Discrimination against men.

[SCitizen]

There are several ways in which men are discriminated, and thus need advocacy:
1) Men are discriminated in divorce cases.
2) Even though at the very least 20% of domestic violence victims are men, there is severe discrimination against them. And that effects at least hundreds of thousands of men.
3) Given that many or most sex crime convictions are based on the accuser's word alone, many of USA's 1,010,000 sex offenders may be innocent.
4) Men are discriminated by the criminal justice system. On average men get http://www.law.umich.edu/newsandinfo/features/Pages/starr_gender_disparities.aspx”]63% longer sentences than women.[/URL]
5) The media contains a lot of male -- bashing that would have been unacceptable had genders been reversed.
6) Millions of men and hundreds of thousands of women are survivors of years of abuse by mothers or other female caretakers. I must admit that men perpetrate 40% of child abuse.
I am not denying that women do face discrimination in many countries and may face discrimination in USA. I do not know if male privilege is real, but even if it is, men still have legal and moral right to voice their issues.
Many men already doubt the idea that men are privileged oppressors. In UK, only 16% of men consider themselves feminist and 8% of men consider themselves antifeminist.
In USA, 22% of men and 9% of women believe that men face worse discrimination then women. Hardly a tiny minority. Of course 57% of men and 77% of women still believe that women face more discrimination. American Men’s and Women’s Beliefs about Gender Discrimination: For Men, It’s Not Quite a ZeroSum Game.

 

[SCitizen]

I do not know if male privilege is real, but even if it is, men still have legal and moral right to voice their issues.

One of the tenants of Liberal Communitarian philosophy is that the "privileged groups" have a duty not to talk about reverse discrimination.

 

[Ray410]

There are several ways in which men are discriminated, and thus need advocacy:
1) Men are discriminated in divorce cases.
2) Even though at the very least 20% of domestic violence victims are men, there is severe discrimination against them. And that effects at least hundreds of thousands of men.
3) Given that many or most sex crime convictions are based on the accuser's word alone, many of USA's 1,010,000 sex offenders may be innocent.
4) Men are discriminated by the criminal justice system. On average men get http://www.law.umich.edu/newsandinfo/features/Pages/starr_gender_disparities.aspx”]63% longer sentences than women.[/URL]
5) The media contains a lot of male -- bashing that would have been unacceptable had genders been reversed.
6) Millions of men and hundreds of thousands of women are survivors of years of abuse by mothers or other female caretakers. I must admit that men perpetrate 40% of child abuse.
I am not denying that women do face discrimination in many countries and may face discrimination in USA. I do not know if male privilege is real, but even if it is, men still have legal and moral right to voice their issues.
Many men already doubt the idea that men are privileged oppressors. In UK, only 16% of men consider themselves feminist and 8% of men consider themselves antifeminist.
In USA, 22% of men and 9% of women believe that men face worse discrimination then women. Hardly a tiny minority. Of course 57% of men and 77% of women still believe that women face more discrimination. American Men’s and Women’s Beliefs about Gender Discrimination: For Men, It’s Not Quite a ZeroSum Game.

Hope you're wearing your rain coat.

 

[Aunt Spiker]

There are several ways in which men are discriminated, and thus need advocacy:
1) Men are discriminated in divorce cases.
2) Even though at the very least 20% of domestic violence victims are men, there is severe discrimination against them. And that effects at least hundreds of thousands of men.
3) Given that many or most sex crime convictions are based on the accuser's word alone, many of USA's 1,010,000 sex offenders may be innocent.
4) Men are discriminated by the criminal justice system. On average men get http://www.law.umich.edu/newsandinfo/features/Pages/starr_gender_disparities.aspx”]63% longer sentences than women.[/URL]
5) The media contains a lot of male -- bashing that would have been unacceptable had genders been reversed.
6) Millions of men and hundreds of thousands of women are survivors of years of abuse by mothers or other female caretakers. I must admit that men perpetrate 40% of child abuse.
I am not denying that women do face discrimination in many countries and may face discrimination in USA. I do not know if male privilege is real, but even if it is, men still have legal and moral right to voice their issues.
Many men already doubt the idea that men are privileged oppressors. In UK, only 16% of men consider themselves feminist and 8% of men consider themselves antifeminist.
In USA, 22% of men and 9% of women believe that men face worse discrimination then women. Hardly a tiny minority. Of course 57% of men and 77% of women still believe that women face more discrimination. American Men’s and Women’s Beliefs about Gender Discrimination: For Men, It’s Not Quite a ZeroSum Game.

