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Do you think it's ok for gays to adopt?

Should gays be allowed to adopt?

  • Yes

    Votes: 52 76.5%
  • No

    Votes: 16 23.5%

  • Total voters
    68
Jerry said:
I take it that you come down on the mental disorder side for both?


I find it hard to beleave that nature would design us with such flaws.Such flaws could be the downfall for a species that is not hermaphrodictic.I find it hard to beleave that humans would evolve such a behavior because it would seem so destructive for a species that is not hermaphrodictic.As a christian I beleave such a behavior is a result of their desire to sin.

I beleave both behaviors are a sexual perversion.Both behaviors are done freely of choice.No one forces a man to stick his dick in another man's *** and no one forces Chester the child molester to try to have sex with little kids.They do these things because they want to.
 
Stace said:
You're implying that you think it is biased. What is biased about AP? Or Yahoo, for that matter?

People doing any study have something to prove.Their beliefs motivate them to find a result that they beleave to be true.
 
jamesrage said:
I find it hard to beleave that nature would design us with such flaws.Such flaws could be the downfall for a species that is not hermaphrodictic.I find it hard to beleave that humans would evolve such a behavior because it would seem so destructive for a species that is not hermaphrodictic.As a christian I beleave such a behavior is a result of their desire to sin.

I beleave both behaviors are a sexual perversion.Both behaviors are done freely of choice.No one forces a man to stick his dick in another man's *** and no one forces Chester the child molester to try to have sex with little kids.They do these things because they want to.

Umm...yeah. No one forces a man and a woman to have sex. They do it cause they want to.
 
I don't see any reason why they shouldn't be excluded. It's certainly a lot better then a child not having a parent at all.
 
jamesrage said:
It amuses me that the same people who think a sexual attration to people of the same sex is somehow genitic....

Extreme skewing of X chromosome inactivation in mothers of homosexual men.
Hum Genet. 2006 Feb;118(6):691-4. Epub 2005 Dec 21.

…The number of women with extreme skewing of X-inactivation was significantly higher in mothers of gay men (13/97=13%) compared to controls (4/103=4%) and increased in mothers with two or more gay sons (10/44=23%). Our findings support a role for the X chromosome in regulating sexual orientation in a subgroup of gay men.


A linkage between DNA markers on the X chromosome and male sexual orientation.
Science. 1993 Jul 16;261(5119):321-7.

...The linkage to markers on Xq28, the subtelomeric region of the long arm of the sex chromosome, had a multipoint lod score of 4.0 (P = 10(-5), indicating a statistical confidence level of more than 99 percent that at least one subtype of male sexual orientation is genetically influenced.

Linkage between sexual orientation and chromosome Xq28 in males but not in females.
Nat Genet. 1995 Nov;11(3):248-56.

….Linkage between the Xq28 markers and sexual orientation was detected for the gay male families but not for the lesbian families or for families that failed to meet defined inclusion criteria for the study of sex-linked sexual orientation. Our results corroborate the previously reported linkage between Xq28 and male homosexuality in selected kinships and suggest that this region contains a locus that influences individual variations in sexual orientation in men but not in women.
 
steen said:
Extreme skewing of X chromosome inactivation in mothers of homosexual men.
Hum Genet. 2006 Feb;118(6):691-4. Epub 2005 Dec 21.

…The number of women with extreme skewing of X-inactivation was significantly higher in mothers of gay men (13/97=13%) compared to controls (4/103=4%) and increased in mothers with two or more gay sons (10/44=23%). Our findings support a role for the X chromosome in regulating sexual orientation in a subgroup of gay men.


A linkage between DNA markers on the X chromosome and male sexual orientation.
Science. 1993 Jul 16;261(5119):321-7.

...The linkage to markers on Xq28, the subtelomeric region of the long arm of the sex chromosome, had a multipoint lod score of 4.0 (P = 10(-5), indicating a statistical confidence level of more than 99 percent that at least one subtype of male sexual orientation is genetically influenced.

Linkage between sexual orientation and chromosome Xq28 in males but not in females.
Nat Genet. 1995 Nov;11(3):248-56.

