Fiscal responsibility

[MarineTpartier]

I wanted to post this in the hopes that some of you active duty guys would heed the advice.
We have to get more fiscally responsible. Examples are this:
-Today, one of my fellow Marines told me a guy that used to be in the unit (before I got there) emailed him and said there is $4 million available for my division to use. Granted, there are a lot Regiments and Battalions in my division. However, this money is not earmarked for anything. Its just there, for whoever wants it, to use on whatever they want (for gov't use), until October. The reason for it being out there? Because "we have to spend it before the fiscal year is up or we won't get it next year". This same Marine informed us that he bought 50 32" computer monitors and 50 desk chairs that cost $700. I was infuriated. Why do military people, especially E-8's and above and O-4's and above, think they deserve this stuff? What's wrong with the factory monitor? What's wrong with a metal folding chair? I see so many things we get that we don't need.
-TURN OFF THE FRICKIN LIGHTS IF YOU'RE NOT USING THEM!
-How many times have you seen guys allow a military vehicle (Humvee, etc) just sit and run? Tell them turn it off.
-How many times have you seen guys mistreat their personal gear? Throwing their helmet, leaving their body armor in the dirt, etc. Correct them.
-Again, E-8's and above and O-4's and above. Taking "TAD" trips to places they don't need to. If you are one, stop doing it.
What about you guys? You see stuff like this or am I just complaining?

 

[Nick2253]

This is a problem with budgeting in general. If I give you X dollars to do something, and you take Y dollars to do it, I'm gonna give you Y dollars next time around. It doesn't matter if Y is bigger or smaller than X. So if Y is smaller than X, I have an incentive to spend the difference between X and Y in order to make sure I get X again next year.

Until we can somehow get managers to find a personal incentive to cut spending, it's not going to happen. This is why (at least in the private sector) profit sharing programs work very well.

 

[beerftw]

I wanted to post this in the hopes that some of you active duty guys would heed the advice.
We have to get more fiscally responsible. Examples are this:
-Today, one of my fellow Marines told me a guy that used to be in the unit (before I got there) emailed him and said there is $4 million available for my division to use. Granted, there are a lot Regiments and Battalions in my division. However, this money is not earmarked for anything. Its just there, for whoever wants it, to use on whatever they want (for gov't use), until October. The reason for it being out there? Because "we have to spend it before the fiscal year is up or we won't get it next year". This same Marine informed us that he bought 50 32" computer monitors and 50 desk chairs that cost $700. I was infuriated. Why do military people, especially E-8's and above and O-4's and above, think they deserve this stuff? What's wrong with the factory monitor? What's wrong with a metal folding chair? I see so many things we get that we don't need.
-TURN OFF THE FRICKIN LIGHTS IF YOU'RE NOT USING THEM!
-How many times have you seen guys allow a military vehicle (Humvee, etc) just sit and run? Tell them turn it off.
-How many times have you seen guys mistreat their personal gear? Throwing their helmet, leaving their body armor in the dirt, etc. Correct them.
-Again, E-8's and above and O-4's and above. Taking "TAD" trips to places they don't need to. If you are one, stop doing it.
What about you guys? You see stuff like this or am I just complaining?

thats how the military budgets its money,it goes by what units spend not what they need.my father went through the same thing in the navy,clinton was cutting budgets so his ship was practically on rice and beans,well at the end of the fiscal years scraping budgets they discovered they cut back their spending so much that even with the massive budget reduction they still had almost 200k left over,so they spent it on tools they already had that were non accountable,and then threw them over the ship,just so they could keep their budget.

 

[cpwill]

yeah, I've definitely seen the "we have to spend this money by X, so everyone figure out what they want/need" missive come down. Probably everyone in government has.

We need to find a way to incentivize commanders and units to save that money.

 

[Daktoria]

This just proves the military is meant to employ socially alienated people who don't know how to have fun.

Maybe you should take that money and invest it.

Then, you can have even MORE money and see what you're fighting for.

 

[StillBallin75]

This just proves the military is meant to employ socially alienated people who don't know how to have fun.

Maybe you should take that money and invest it.

Then, you can have even MORE money and see what you're fighting for.

The **** is that supposed to mean? You clearly don't know anyone serving currently or otherwise if that's really your opinion.