Now I've written threads regarding our social views that rail against men and discourages them from certain behaviors in life while at the same time scolding them for being more removed from family life - etc.

However - some of what you've written is reflective of ongoing issues regarding males and how they approach or treat their selves and other males.

The numbers I've highlighted are because we're still coming out of a past era where males were deemed superior to women in some ways, by them selves - women were considered default nurturers and therefor better parents by those same males - and so on. They're remnants of our past sexism in our country (and across many countries - not just the US).

The fact that we're still seeing these things means that many people - mostly men - haven't come out of the stone age. in fact, many men will encourage it or prefer it this way.
​

Look at law and legal related issues: Who hands down those sentences or is first on scene to deal with domestic abuse? Most likely it's male police, lawyers, judiciary, etc.

 

[Nilly]

There are several ways in which men are discriminated, and thus need advocacy:
1) Men are discriminated in divorce cases.
2) Even though at the very least 20% of domestic violence victims are men, there is severe discrimination against them. And that effects at least hundreds of thousands of men.
3) Given that many or most sex crime convictions are based on the accuser's word alone, many of USA's 1,010,000 sex offenders may be innocent.
4) Men are discriminated by the criminal justice system. On average men get http://www.law.umich.edu/newsandinfo/features/Pages/starr_gender_disparities.aspx”]63% longer sentences than women.[/URL]
5) The media contains a lot of male -- bashing that would have been unacceptable had genders been reversed.
6) Millions of men and hundreds of thousands of women are survivors of years of abuse by mothers or other female caretakers. I must admit that men perpetrate 40% of child abuse.
I am not denying that women do face discrimination in many countries and may face discrimination in USA. I do not know if male privilege is real, but even if it is, men still have legal and moral right to voice their issues.
Many men already doubt the idea that men are privileged oppressors. In UK, only 16% of men consider themselves feminist and 8% of men consider themselves antifeminist.
In USA, 22% of men and 9% of women believe that men face worse discrimination then women. Hardly a tiny minority. Of course 57% of men and 77% of women still believe that women face more discrimination. American Men’s and Women’s Beliefs about Gender Discrimination: For Men, It’s Not Quite a ZeroSum Game.

Do you at least acknowledge the fact that women do face some discrimination just for being women?

 

[SCitizen]

Do you at least acknowledge the fact that women do face some discrimination just for being women?

Possibly so. Mainstream media and university education cover these subjects at great length.

With the rise of social networks and Internet -- based media, many men and some women begin to understand the issue of discrimination against men.

 

[SCitizen]

Look at law and legal related issues: Who hands down those sentences or is first on scene to deal with domestic abuse? Most likely it's male police, lawyers, judiciary, etc.

Of course some men share guilt in all these problems.

Nevertheless, there has been a documented history of some feminists harassing anyone who tries to talk about abused men in the media -- from 1977 to 2014.

 

[Aunt Spiker]

Of course some men share guilt in all these problems.

Nevertheless, there has been a documented history of some feminists harassing anyone who tries to talk about abused men in the media -- from 1977 to 2014.

And vice versa - some men harass anyone discussing abused and negated women. Media or not.

Minorities do not shape the bigger picture, however. There's much more to it - and if you look closely - some of your points conflict with each other, I just pointed out one incidence.

