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Democratic Debate Discussion Thread

I don't think it will be Bush in the General. I don't see him getting the nomination. Honestly, I think it's going to be Rubio versus Clinton.

That would be interesting. Rubio seems the most together and genuine of all the republican candidates.

I am keeping an open mind yet I suspect a Clinton/Sanders ticket would dance circles around any of the republicans.

The strange part is I detested GWB and like Jeb --- until he admitted he would line up the same administration and advisors as GWB. His advisors are failing him --- he should forcefully communicate he is not only his own man --- he will not be appointing any of the crew GWB did.He has to really fight that elephant in the room and he is not setting himself apart enough. His advisors should be fired.

Is there anyone here who thinks Trump stands a chance?
 
Do me a favor. Call all the republicans and tell them to go on TV and tell everyone that Medicare is a ponzi scheme and needs to go.

Thanks in advance.



Do tell the world who.

Exactly!
 
A persistent meme on the right since the 2012 election has been the notion that Obama voters are "moochers" who voted for "free stuff' or handouts. Right-wingers are puzzling in their decision to insult the American people whose votes they need. Apparently you patriots who constantly shout how much you love America just do not care too much for the American people.

In addition to being an inaccurate stereotype of the nation's poor and working class voters, the overgeneralization about low-income uneducated slackers making up the Democratic base also overlooks the breadth of our coalition. Mr Obama won among college educated voters and he won overwhelmingly among voters who had advanced degrees. In other words, freeloaders like physicians, attorneys, research scientists, pharmacists, psychiatrists, professors, librarians and other professionals who have at least a Master's degree. These are the people supporting Sanders.

It is smoke and mirrors when the right hacks do this song and dance. Not only are the red demographics the ones feeding on the tax payer trough --- it is progressives that want to build infrastructure, have smart defense foreign policy and invest in our country with smart polices that use our money widely.

The Blue demographic feed the red demographic.


https://wallethub.com/edu/states-most-least-dependent-on-the-federal-government/2700/
 
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That would be interesting. Rubio seems the most together and genuine of all the republican candidates.

I am keeping an open mind yet I suspect a Clinton/Sanders ticket would dance circles around any of the republicans.

The strange part is I detested GWB and like Jeb --- until he admitted he would line up the same administration and advisors as GWB. His advisors are failing him --- he should forcefully communicate he is not only his own man --- he will not be appointing any of the crew GWB did.He has to really fight that elephant in the room and he is not setting himself apart enough. His advisors should be fired.

Is there anyone here who thinks Trump stands a chance?

picking Sanders for VP may be the only way she can get me to vote for her
 
picking Sanders for VP may be the only way she can get me to vote for her

I prefer either of the two of them over any republican and like a Venn diagram there are components of each I like. I guess we will just have to watch it unfold. She is very smart --- Sanders and Clinton are already schmoozing. Whomever gets it will have the other on their administration or VP.

Sanders and Clinton are friends and in cahoots --- even while debating or tweeting or talking. I could see during the debate they like and respect each other.

Here is a sample of their tweets.

Hillary Clinton ✔@HillaryClinton
I agree with Bernie. Focus must be on helping America's middle class. GOP would hold them back. I welcome him to the race. –H
Follow
Bernie Sanders ✔@BernieSanders
Thanks @HillaryClinton. Looking forward to debating the big issues: income inequality, climate change & getting big money out of politics.
 
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Rightwingers think liberals want "free stuff". The truth is, rightwingers want free government

I disagree. They seem to want the best government that their 5 SCOTUS' have decided to let them buy.
 
So the Pundit dumbasses have decided to run with the theme that Clinton won the debate running away. Here's some interesting facts that have shown up:

Fuming Bernie supporters: Why is CNN deleting our comments?
Hundreds on Facebook complain about network’s pro-Hillary coverage

Seeing their comments repeatedly deleted by CNN, Bernie Sanders supporters are hopping mad today.
Already feeling the news network’s coverage had become rabidly pro-Hillary in the aftermath of last night’s debate, Facebook users leaving reactions on CNN’s page are now continually re-posting them, knowing they will be quickly removed. There are hundreds in a seeming battle with the network, with no explanation as to why.​



Sanders wins every poll and focus group. CNN declares Hillary the winner

First, Sanders won every internet poll where people were asked won won the debate. Now, you might say these polls "aren't scientific". And you're right, but there wasn't an instant poll that was to contradict it. So the only polling evidence points to Sanders win.

Second, Sanders won the "most talked about" category. On both Twitter and Facebook, Sanders got the most mentions on both Facebook and Twitter. This suggests he got people wanting to talk about him.

