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Fauci Don't ReOpen Too Soon

BS, Paul did nothing other than to try and discredit the Dr. because he is telling they truth. If Paul is correct where are the Doctors and Data to back up his claim. Paul is just toeing the current Party line, he will disappear when the virus proves he is an idiot.

What are you talking about ? In that video Fauci agreed with Paul about the immunity studies and admitted he isnt the end all to be counted on. So what truth is he telling that proves Paul wrong?
 
Maybe because that really can't. The sad part is the WH, CDC, and even the State's had reasonable guidelines for reopening and then promptly ignored them, WTF that made Zero sense. Fauci has done nothing more than point out that ignoring the guidelines and reopening too soon will result in more pain and suffering and more deaths, for some reason he us now attacked for pointing out what these same politicians were saying themselves a few weeks ago. Many in this Nation have lost the ability to think rationally and any Common Sense they may have had.

Agreed. We always pay a heavy price when we ignore science and go with the inconvenience variable.

I think the problem here is that these lawmakers are arguing that being poor is worse than death. Fauci is arguing the opposite. It's a terrible situation, but the scientist should be the last person to blame. Our policymakers are suppose to weigh the concepts of death vs. poor, and find a happy medium.
 
What are you talking about ? In that video Fauci agreed with Paul about the immunity studies and admitted he isnt the end all to be counted on. So what truth is he telling that proves Paul wrong?

That we are opening before we got even close to meeting the guidelines these same Politians were pushing a few weeks ago. Dr Fauci agreeing on a couple of points does not mean he is agreeing with Paul's attack on him. You are cherry picking while ignoring the fact that the cherries weren't ripe, good luck with that.
 
BS, Paul did nothing other than to try and discredit the Dr. because he is telling they truth. If Paul is correct where are the Doctors and Data to back up his claim. Paul is just toeing the current Party line, he will disappear when the virus proves he is an idiot.

Paul didn't need the virus to prove what was already self evident.
 
What are you talking about ? In that video Fauci agreed with Paul about the immunity studies and admitted he isnt the end all to be counted on. So what truth is he telling that proves Paul wrong?

The disagreement lies in the concept that Fauci is suppose to be a policymaker or economic expert. All what he's saying is that restrictions should be loosen based on the reduction of cases and deaths, and the band-aid needs to closely come off. Paul is suppose to be on the policy side of the equation, not the science side.
 
Paul didn't need the virus to prove what was already self evident.

Yes, but just maybe a few more Americans will finally realize how inept many of our Politians ready are, the Truth being exposed is never a bad thing.
 
I'll feel much safer when its okay for Paul Manafort to go back to prison.
 
Agreed. We always pay a heavy price when we ignore science and go with the inconvenience variable.

I think the problem here is that these lawmakers are arguing that being poor is worse than death. Fauci is arguing the opposite. It's a terrible situation, but the scientist should be the last person to blame. Our policymakers are suppose to weigh the concepts of death vs. poor, and find a happy medium.

The conservatives in control of the federal government are not interested in responding to the economic problems of the working class. They would rather force them back into businesses that are free of liability for unsafe working conditions and punishing workers who refuse to work in unsafe conditions.

They simply prefer death. Lots of thoughts and prayers though. And maybe a fly over.
 
That we are opening before we got even close to meeting the guidelines these same Politians were pushing a few weeks ago. Dr Fauci agreeing on a couple of points does not mean he is agreeing with Paul's attack on him. You are cherry picking while ignoring the fact that the cherries weren't ripe, good luck with that.

What guidelines are you even talking about? Paul is correct that in some states the deaths from the coronavirus dont even reach pandemic levels since theyre very few so a one size fits all approach is not only counterproductive, its stupid. I know you and the other dems want everyone to hide underground until the elections come in November so that your candidate has a chance to win, but saner heads will prevail.

The disagreement lies in the concept that Fauci is suppose to be a policymaker or economic expert. All what he's saying is that restrictions should be loosen based on the reduction of cases and deaths, and the band-aid needs to closely come off. Paul is suppose to be on the policy side of the equation, not the science side.

When the science "side" is consistently wrong, then its time to look elsewhere (like other scientists with differing viewpoints, like the Swedes) for advice, thats Paul's point- and he's correct.
 
Agreed. We always pay a heavy price when we ignore science and go with the inconvenience variable.

I think the problem here is that these lawmakers are arguing that being poor is worse than death. Fauci is arguing the opposite. It's a terrible situation, but the scientist should be the last person to blame. Our policymakers are suppose to weigh the concepts of death vs. poor, and find a happy medium.