….Linkage between the Xq28 markers and sexual orientation was detected for the gay male families but not for the lesbian families or for families that failed to meet defined inclusion criteria for the study of sex-linked sexual orientation. Our results corroborate the previously reported linkage between Xq28 and male homosexuality in selected kinships and suggest that this region contains a locus that influences individual variations in sexual orientation in men but not in women.
I haven't yet throughly read through your links, but from the portions which you have posted ( "...The number of women with extreme skewing of X-inactivation was significantly higher....") I get the impression that although homosexuality may be grounded in genetics, it may still be a genetic error.
Would that be an accurate first impression?

Also, it seems that what may cause homosexuality in men is not necessarily what causes homosexuality in women ("...this region contains a locus that influences individual variations in sexual orientation in men but not in women..."). In order to liken homosexuality to gender, it seems that sexual orientation would have to come from one common source....one common genetic controle....just as gender is.

Perhaps you could answer this one off the top of your head: Genetically, is Gender Identity Disorder an extreme form of homosexuality? Are the two physiologically similar, being the result of similar neural "weiring"?
 
Jerry said:
I haven't yet throughly read through your links, but from the portions which you have posted ( "...The number of women with extreme skewing of X-inactivation was significantly higher....") I get the impression that although homosexuality may be grounded in genetics, it may still be a genetic error.
Would that be an accurate first impression?
I am not sure what you mean with "error"? If you are talking about a "difference from typical" then that might be correct, depending on the proprotions. But it sounds like you are trying to make a value judgement regarding genetic codes? There isn't any. They are merely codes. If you have a code CCAGGCAT and a code CGAGGCAT, then which one is the "error"?

Also, it seems that what may cause homosexuality in men is not necessarily what causes homosexuality in women ("...this region contains a locus that influences individual variations in sexual orientation in men but not in women..."). In order to liken homosexuality to gender, it seems that sexual orientation would have to come from one common source....one common genetic controle....just as gender is.
Why? Very few things are single-gene determinants like that. The world is not nearly as simple as you atr trying to make it look. It merely showed that this particular mutation region they are looking at in that specific paper seemed to apply to gays but not to lesbians. It doesn't say anything else.

Perhaps you could answer this one off the top of your head: Genetically, is Gender Identity Disorder an extreme form of homosexuality? Are the two physiologically similar, being the result of similar neural "weiring"?
I have not seen any evidence of genetic foundation for GID which BTW, doesn't need to be homosexuality. But then, I haven't been looking either. (I can try to go to medline which is much more advanced than pubmed, but then I won't be able to give you any linkable resources, only the references and abstract copies.)
 
ludahai said:
Regardless, the Bible makes it clear that homosexuality is an abomination and it clearly goes against God's plan for humanity.
Regardless? It doesn't matter that the bible was written not by god but by man and then used for fanatic christians as thier basis against a plethora of non-sense.
 
jamesrage said:
People doing any study have something to prove.Their beliefs motivate them to find a result that they beleave to be true.

Scientists doing studies are not just looking for things that THEY believe to be true; they are looking for the truth, period.
 
jfuh said:
Regardless? It doesn't matter that the bible was written not by god but by man and then used for fanatic christians as thier basis against a plethora of non-sense.

I am not a religious fanatic, but I certainly believe that the Word of God certainly has some relevance to our lives.
 
ludahai said:
I am not a religious fanatic, but I certainly believe that the Word of God certainly has some relevance to our lives.

Perhpas in your life....but not for many of us. And it certainly shouldn't dictate things such as adoption.
 
Stace said:
Scientists doing studies are not just looking for things that THEY believe to be true; they are looking for the truth, period.

Let me guess stace, you don't believe that a scientist can be bias or be prejudice on his opinion huh on either side of the issue..........
 
Navy Pride said:
Let me guess stace, you don't believe that a scientist can be bias or be prejudice on his opinion huh on either side of the issue..........

NP, don't you know by now to NOT try and guess my thoughts? You've tried to guess how many times now? And you've been wrong how many times?

Exactly.