Third, Sanders also got the most google searches. Which means he generated the most interest period. People wanted to know more about him. Unlike the other 3 candidates, his searches didn't spike and disappear. He remained the most searched through most of the debate.

Fourth, You might be thinking, "But that just means only plugged-in youth support him"(as if in this day and age, only 20-somethings are on facebook & twitter). But, we have another data point. Fox News(I know, I know...) had a focus group of florida democrats and guess what? In that focus group, most everyone said Sanders won. In fact, he even won over some Hillary supporters.

Fifth, "fusion" got together some young people who are registered democrats. He won that group too! So its not just fox news.​

Yes, Bernie even won in the eyes of CNN's own focus group as well. So I decided to take a peak at something at opensecrets.org...

Hillary's biggest contributors.

#8 Time Warner.

Time to done my tinfoil hat.

Still think the people believe Sanders didn't win the debate? I Wonder why so many seem to disagree?

Bernie Sanders Touts Big Fundraising Haul After Dem Debate

Sanders raised over $1.4 million dollars from the start of the debate until about 3 a.m. eastern, his campaign said. According to his campaign, they received at least 44,000 individual donations, with the average contribution being $31.54.​
 
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Your first sentence presumes there is symmetry in party dysfunction. The Dems never had a problem picking a Speaker of the House. The Dems don't reject science or the progressive income tax.

The real crazy radical ideas are contained in the new GOP.

I agree that the far more radical ideas are from the GOP. However, if dems are about science then it's as simple as looking at the budget for new ideas. I like the idea of health care, free higher education, but we can't afford it without major change. I hear no dem discussing the budget and how we will afford these things. I am sure it's just not popular to say we need to raise taxes and cut back on government spending.
 
Your imaginary party is loaded with inconsistencies and is simplistic. #1, "We won't cut benefits for any citizens" conflicts with #2, "Government cost cuts will be swift and deep to afford the above benefits." This ignores the fact that, as one economist calls it, the government is an insurance company with an army. Most federal spending is concentrated in the programs that you don't want to cut, while mandating deep cus in total spending. You can't have both.

$80,000 a year isn't much money to attract qualified Senators, unless you want them taking graft or only want independently wealthy Senators.
Mandating a 4-year term limit means that Senators will have little experience in the area they are assigned in committees. We already have term limits. They are called elections.
There is no need for a balanced budget. There are conditions that require deficits, such as wars and recessions, where spending helps right the economy.
Whether a drug is legal or not should be up to the States and not imposed upon by the federal government.
Saying that "Gun control was already addressed by the second amendment, so it's not an agenda item," says nothing. The Second Amendment says, "A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed." The widespread legal and judicial interpretation is that the Second Amendment guarantees a state's right to be armed, to form a militia. That has nothing to do with individual rights to own pistols.
I don't even know what, "tax breaks are no more and percentage of income is fair," means.

1 and 2 are not inconsistent, but they are imaginary. I am trying to convey that I would like someone to focus on funding Social Security, Medicare, and Welfare. We can cut things such as military, NSA, ATF, and DEA spending to fund programs for our citizens. We need the government to cut spending in other areas before cutting out citizen benefits.
Find me a senator that's worth a damn and then tell me $80,000 isn't enough. It's a service job and we don't need career politicians so term limits (again imaginary) would be a good thing to move things forward in this country.

It's nice you can copy and paste the second amendment, but can you read what it says. It's not a debate it's simple "the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed."


I am getting off topic. The idea of the post and it's poorly phrased and imaginary details are to see if anyone else thinks this way. We don't have to split everything down the lines. If you support guns then you must be on the right. If you support benefits then you must be on the left. We don't have to force every issue and draw a line in the sand. I need a candidate that doesn't see everything in black and white but I can't find one.
Any suggestions?
 
Social Secuity is a scheme that takes payments and funnels them to beneficiaries. It's called insurance.

Of course, some rich dude living off of inherited wealth wouldn't understand how seniors depend upon the system.

Thats not the definition of insurance.

I didn't realize "rich dudes" dont understand the concept of needing more medical care in old age. :mrgreen:
 
Do me a favor. Call all the republicans and tell them to go on TV and tell everyone that Medicare is a ponzi scheme and needs to go.

Thanks in advance.



Do tell the world who.

Its unethical and irresponsible to pass on a failing model. If every American had the option of investing conservatively what they are forced to pay into medicare-they would end up in a much better situation.

