DO I support racism?[W:433]

[Master PO]

Re: DO I support racism?

All law is balancing rights against each other. To believe rights are absolute and mutually exclusive is just plain stupid.

rights for the public at large...are an absolute.

rights for an individual are not because he or she, may violate the law.

what is an absolute mean?........it means government cannot take away the right to free speech, from the 330 million people in america with the stoke of a pen.

 

[sangha]

Re: DO I support racism?

What's an example of " just discrimination"?

A restaurant refusing to serve someone who is dressed inappropriately, or behaving in a disruptive manner

 

[ecofarm]

Re: DO I support racism?

what is discrimination?...its a behavioral issue......

hurts the free market? hurts society..........were any rights violated, when discrimination takes place?.......if not government has no authority to act.....only rights violated gives government authority

there is no balancing of rights......my rights end where yours begin...you and others dont get to determine if my rights are just[fair] in your eyes.

You just don't understand the basic principles of law. You're trying to declare property rights supreme and absolute. That's stupid nonsense.

 

[ecofarm]

Re: DO I support racism?

rights for the public at large...are an absolute.

And right there your argument falls on its face.

 

[Lursa]

Re: DO I support racism?

no citizen, has an exercisable right on property which is belongs to another person.

when you enter my business, i offer you the privilege of associating with me, and me serving you.

the constitution does.......because its government power to secure people rights.....if how i run my business though bad food, or a dangerous environment....that threaten people life's...government has authority to see i stay within health and saftey standards.

protect them from who?........i am not threatening anyone rights by not serving them.......there is no right to be served.

The state however has the right to set standards and regulations to protect the public and when your 'private property' is opened to the public, you have to comply with their standards of safety and hygiene and civil rights and access and zoning, etc or you lose the right to 'commerce.'

The govt has the authority to compel you to run your business based on standards believed to *protect society* and I already explained how intentionally treating people as 2nd class citizens harms society.

 

[joko104]

Re: DO I support racism?

I didn't say that. What I said is if no aggressive act was taken on someones person or property then no right violation has occurred, and thus no crime has been committed.

If someone gets hurt you can easily argue they are responsible.

You can't even get close to right in your advocacy of racism and racial segregation. Illegal commercial discrimination is not a "crime." It is a civil offense. Actually, I believe you know that but when people go into the racist mode all reasoning and logic goes out the window. Instead, the person just throws out any words they think of whether they make any sense or not.

 

[Master PO]

Re: DO I support racism?

Wrong. If you live in our society you have to live within our rules. If you can't, leave. That is the fundamental rule and necessity of all societies and cultures.

wrong...we have a government which is created for they purpose to secure rights of the people.............that is the sole reason we have a government...... nothing else.

if no rights violation ever took place, government would not be needed at all.

and since discrimination by people or business is not a rights violation.....it i unlawful to make such a law.

only government which works for all of the people, cannot discriminate.

 

[joko104]

Re: DO I support racism?

Really, Gip?

"No shirt, no shoes, no service"

Good example!

 

[AGENT J]

Re: DO I support racism?

You just don't understand the basic principles of law. You're trying to declare property rights supreme and absolute. That's stupid nonsense.

Its easier for some to just ignore facts and make up their own rules and rights then to use reality, law, facts, rights and court cases.

 

[Lursa]

Re: DO I support racism?

I didn't say that. What I said is if no aggressive act was taken on someones person or property then no right violation has occurred, and thus no crime has been committed.

If someone gets hurt you can easily argue they are responsible.

So you have to wait until someone gets hurt first.

 

[ecofarm]

Re: DO I support racism?

wrong...we have a government which is created for they purpose to secure rights of the people.............that is the sole reason we have a government...... nothing else.

And people have a right to a free and fair market, equal opportunity and control of externalities (economic and social).

Those rights outweigh the right to be a racist in public business.

 

[joko104]

Re: DO I support racism?

rights for the public at large...are an absolute.

rights for an individual are not because he or she, may violate the law.

what is an absolute mean?........it means government cannot take away the right to free speech, from the 330 million people in america with the stoke of a pen.

Actually, in many regards it can and does. With the stroke of a pen, it became a crime to make violent threats against the president and against anyone (terroristic threats). There are laws against prohibited advertising - for example selling a product claiming it will cure cancer when it is not FDA approved. The list or prohibited speech is quite long.

But don't let obvious and known facts get in the way of a goal of returning racial segregation.

 

[Master PO]

Re: DO I support racism?

The state however has the right to set standards and regulations to protect the public and when your 'private property' is opened to the public, you have to comply with their standards of safety and hygiene and civil rights and access and zoning, etc or you lose the right to 'commerce.'

as started before government has legal authority when it comes to public health and saftey......people dont have civil rights on private propery.......they only have a natural right.....which is not exercisable..which is life and liberty.