Yeup.

The sad thing is all we had to do was wait a couple more weeks and most areas would have been able the phase openings. All Dr Fauci be did was warn us, we ignore what He and the Vast Majority of Scientists are say at our own peril. I will point out that is many areas that are opening the People are not coming out in droves, give me hope that more Americans than not know this is a bad idea.
Notice not Politicians are saying it is Safe to open, a whole lot of CYA going on.
 
When the science "side" is consistently wrong, then its time to look elsewhere (like other scientists with differing viewpoints, like the Swedes) for advice, thats Paul's point- and he's correct.

What has been consistently wrong? We're seeing more and more restrictions being lifted because cases and deaths have been going down. Fauci is simply saying that states should follow their own guidelines and choose life before opening up the gates.
 
What guidelines are you even talking about? Paul is correct that in some states the deaths from the coronavirus dont even reach pandemic levels since theyre very few so a one size fits all approach is not only counterproductive, its stupid. I know you and the other dems want everyone to hide underground until the elections come in November so that your candidate has a chance to win, but saner heads will prevail.



When the science "side" is consistently wrong, then its time to look elsewhere (like other scientists with differing viewpoints, like the Swedes) for advice, thats Paul's point- and he's correct.

So you are claiming you never saw the CDC and Whitehouse guidelines? Really.....
Not a Dem and I would never do harm to the Nation to win an election, can you say the same?

That has to be the most ignorant thing I have ever seen you post, i really thought you were more intelligent than that. Oh well, one of us will be proven correct in the near future, pray it is you, and if I and Science are proven to be wrong I will admit it, are you willing to do the same?
 
What has been consistently wrong? We're seeing more and more restrictions being lifted because cases and deaths have been going down. Fauci is simply saying that states should follow their own guidelines and choose life before opening up the gates.

In late January Fauci said that Covid 19 wasnt a major threat to Americans, and in early March he said that people shouldnt wear masks to protect themselves. Not long afterwards, he reverses himself on both these things. We're supposed to trust this guy with everything now?


So you are claiming you never saw the CDC and Whitehouse guidelines? Really.....
Not a Dem and I would never do harm to the Nation to win an election, can you say the same?

That has to be the most ignorant thing I have ever seen you post, i really thought you were more intelligent than that. Oh well, one of us will be proven correct in the near future, pray it is you, and if I and Science are proven to be wrong I will admit it, are you willing to do the same?

LOL there are many different scientific opinions, yet you keep harping about science being on your side. Let's be clear- you believe in the "science" of Ferguson with his 1-2 million dead predictions? Go for it. I believe in the Swedish scientists who say herd immunity is the way to go. We'll see who has the guts to admit theyre wrong.
 
If we had competent leadership that shut down the country a month earlier, we wouldn't be having this discussion, depriving the right-wing of one less person to hate. Although, I'm sure they'd find someone else.
 
In late January Fauci said that Covid 19 wasnt a major threat to Americans, and in early March he said that people shouldnt wear masks to protect themselves. Not long afterwards, he reverses himself on both these things. We're supposed to trust this guy with everything now?




LOL there are many different scientific opinions, yet you keep harping about science being on your side. Let's be clear- you believe in the "science" of Ferguson with his 1-2 million dead predictions? Go for it. I believe in the Swedish scientists who say herd immunity is the way to go. We'll see who has the guts to admit theyre wrong.

I have admitted when I was wrong, media bias is one I had to admit I had been wrong about. I have never seen you admit you got something wrong, we shall see soon enough.
 
In late January Fauci said that Covid 19 wasnt a major threat to Americans, and in early March he said that people shouldnt wear masks to protect themselves. Not long afterwards, he reverses himself on both these things. We're supposed to trust this guy with everything now?

Half true. See link: Fact-check: Did Fauci say coronavirus was ‘nothing to worry about’? - News - Austin American-Statesman - Austin, TX

The problem here is that information changes. Things change based on the information presented. Back in January, the science at the time said low risk. Fauci was only looking at the data at the time. This does not make Fauci a bad scientist. It in fact, proves the opposite. Science should never be static. When we learn more, we adjust.

Please note: Steve Bannon is not a credible source.
 
I have admitted when I was wrong, media bias is one I had to admit I had been wrong about. I have never seen you admit you got something wrong, we shall see soon enough.

Here's the thing: He wasn't necessarily "wrong" when he said it wasn't a major threat. These people do not own crystal balls and can only see what is in front of them. The decision to shutdown 50% of the economy and run the risk of going into a recession wasn't done lightly, but as a last resort.
 