 

[Nick2253]

yeah, I've definitely seen the "we have to spend this money by X, so everyone figure out what they want/need" missive come down. Probably everyone in government has.

We need to find a way to incentivize commanders and units to save that money.

My favorite incentive strategy is pick a baseline budget year. Now, tell each division or company that the individual members will get some percentage of any savings below the baseline year as a bonus. Make the bonus higher for higher ranking soldiers, and then they'll have an even stronger incentive to shape up.

 

[Daktoria]

The **** is that supposed to mean? You clearly don't know anyone serving currently or otherwise if that's really your opinion.

Most of the recruits I'm familiar with enlisted because:

a) They couldn't get a job.
b) They fell for patriotic BS despite the fact that they came from a community which couldn't give them a job.
c) They didn't realize there's more to life than having a job.
d) The only things they knew to do for fun were having a job and messing up someone else's job.

 

[Nick2253]

Most of the recruits I'm familiar with enlisted because:

a) They couldn't get a job.
b) They fell for patriotic BS despite the fact that they came from a community which couldn't give them a job.
c) They didn't realize there's more to life than having a job.
d) The only things they knew to do for fun were having a job and messing up someone else's job.

This is the definition of sampling bias.

 

[Daktoria]

This is the definition of sampling bias.

This is the definition of excessive burden of proof.

(People are entitled to learn from life experience.)

 

[MarineTpartier]

Most of the recruits I'm familiar with enlisted because:

a) They couldn't get a job.
b) They fell for patriotic BS despite the fact that they came from a community which couldn't give them a job.
c) They didn't realize there's more to life than having a job.
d) The only things they knew to do for fun were having a job and messing up someone else's job.

StillBallin75, don't even entertain the dude man. Just another hater that is trying to bait someone into his childish game. Whatever.

 

[Daktoria]

StillBallin75, don't even entertain the dude man. Just another hater that is trying to bait someone into his childish game. Whatever.

Yes, I hate the fact that society believes it's OK to alienate people and default them into risking their lives to defend their alienators.

Don't hate the player. Hate the game.

 

[MarineTpartier]

The profit sharing thing is never going to happen. I think we should place a "fiscal management" section on the fitness reports of all military members E-8 and above and O-3 and above. We should also have each service give out awards to those that go above and beyond to save money. Giving extra money to military guys will never happen but awards and evaluation marks is something that is doable.

 

[cpwill]

My favorite incentive strategy is pick a baseline budget year. Now, tell each division or company that the individual members will get some percentage of any savings below the baseline year as a bonus. Make the bonus higher for higher ranking soldiers, and then they'll have an even stronger incentive to shape up.

not a bad idea, but I'm pretty sure that scaling the bonus as you suggest would lead to some discontent within the ranks. Besides, the ability to get their Marines a bonus should be a pretty big incentive for CO's.

 

[Porchev]

I wanted to post this in the hopes that some of you active duty guys would heed the advice.
We have to get more fiscally responsible. Examples are this:
-Today, one of my fellow Marines told me a guy that used to be in the unit (before I got there) emailed him and said there is $4 million available for my division to use. Granted, there are a lot Regiments and Battalions in my division. However, this money is not earmarked for anything. Its just there, for whoever wants it, to use on whatever they want (for gov't use), until October. The reason for it being out there? Because "we have to spend it before the fiscal year is up or we won't get it next year". This same Marine informed us that he bought 50 32" computer monitors and 50 desk chairs that cost $700. I was infuriated. Why do military people, especially E-8's and above and O-4's and above, think they deserve this stuff? What's wrong with the factory monitor? What's wrong with a metal folding chair? I see so many things we get that we don't need.
-TURN OFF THE FRICKIN LIGHTS IF YOU'RE NOT USING THEM!
-How many times have you seen guys allow a military vehicle (Humvee, etc) just sit and run? Tell them turn it off.
-How many times have you seen guys mistreat their personal gear? Throwing their helmet, leaving their body armor in the dirt, etc. Correct them.
-Again, E-8's and above and O-4's and above. Taking "TAD" trips to places they don't need to. If you are one, stop doing it.
What about you guys? You see stuff like this or am I just complaining?

