trump supporters in Trump's absence.

 

[Chomsky]

No, DeSantis is not bat-shit crazy....which makes him more dangerous than Trump.

Every single one of these Republicans is a threat to democracy. Why won't any of them support the new voting rights legislation? Every single one of them is willing to cheat to win in 2022 and beyond.

The bolded is an interesting comment, and I see what you're getting at.

But I still fear the absolute craziness of Trump, even though you are right in that DeSantis will structurally & systematically take everything apart.

I'm no fan of either of them, that's for sure.

 

[RIP U.S. Democracy]

She said that well before 1/6, though I suspect you're alluding to her having called some of them right.

I see your point here, and the 1/6 crowd are criminals. So in this instance, it's a hard charge to refute, even though I think some of the 1/6 charged were acting in ignorant naiveté'.

But regardless, given the context, I still maintain HRC was wrong in making the comment.

Does it matter that she said it before Jan 6? She was still correct.

I don't think she was wrong to say it. Her comment was an astute observation of what these people are capable of.

 

[Allan]

The bolded is an interesting comment, and I see what you're getting at.

But I still fear the absolute craziness of Trump, even though you are right in that DeSantis will structurally & systematically take everything apart.

I'm no fan of either of them, that's for sure.

Hawley would scare me the most. But is Cruz worse?

 

[Chomsky]

Do they though? Those people aren't going to switch to supporting the Democrats.

No, but they may not turn-out. And, that may be enough.

It's not a binary system, "GOP or Dem?". Turn-out is a variable, and the most difficult one to predict.

 

[Chomsky]

Hawley would scare me the most. But is Cruz worse?

I'm not familiar enough with him.

But if you believe he might be worse than DeSantis or Trump, that's really saying something!

 

[Chomsky]

Does it matter that she said it before Jan 6? She was still correct.

I don't think she was wrong to say it. Her comment was an astute observation of what these people are capable of.

Well, we disagree on the bolded, even if we seem to agree on much of the rest.

 

[RIP U.S. Democracy]

No, but they may not turn-out. And, that may be enough.

It's not a binary system, "GOP or Dem?". Turn-out is a variable, and the most difficult one to predict.

The Republican voters' hatred of Democrats is the driving force that motivates the vast majority of them to vote. At the end of the day, I don't think the Republican candidate really matters that much to them.

People talk about Trump's popularity among Republican voters. However, Romney still got a higher percentage of the vote in 2012 than Trump did in 2016. And Trump's vote percentage in 2020 was about the same as Romney's. Considering that Trump was an incumbent President, that's pretty bad.

 

[Blue Dog]

From the link:

Senate Republicans want his supporters and don’t want to fight with him. But they want the midterms to be a simple referendum on President Joe Biden’s leadership — not on whether the party of Trump will rise again or whether the election was rigged.

Republican senators observed the public sentiment is moving away from Trump at the edges of the party — but not in the base. That makes the relationship with the former president tricky, particularly in a Senate Republican conference that ranges from Never Trump Republicans to diehard supporters.

This is the problem encapsulated.

 

[Chomsky]

The Republican voters' hatred of Democrats is the driving force that motivates the vast majority of them to vote. At the end of the day, I don't think the Republican candidate really matters that much to them.

People talk about Trump's popularity among Republican voters. However, Romney still got a higher percentage of the vote in 2012 than Trump did in 2016. And Trump's vote percentage in 2020 was about the same as Romney's. Considering that Trump was an incumbent President, that's pretty bad.

True.

But the danger is the Electoral College infrastructure provides structural advantage to the GOP in Presidential elections, as the Senate electoral demographics do the same.

It's not enough to win the popular vote, or to have a plurality or majority of the country's voters on your side. You need to win the election, which means winning the electoral college, with it being stacked against the Dems at this current time.

 

[Chomsky]

From the link:

Senate Republicans want his supporters and don’t want to fight with him. But they want the midterms to be a simple referendum on President Joe Biden’s leadership — not on whether the party of Trump will rise again or whether the election was rigged.

Republican senators observed the public sentiment is moving away from Trump at the edges of the party — but not in the base. That makes the relationship with the former president tricky, particularly in a Senate Republican conference that ranges from Never Trump Republicans to diehard supporters.

This is the problem encapsulated.

Yep; it's a key point in the article.

 

[RIP U.S. Democracy]

True.

But the danger is the Electoral College infrastructure provides structural advantage to the GOP in Presidential elections, as the Senate electoral demographics do the same.

It's not enough to win the popular vote, or to have a plurality or majority of the country's voters on your side. You need to win the election, which means winning the electoral college, with it being stacked against the Dems at this current time.

I understand that. My point is that Trump's popularity among Republican-leaning voters was not any higher than Romney's.

Democrats are screwed in the 2022 and the 2024 elections without the new voting rights legislation. Gerrymandering by itself is going to win the House for Republicans.

 

[Jay Falcon]

Yeah - but it was a crappy thing to say about her fellow Americans, especially given she was a Presidential candidate.

It was accurate.

And they proved it.

 

[Craig234]

Do they though? Those people aren't going to switch to supporting the Democrats.

They can lose them to primaries to the right, or people just not voting.

 

[tres borrachos]

The Senators are trying to walk that fine line...making their voters think they are doing stuff for them, while actually doing stuff for their donors and lobbyists.

And yes...Trump is toxic to them because he doesn't work for their donors. He works for the American people.

The Senators, like I said, will do anything. Even that sleazy tactic of not showing up to vote.

Trump doesn't work for the American people. He works for himself. The American people fired his fat ass.