Certainly they can be biased when they begin their research, if they are trying to find something very specific. But the results of their research are not biased. The truth does not lean to one side or the other; it is simply there, waiting to be discovered by any who seek it, regardless of if it is what they were looking for.
 
steen said:
Extreme skewing of X chromosome inactivation in mothers of homosexual men.
Hum Genet. 2006 Feb;118(6):691-4. Epub 2005 Dec 21.

…The number of women with extreme skewing of X-inactivation was significantly higher in mothers of gay men (13/97=13%) compared to controls (4/103=4%) and increased in mothers with two or more gay sons (10/44=23%). Our findings support a role for the X chromosome in regulating sexual orientation in a subgroup of gay men.


A linkage between DNA markers on the X chromosome and male sexual orientation.
Science. 1993 Jul 16;261(5119):321-7.

...The linkage to markers on Xq28, the subtelomeric region of the long arm of the sex chromosome, had a multipoint lod score of 4.0 (P = 10(-5), indicating a statistical confidence level of more than 99 percent that at least one subtype of male sexual orientation is genetically influenced.

Linkage between sexual orientation and chromosome Xq28 in males but not in females.
Nat Genet. 1995 Nov;11(3):248-56.

….Linkage between the Xq28 markers and sexual orientation was detected for the gay male families but not for the lesbian families or for families that failed to meet defined inclusion criteria for the study of sex-linked sexual orientation. Our results corroborate the previously reported linkage between Xq28 and male homosexuality in selected kinships and suggest that this region contains a locus that influences individual variations in sexual orientation in men but not in women.
Damn it you beat me to it.
 
Stace said:
You're implying that you think it is biased. What is biased about AP? Or Yahoo, for that matter?
To him and other like minded fundamentalists, anything that doesn't agree with them is biased.
 
Navy Pride said:
If you don't believe that the environment has anything to do with the way a person is brought up then all I can say is you live in a fantasy world.......
You mean environment and upbringing do not influence a persons perspective?
Of course, just not sexuality.
 
Stace said:
Scientists doing studies are not just looking for things that THEY believe to be true; they are looking for the truth, period.
You mean factual.
 
ludahai said:
I am not a religious fanatic, but I certainly believe that the Word of God certainly has some relevance to our lives.
Religious fanatic, you most likely are not.
But belief that the "interrpreted" word of god has relevance to our lives is inapplicable as only so many believe in the christian bible. You should know, you live in a region of predominent buddism and daoism.
 
Stace said:
Perhpas in your life....but not for many of us. And it certainly shouldn't dictate things such as adoption.
Religion in general should have no say so what-so-ever with regards to law.
 
Stace said:
Perhpas in your life....but not for many of us. And it certainly shouldn't dictate things such as adoption.

So, you don't have much use for the Bible or the dictionary. Care to tell us what OTHER books you don't have much use for? Encyclopedia for instance?
 
Navy Pride said:
Let me guess stace, you don't believe that a scientist can be bias or be prejudice on his opinion huh on either side of the issue..........
All scientists are biased on thier hypothesis before proof.
However when it comes time to publication and the hypothesis is put into question and review, all the bias is taken out.
That's how science works.
 
ludahai said:
So, you don't have much use for the Bible or the dictionary. Care to tell us what OTHER books you don't have much use for? Encyclopedia for instance?
More ad homenin Lu?
 
jfuh said:
You mean factual.

Sure....but the two words are very closely related.

dictionary.com said:
fac·tu·al ( P ) Pronunciation Key (fkch-l)
adj.
Of the nature of fact; real.
Of or containing facts.