Yes, I have seen it, toward the end of every single fiscal year; units make sure they spend all their money so they get the same amount the next year. It is not rank specific though, I have seen it at all different levels. It seems the majority of people are not fiscally responsible. And I have seen extra people going on TDYs (trips) if they are good deals. It is not just the military; I believe it is all of government.

 

[cpwill]

StillBallin75, don't even entertain the dude man. Just another hater that is trying to bait someone into his childish game. Whatever.

:lol: you have to admit, though, it's kind of funny, considering the number of guys who get out and double their pay or more

 

[MarineTpartier]

Yes, I hate the fact that society believes it's OK to alienate people and default them into risking their lives to defend their alienators.

Don't hate the player. Hate the game.

LOL. Did you just use "don't hate the player hate the game"? What are you, an extra on "Friday" or something? No wait, you were on "In Living Color" weren't you? I guess you think you are some sort of crusader trying to protect us poor military guys from the evil society that victimizes us huh? You can keep your Dr Phil crap bro. Nobody wants to hear it and nobody believes it. I'm done wasting the calories it takes to move my fingers and respond to you. Have a good day Phil.

 

[Daktoria]

LOL. Did you just use "don't hate the player hate the game"? What are you, an extra on "Friday" or something? No wait, you were on "In Living Color" weren't you? I guess you think you are some sort of crusader trying to protect us poor military guys from the evil society that victimizes us huh? You can keep your Dr Phil crap bro. Nobody wants to hear it and nobody believes it. I'm done wasting the calories it takes to move my fingers and respond to you. Have a good day Phil.

Can I ask you what you fight for?

I agree, nobody wants to hear it. That's the problem.

 

[Aunt Spiker]

I wanted to post this in the hopes that some of you active duty guys would heed the advice.
We have to get more fiscally responsible. Examples are this:
-Today, one of my fellow Marines told me a guy that used to be in the unit (before I got there) emailed him and said there is $4 million available for my division to use. Granted, there are a lot Regiments and Battalions in my division. However, this money is not earmarked for anything. Its just there, for whoever wants it, to use on whatever they want (for gov't use), until October. The reason for it being out there? Because "we have to spend it before the fiscal year is up or we won't get it next year". This same Marine informed us that he bought 50 32" computer monitors and 50 desk chairs that cost $700. I was infuriated. Why do military people, especially E-8's and above and O-4's and above, think they deserve this stuff? What's wrong with the factory monitor? What's wrong with a metal folding chair? I see so many things we get that we don't need.
-TURN OFF THE FRICKIN LIGHTS IF YOU'RE NOT USING THEM!
-How many times have you seen guys allow a military vehicle (Humvee, etc) just sit and run? Tell them turn it off.
-How many times have you seen guys mistreat their personal gear? Throwing their helmet, leaving their body armor in the dirt, etc. Correct them.
-Again, E-8's and above and O-4's and above. Taking "TAD" trips to places they don't need to. If you are one, stop doing it.
What about you guys? You see stuff like this or am I just complaining?

I worked up a lengthy list years abck - mainly citing waste that I've seen my husband "have" to engage in - all those you mentioned.

Plus:

* While on trips staying in lush living quarters: like suits
* Food budgets should flex depending on where you're going to in response to the cost of an average meal - not an above-average meal. No one needs $25.00/meal in Ft Hood for a single individual - my husband does not *need* a steak at every dinner. The boy won't suffer if he doesn't get any.
* Conservation (along the lines of what you mentioned about electricity) but also water usage, etc.
* Better use of time - my husband travels 1 or 2 weeks out of every month (when you add the days up) - sometimes it's spontaneous because of a suicidal soldiers - etc. But other times it's for meetings and events - these can be combined with better planning.
* Soldiers when on musters and stateside missions do not need excess leisure time - they don't need ot go to theme parks, etc - when transportation to/from is on the government's dime.

But instead of conserving and doing these controllable measures the military just decided to get rid of my husband those of his paygrade and bring in cheaper people who are lower in the ranks to do the duty of caring for injured soldiers.

 

[cpwill]

Can I ask you what you fight for?

:mrgreen: hey. those pissing-on-their-bodies trophy pictures won't collect themselves. if you want a good stash, you gotta go earn 'em.

 

[Daktoria]

:mrgreen: hey. those pissing-on-their-bodies trophy pictures won't collect themselves. if you want a good stash, you gotta go earn 'em.