 

[CanadaJohn]

There are several ways in which men are discriminated, and thus need advocacy:
1) Men are discriminated in divorce cases.
2) Even though at the very least 20% of domestic violence victims are men, there is severe discrimination against them. And that effects at least hundreds of thousands of men.
3) Given that many or most sex crime convictions are based on the accuser's word alone, many of USA's 1,010,000 sex offenders may be innocent.
4) Men are discriminated by the criminal justice system. On average men get http://www.law.umich.edu/newsandinfo/features/Pages/starr_gender_disparities.aspx”]63% longer sentences than women.[/URL]
5) The media contains a lot of male -- bashing that would have been unacceptable had genders been reversed.
6) Millions of men and hundreds of thousands of women are survivors of years of abuse by mothers or other female caretakers. I must admit that men perpetrate 40% of child abuse.
I am not denying that women do face discrimination in many countries and may face discrimination in USA. I do not know if male privilege is real, but even if it is, men still have legal and moral right to voice their issues.
Many men already doubt the idea that men are privileged oppressors. In UK, only 16% of men consider themselves feminist and 8% of men consider themselves antifeminist.
In USA, 22% of men and 9% of women believe that men face worse discrimination then women. Hardly a tiny minority. Of course 57% of men and 77% of women still believe that women face more discrimination. American Men’s and Women’s Beliefs about Gender Discrimination: For Men, It’s Not Quite a ZeroSum Game.

As a white man, approaching 60, I've never felt discriminated against at any time in my life based on my gender - often the contrary.

Now, if I was a young white man just starting out, graduating from university, I might experience a fair bit of anti-white, anti-male discrimination, if I was applying for a position in the public service. Job postings in the public service, at least here, are the equivalent of "no blacks allowed" signs posted in the American south in the early 20th century. Even just getting that university diploma may be a struggle for the young white man, with special scholarships and placements reserved for minority candidates.

My timing may have been bad as it relates to being tech and computer savvy, but my timing was perfect when it came to coming of age and entering the workforce when jobs were plenty and the job seeker had options.

 

[Paschendale]

Of that list, the first two are legitimate. The rest are a lot of whining. Number 3 is based on the misogynist fantasy that rape is really just buyer's remorse and women who accuse men of rape are lying. 4's link doesn't work, but it doesn't seem to account for what crimes these men are convicted of. 5 is demonstrably wrong. 6 is unsupported.

If you don' know that male privilege is real, then you simply aren't paying attention.

 

[SCitizen]

Number 3 is based on the misogynist fantasy that rape is really just buyer's remorse and women who accuse men of rape are lying.

Fortunately more and more men are rejecting the misandrist fantasy that accusation proves guilt. If it is his word against hers there is no way to know who is lying.

 

[SCitizen]

Now, if I was a young white man just starting out, graduating from university, I might experience a fair bit of anti-white, anti-male discrimination, if I was applying for a position in the public service. Job postings in the public service, at least here, are the equivalent of "no blacks allowed" signs posted in the American south in the early 20th century. Even just getting that university diploma may be a struggle for the young white man, with special scholarships and placements reserved for minority candidates.

Thanks a lot. According to YouGov poll the number of antifeminists in 18 -- 24 age group is four times as high as in 40 -- 59 age group. Antifeminists are still outnumbered by feminists 6:1.

 

[Zinthaniel]

There are several ways in which men are discriminated, and thus need advocacy:
1) Men are discriminated in divorce cases.
2) Even though at the very least 20% of domestic violence victims are men, there is severe discrimination against them. And that effects at least hundreds of thousands of men.
3) Given that many or most sex crime convictions are based on the accuser's word alone, many of USA's 1,010,000 sex offenders may be innocent.
4) Men are discriminated by the criminal justice system. On average men get http://www.law.umich.edu/newsandinfo/features/Pages/starr_gender_disparities.aspx”]63% longer sentences than women.[/URL]
5) The media contains a lot of male -- bashing that would have been unacceptable had genders been reversed.
6) Millions of men and hundreds of thousands of women are survivors of years of abuse by mothers or other female caretakers. I must admit that men perpetrate 40% of child abuse.
I am not denying that women do face discrimination in many countries and may face discrimination in USA. I do not know if male privilege is real, but even if it is, men still have legal and moral right to voice their issues.
Many men already doubt the idea that men are privileged oppressors. In UK, only 16% of men consider themselves feminist and 8% of men consider themselves antifeminist.
In USA, 22% of men and 9% of women believe that men face worse discrimination then women. Hardly a tiny minority. Of course 57% of men and 77% of women still believe that women face more discrimination. American Men’s and Women’s Beliefs about Gender Discrimination: For Men, It’s Not Quite a ZeroSum Game.