Knowing the boomers are on their way out, and that those in successive generations aren't going to be able to pay for it-it should be phased out.

Many people know this-but its not a politically expedient policy.
 
Its unethical and irresponsible to pass on a failing model. If every American had the option of investing conservatively what they are forced to pay into medicare-they would end up in a much better situation.

Knowing the boomers are on their way out, and that those in successive generations aren't going to be able to pay for it-it should be phased out.

Many people know this-but its not a politically expedient policy.

Don't tell me. Tell your party to scream it from the hilltops.
 
Its unethical and irresponsible to pass on a failing model. If every American had the option of investing conservatively what they are forced to pay into medicare-they would end up in a much better situation.

Knowing the boomers are on their way out, and that those in successive generations aren't going to be able to pay for it-it should be phased out.

Many people know this-but its not a politically expedient policy.

Social Security covers more than just retirement. Are we just hoping charity will take care of the elderly, disabled, and survivors who didn't save or make enough to invest? I say it's our personal responsibility to care for these people using tax dollars.

https://www.socialsecurity.gov/news/press/factsheets/young.htm
 
Social Security covers more than just retirement. Are we just hoping charity will take care of the elderly, disabled, and survivors who didn't save or make enough to invest? I say it's our personal responsibility to care for these people using tax dollars.

https://www.socialsecurity.gov/news/press/factsheets/young.htm

Does something in your link (from the agency that has an interest in taking care of itself) disprove the fact that its a ponzi scheme?

The math simply does not add up.

Blame math.
 
Its unethical and irresponsible to pass on a failing model. If every American had the option of investing conservatively what they are forced to pay into medicare-they would end up in a much better situation.

Knowing the boomers are on their way out, and that those in successive generations aren't going to be able to pay for it-it should be phased out.

Many people know this-but its not a politically expedient policy.

What are you rambling about?

I don't expect my taxes to generate some profit for me. I don't have to sit here and "keep score" between taxes and services. That just betrays all the historical investment like the roads, defense, stability, and generations of educations.

The idea that you would try to claim abolishing SS is good for Americans is obscene.
 
What are you rambling about?

I don't expect my taxes to generate some profit for me. I don't have to sit here and "keep score" between taxes and services. That just betrays all the historical investment like the roads, defense, stability, and generations of educations.

The idea that you would try to claim abolishing SS is good for Americans is obscene.

Why shouldn't YOUR money be used in the most efficient manner?

Its not keeping score, its basic math.
 
Does something in your link (from the agency that has an interest in taking care of itself) disprove the fact that its a ponzi scheme?

The math simply does not add up.

Blame math.

A ponzi scheme wouldn't last eighty years. Basic math.
 
Why shouldn't YOUR money be used in the most efficient manner?

Its not keeping score, its basic math.

It's not about math, it is about people. Who's going to bail you out when your "conservative" investments don't pay off?
 
Why shouldn't YOUR money be used in the most efficient manner?

Its not keeping score, its basic math.

If my money isn't being used efficiently, that is a failure of policy.

Dissolving the government is not an improvement in policy.

Abolishing services completely does not make them more efficient.
 
Kojak!

Telly Savalas was the NYC detective who was into lollipops.

I really liked those old non PC shows from that era.

I know it sounds dated, but those old cop shows attempted to portray protagonists in an era when we expected "men to be men" - with all the good AND imperfection that entailed.

And they're a ton of fun. As corny as they get, and dated they look, I still love 'em!

FWIW, I recently watched some reruns of "Welcome Back Kotter". Wow! John Travolta is amazing as Vinny Barbarino. I was just getting out of H.S. when it aired, and having Italian blood (Calabrese) from my Mom, and living in a similar neighborhood to the Sweathogs, I so badly wanted (and tried) to be as cool as he was!

:mrgreen: :mrgreen: :mrgreen:

And now we know that Italian Vinny Barbarino likes very special comforting massages from male masseurs. (This has been confirmed by a gay male I know, who knows a gay masseur here, and counts "Vinny" among his "special" clients, when he's in town.) Who would've thought.
 
As long as the population keeps rising, ponzi schemes work fine.

Its what comes after thats the trouble.

Well, social security has lasted eighty years in this country. Much longer in Germany, since about the late 1880's. Ponzi's scheme lasted a couple years at most. As populations keep rising, more people will pay in. Social security has kept many people from poverty. Even Ayn Rand and Fredrich Hayek, the libertarians that hated these socialist programs until they themselves had to apply for medicare and social security. Guess they found out that their great free market, conservative ideas didn't account for old age.
 
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