Amazon.com: Imperial Hubris: Why the West is Losing the War on Terror (9781574888492): Michael Scheuer: Books

You should read that.

In short the War on Terror seems to be a foreign policy projection of consumerist frustration. American soldiers are being pushed out of a consumer culture that rejects them, and into a consumer culture that envies what we have.

When our soldiers piss on foreign casualties, it's an expression of self-fulfilling prophecy.

 

[MarineTpartier]

Okay guys, I think we survived the first wave of infiltration by the people who don't know what they are talking about. Lets talk about the actual subject of the thread for as long as we can before the second wave starts.
How many of you would group retirement reform into this? Personally, I don't like the progressive plan that was put out a while back. I do think we should compromise and say that no military member should receive their retirement until age 50-55. For instance, when I retire at 38, the government would effectively save 12-17 years of paying me retirement. I'm sure that would save a lot more money than the plan that came out and it wouldn't be as insulting.

 

[MarineTpartier]

I* Food budgets should flex depending on where you're going to in response to the cost of an average meal - not an above-average meal. No one needs $25.00/meal in Ft Hood for a single individual - my husband does not *need* a steak at every dinner. The boy won't suffer if he doesn't get any.

Agreed. I went to a course a while back where I received $72 a day to EAT! My family of 3 only consumes $150 a week in food. So I grocery shopped for about $65 a week, ate out on Saturday nights, and saved the rest. I offered to give the excess back. HQ Marine Corps told me I couldn't give it back because it appropriated already. I said okay well unappropriate it then. They said they can't do that. So, even when a guy tries to give money back, they won't take it.

* Conservation (along the lines of what you mentioned about electricity) but also water usage, etc.

You mean kinda like when we return from a 2 day op and its a blasphemy to say "we don't need to wash the vehicles"

* Soldiers when on musters and stateside missions do not need excess leisure time - they don't need ot go to theme parks, etc - when transportation to/from is on the government's dime.

This one infuriates me more than anything. I'm assuming you're talking about the reserves. I don't know about the Army but it is a Marine Corps order that reservists rate liberty during their annual training. For what?! They're friggin reservists! They need to be training. This is the only extended time during the year that I get to train them and you're telling me I have to send them on libo? Ridiculous.

But instead of conserving and doing these controllable measures the military just decided to get rid of my husband those of his paygrade and bring in cheaper people who are lower in the ranks to do the duty of caring for injured soldiers.

Of course they did. The very people making the calls to cut money are the people that take advantage of all the perks the most. They see their civilian counterparts up there on Capital Hill with their big offices, tax payer funded car leases, and slush funds and they figure "I deserve a little of that too." Corruption at its worst. And we laughed at the corruption in the Iraqi Army. The Iraqi's at least tried to keep it on the DL. We do the same thing but leave a paper trail to legitamize it.

 

[cpwill]

Okay guys, I think we survived the first wave of infiltration by the people who don't know what they are talking about. Lets talk about the actual subject of the thread for as long as we can before the second wave starts.
How many of you would group retirement reform into this? Personally, I don't like the progressive plan that was put out a while back. I do think we should compromise and say that no military member should receive their retirement until age 50-55. For instance, when I retire at 38, the government would effectively save 12-17 years of paying me retirement. I'm sure that would save a lot more money than the plan that came out and it wouldn't be as insulting.

I'd agree with that - the notion of "retiring" at 38/42 (officers) is ridiculous. The Servicemember is going to get another job. I'd even suggest offering some kind of sliding-scale benefit, wherein your retirement benefit increased by 3% of Base Pay every year after (say) 60 that you worked rather than taking it. I liked the 401(k) style match to TSP as well for the incoming guys. If we had to, I was willing to take the pro-rated version for all of us currently in with a TSP match for the rest of it. It's better than losing needed (but non-sexy) gear in an era of sequestration. Still, that last would be kind of a s****y thing to do to the guys who have been serving faithfully for 16+ years etc.


I don't know how much we spend on TRICARE, but Indiana saw awesome savings by offering her public employees an HSA option; we may want to consider offering that for our families as well.

 

[MarineTpartier]

I don't know how much we spend on TRICARE, but Indiana saw awesome savings by offering her public employees an HSA option; we may want to consider offering that for our families as well.

Don't even get me started on Tricare man. It sucks so bad.