Everything you wrote in your list is a result of Men not women. Specifically it is the result of the male ideal that he is the strong, stern, provider and that the women is the fragile, pregnant, caretaker.

The leniency for women in law was set up by men stemming from that ideal.

There is not a single law created or advocated by women that will or has negatively effected men.

I have never met a women that advocated for male subjugation. If you know of any Prominent female figures that are advocating for legislation that would negatively effect me as a man please point them out. Please point out what the legislation is that they are pushing for.

 

[SCitizen]

Everything you wrote in your list is a result of Men not women. Specifically it is the result of the male ideal that he is the strong, stern, provider and that the women is the fragile, pregnant, caretaker.

The leniency for women in law was set up by men stemming from that ideal.

There is not a single law created or advocated by women that will or has negatively effected men.

I have never met a women that advocated for male subjugation. If you know of any Prominent female figures that are advocating for legislation that would negatively effect me as a man please point them out. Please point out what the legislation is that they are pushing for.

Given that both genders have built and shaped our civilization, many men would disagree with the notion that only men are guilty of all the problems our civilization faces.

 

[Zinthaniel]

Given that both genders have built and shaped our civilization, many men would disagree with the notion that only men are guilty of all the problems our civilization faces.

Provide examples of how women have, in any way, taken part in building laws that have discriminated against men. It doesn't matter what "many men" would think, what matters are the facts.

Also history is very clear on what gender had and still does have the primary power in government and therefore who had the ultimate say in what was determined law in any given society.

In fact, name one law from any time period that was created by women or a woman that negatively effected the male gender. Name one from any time in the history of mankind.

 

[Gipper]

OP is right and there is nothing we can do about it. Men have to embrace their manhood first, and stop being scared of women, emotions, and hurt feelings.

 

[Zinthaniel]

OP is right and there is nothing we can do about it. Men have to embrace their manhood first, and stop being scared of women, emotions, and hurt feelings.

Some of the discriminations he listed do exists, however his belief that women played in role in their creation is wrong.

 

[Gipper]

Some of the discriminations he listed do exists, however his belief that women played in role in their creation is wrong.

Oh women played a role - just not as much as liberal men that are easily manipulated and whipped. They were taught, successfully, by women that being a man is a source of shame. Because of that, you have to overcompensate and swing the pendulum too far back.

 

[Zinthaniel]

Oh women played a role - just not as much as liberal men that are easily manipulated and whipped. They were taught, successfully, by women that being a man is a source of shame. Because of that, you have to overcompensate and swing the pendulum too far back.

Right. Can you give an example of how women have played a role, other than your funny jibes.

 

[spud_meister]

Oh women played a role - just not as much as liberal men that are easily manipulated and whipped. They were taught, successfully, by women that being a man is a source of shame. Because of that, you have to overcompensate and swing the pendulum too far back.

 

[Gipper]

Right. Can you give an example of how women have played a role, other than your funny jibes.

One word - feminists. You're just ignorant to the plight because many of the equalities are things you'll never, ever have to worry about.

Being the bottom doesn't count.

 

[Zinthaniel]

One word - feminists. You're just ignorant to the plight because many of the equalities are things you'll never, ever have to worry about.

I asked you to name an example of how women have in any way created laws that discriminate against men and you couldn't. It's been a while since you and I debated. I forgot how horrible you where at this.

Being the bottom doesn't count.

Well you would know.

 

[Gipper]

FMLA. Title IX. I could go on and on. Women have their hands on all of these. And as I said - most are inapplicable. Neither you nor Julian need time off when you adopt a puppy together.

 

[Zinthaniel]

FMLA. Title IX. I could go on and on. Women have their hands on all of these. And as I said - most are inapplicable. Neither you nor Julian need time off when you adopt a puppy together.

What laws have FMLA or Title IX created that are now enforced that now discriminate against the male gender? Do you not understand the question? Give an example.

 

[Gipper]

What laws have FMLA or Title IX created that are now enforced that now discriminate against the male gender? Do you not understand the question? Give an example.

FMLA prevents women from being fired for cause. Title IX prevents male collegiate athletes from being paid for services.