The govt has the authority to compel you to run your business based on standards believed to *protect society* and I already explained how intentionally treating people as 2nd class citizens harms society.

what is harm?.......it is not a rights violation......therefore government is devoid of any authority.

 

[ecofarm]

Re: DO I support racism?

I didn't say that. What I said is if no aggressive act was taken on someones person or property then no right violation has occurred, and thus no crime has been committed.

Active racism in public business, in attempt to marginalize a group and deny them goods and services, so as to create second class citizens, is aggression towards that group.

 

[joko104]

Re: DO I support racism?

wrong...we have a government which is created for they purpose to secure rights of the people.............that is the sole reason we have a government...... nothing else.

Wrong. Government also exists for the management and protection of the society.

 

[Master PO]

Re: DO I support racism?

Actually, in many regards it can and does. With the stroke of a pen, it became a crime to make violent threats against the president and against anyone (terroristic threats). There are laws against prohibited advertising - for example selling a product claiming it will cure cancer when it is not FDA approved. The list or prohibited speech is quite long.

But don't let obvious and known facts get in the way of a goal of returning racial segregation.

that is because you threaten the life of a person........government is to secure against threats.

drugs, ...because your making a claim, for something which you cannot back up..............but continue silly logic your using.

 

[ecofarm]

Re: DO I support racism?

Wrong. Government also exists for the management and protection of the society.

Because that management and protection protects the rights of the public.

 

[Master PO]

Re: DO I support racism?

Wrong. Government also exists for the management and protection of the society.

wrong!!!!!

this is part of the DOI.....the DOI....is law..its a statute...of book 1 of federal code.

"That to secure these rights, Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed"


government was created to secure rights.

James Madison-- "if men were angels no government would be necessary"

Madison also states...."that it is the object of government to secure rights"

goverment is not here to feed cloth and take care of you, and tell you how to act......when you violate rights,then government has authority over you.

 

[Lursa]

Re: DO I support racism?

as started before government has legal authority when it comes to public health and saftey......people dont have civil rights on private propery.......they only have a natural right.....which is not exercisable..which is life and liberty.

what is harm?.......it is not a rights violation......therefore government is devoid of any authority.

No. You just CHOOSE to see the govt's protection of public safety as different because you dont object to it, or are used to it...or even see the sense in it. The govt is not compelled to 'protect' public safety Constitutionally (as a human right)...it is compelled to defend the nation from outside threats.

But you dont like the same protection of public safety when applied through anti-discrimination. And I've given examples of exactly how it can harm society...physically and economically.

Protecting public safety is a moral choice....look at Henrin, he's proof of that, he says who gives a **** if people get hurt?

You *just accept it as part of the govt's role* and to me, in some cases, they overstep.

However anti-discrimination laws DO protect society, and not from a moral perspective but from an essential civil rights perspective. And to not do so damages society by creating 2nd class citizens of certain groups...which leads to discord, violence, lack of opportunities, poverty, etc.

 

[Henrin]

Re: DO I support racism?

Wrong. Government also exists for the management and protection of the society.

You guys sure do have a bunch of conflicting missions for the state.

 

[JayDubya]

Re: DO I support racism?

Active racism in public business, in attempt to marginalize a group and deny them goods and services, so as to create second class citizens, is aggression towards that group.

Aggression is the initiation of force.

Not selling something to someone is by no means, in no manner the act of initiating force, nor could it possibly be reasonably misconstrued as such.

 

[Henrin]

Re: DO I support racism?

So you have to wait until someone gets hurt first.

Yeah? It's kind of like how we have to wait until someone gets murdered to charge someone with murder.

 

[sangha]

Re: DO I support racism?

Wrong. Government also exists for the management and protection of the society.

That is the essential point that flies right over the head of libertarians who think protecting individual rights are the sole reason for govt.

 

[ecofarm]

Re: DO I support racism?

You guys sure do have a bunch of conflicting missions for the state.

False.

We agree that the state is to protect rights. We just include the rights of more than one person, consider all the rights in question an decide which trumps. That's how law works, Henrin, even if you personally cannot understand that.

 

[Master PO]

Re: DO I support racism?

No. You just CHOOSE to see the govt's protection of public safety as different because you dont object to it, or are used to it...or even see the sense in it.

But you dont like the same protection of public safety when applied through anti-discrimination. And I've given examples of exactly how it can harm society...physically and economically.

explain to me how, if discriminated against, your rights are not secure.......as stated you have NO RIGHTS, to exercise on my property.

and you have failed to show a rights violation