Main Entry: fac·tu·al
Pronunciation: 'fak-ch&-w&l
Function: adjective
1 : of or relating to facts <factual issues>
2 : restricted to or based on fact —fac·tu·al·i·ty /"fak-ch&-'wa-l&-tE/ noun —fac·tu·al·ly adverb —fac·tu·al·ness noun

factual

adj 1: of the nature of fact; having actual existence; "rocks and trees...the actual world"; "actual heroism"; "the actual things that produced the emotion you experienced" [syn: actual] 2: of or relating to or characterized by facts; "factual considerations" 3: existing in fact whether with lawful authority or not; "de facto segregation is as real as segration imposed by law"; "a de facto state of war" [syn: de facto, actual] [ant: de jure] 4: based on fact; "factual accuracy"; "a factual account" 5: characterized by fact; "the factual aspects of the case"

dictionary.com said:
true ( P ) Pronunciation Key (tr)
adj. tru·er, tru·est

Consistent with fact or reality; not false or erroneous. See Synonyms at real1. See Usage Note at fact.
Truthful.
Real; genuine. See Synonyms at authentic.
Reliable; accurate: a true prophecy.
Faithful, as to a friend, vow, or cause; loyal. See Synonyms at faithful.
Sincerely felt or expressed; unfeigned: true grief.
Fundamental; essential: his true motive.
Rightful; legitimate: the true heir.
Exactly conforming to a rule, standard, or pattern: trying to sing true B.
Accurately shaped or fitted: a true wheel.
Accurately placed, delivered, or thrown.
Quick and exact in sensing and responding.
Determined with reference to the earth's axis, not the magnetic poles: true north.
Conforming to the definitive criteria of a natural group; typical: The horseshoe crab is not a true crab.
Narrowly particularized; highly specific: spoke of probity in the truest sense of the word.
Computer Science. Indicating one of two possible values taken by a variable in Boolean logic or a binary device.

adv.
In accord with reality, fact, or truthfulness.
Unswervingly; exactly: The archer aimed true.
So as to conform to a type, standard, or pattern.

true

adj 1: consistent with fact or reality; not false; "the story is true"; "it is undesirable to believe a proposition when there is no ground whatever for supposing it true"- B. Russell; "the true meaning of the statement" [ant: false] 2: not synthetic or spurious; of real or natural origin; "real mink"; "true gold" [syn: real] 3: conforming to definitive criteria; "the horseshoe crab is not a true crab"; "Pythagoras was the first true mathematician" 4: accurately placed or thrown; "his aim was true"; "he was dead on target" [syn: dead on target] 5: devoted (sometimes fanatically) to a cause or concept or truth; "true believers bonded together against all who disagreed with them" 6: expressing or given to expressing the truth; "a true statement"; "gave truthful testimony"; "a truthful person" [syn: truthful] [ant: untruthful] 7: worthy of being depended on; "a dependable worker"; "an honest working stiff"; "a reliable source of information"; "he was true to his word"; "I would be true for there are those who trust me" [syn: dependable, honest, reliable, true(p)] 8: not pretended; sincerely felt or expressed; "genuine emotion"; "her interest in people was unfeigned"; "true grief" [syn: genuine, true(a), unfeigned] 9: rightly so called; "true courage"; "a spirit which true men have always admired"; "a true friend" [syn: true(a)] 10: determined with reference to the earth's axis rather than the magnetic poles; "true north is geographic north" [syn: true(a)] 11: having a legally established claim; "the legitimate heir"; "the true and lawful king" [syn: true(a), lawful, rightful(a)] 12: in tune; accurate in pitch; "a true note" [syn: on-key] 13: accurately fitted; level; "the window frame isn't quite true" [syn: straight] 14: reliable as a basis for action; "a true prophesy" n : proper alignment; the property possessed by something that is in correct or proper alignment; "out of true" adv : as acknowledged; "true, she is the smartest in her class" [syn: admittedly, avowedly, confessedly] v : make level, square, balanced, or concentric; "true up the cylinder of an engine" [syn: true up]
 
ludahai said:
So, you don't have much use for the Bible or the dictionary. Care to tell us what OTHER books you don't have much use for? Encyclopedia for instance?


Uh.....where do you get that I don't have much use for a dictionary? See my last post. I also happen to love encyclopedias. Used to read them for fun.

You're right, though, the Bible doesn't have a place in my life currently, as I am agnostic. Used to go to church and all that, but it's just not for me right now. Besides, I've always been a firm believer that religion has its place in the home and at church, and very few other places outside of that. Certainly doesn't belong in the legal realm.
 
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