There's a list of things. Actually, with increased testing, case counts might very well go up even if things are under control, so one big test is a high number of negative tests, which indicates a state isn't chasing sick people and trying to figure out why, but actually monitoring the population and able to identify outbreaks early. Monitoring versus testing sick people will result in high negatives. Tennessee is doing a good job with testing and about 95% or more are negative each day.

A good example is my mother in law's assisted living place. One of the residents went to ER, and was treated and discharged back. She had no symptoms but was tested at re-entry as a precaution, it was positive (probably a false positive) but then they tested every resident and every staff and every other person going to the center on a regular basis (some outside nurses are allowed in). So that was 200 or so tests and none of them were showing symptoms, all negative. That's what is needed.

Other big signs, from what I've read, are hospitalizations and ICU needs, and deaths obviously.

The only problem with that test is that you're only negative on the day of the test; tomorrow you could test positive. The better test is that which determines if you have already been infected and subsequently recovered.
 
The only problem with that test is that you're only negative on the day of the test; tomorrow you could test positive. The better test is that which determines if you have already been infected.

We need lots of both, actually. What the assisted living center needs in an ideal world is what Trump gets, which is those around him are tested regularly for the active disease, because that's when it spreads. It would also help the staff to know who's developed antibodies and is past the contagious period, and have those staff deal with the most vulnerable.
 
We need lots of both, actually. What the assisted living center needs in an ideal world is what Trump gets, which is those around him are tested regularly for the active disease, because that's when it spreads. It would also help the staff to know who's developed antibodies and is past the contagious period, and have those staff deal with the most vulnerable.

Is it cynical of me to suggest there's a Trumpian edict in place forbidding the wearing of masks around him?
 
No, quoting you:

"So, what you're saying is that all those states reopening that do not meet reopen guidelines are testing at higher rates than those that meet those guidelines (testing so much that would have the effect you say, and no less) and that one location, Knoxville, in one state, Kentucky[sic], proves this"

The entire bolded is something I did not say and did not imply in any way. You made it up. You said that many states weren't meeting the guidelines and singled out number of cases. It's not that simple. Tennessee and not just Knoxville has seen cases go up but that's in part because we're one of about seven states that are doing sufficient testing and meeting testing requirements across the board, including lots of tests AND a very low positivity rate (less than 3% positive), so we're not chasing sick patients and figuring out why they're sick, people but monitoring the broader population and trying to get ahead of hot spots.

But I never said or implied our state's experience proves ANYTHING but our state's experience. The end.

Looks like we misunderstood each other's posts. No big deal.



I paraphrased what I thought you meant to be sure if it was indeed your meaning. The fact is, most states that are reopening with lesser operating guidelines do not meet the CDC guidelines for reopening and most of those states are not testing any higher than the avg state. I understood you to claim that the reason states did not meet the reopening guidelines regarding consecutive weeks of lowering new cases was because they were testing so much. That is not true. Kentucky is below avg testing as of 4/2/20. Perhaps it has gone above avg since then. I don't know. Tennessee was avg.
 
I assume there's a decline in new infections in the states reopening?

Upgrading infrastructure to include pandemic prevention capabilities could take the equivalent to a Corps of high paid engineers to solve the engineering problems while stimulating our economy until we have enough prevention measures built in to let commercial crews take over.
 
I paraphrased what I thought you meant to be sure if it was indeed your meaning. The fact is, most states that are reopening with lesser operating guidelines do not meet the CDC guidelines for reopening and most of those states are not testing any higher than the avg state. I understood you to claim that the reason states did not meet the reopening guidelines regarding consecutive weeks of lowering new cases was because they were testing so much. That is not true.

No, what the words I typed said is you can't look at cases in isolation. I did use Tennessee as an example, because we have relatively high rates of testing, very, very low positivity rates, and if you just count cases then ramping up testing will predictably count as a negative for purposes of meeting guidelines, and we want more testing.

Kentucky is below avg testing as of 4/2/20. Perhaps it has gone above avg since then. I don't know. Tennessee was avg.

LOL, Tennessee is 10th in tests per million (43k/million), and it's ranked #10 in deaths per million at 40/million versus national average of 259/million. Kentucky is only testing at 26k/million with not quite double the death rate per million.

Point is we're testing at higher rates than 40 states, and many states with FAR more disease and FAR higher death rates per million, which is an indicator that we're testing to monitor (that's the goal), not testing to figure out why someone is sick.
 
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