COPS fear that 25 British-born Muslims are plotting to bomb Western airliners.

[zimmer]

Cops fear 25 British-born Muslims are plotting to bomb Western airliners | The Sun |News

"We know there are four or five radicalised British Muslim cells in the Yemen.

"They are due back within months when they will be under constant surveillance."

The 25 suspects, of Pakistani and Somali descent, were radicalised in UK mosques.

Some had been to university and studied engineering or computer sciences.

No racial profiling please. We can't afford to offend Muslims. They might get angry and begin attacking us.

And pleeeez... no cartoons. This really seems to piss 'em off.

.

 

[Red_Dave]

Cops fear 25 British-born Muslims are plotting to bomb Western airliners | The Sun |News


No racial profiling please. We can't afford to offend Muslims. They might get angry and begin attacking us.

And pleeeez... no cartoons. This really seems to piss 'em off.

.

When was the last time someone on here condemned profiling on the basis of not offending Muslims? Making up arguments on others behalf..........not cool.

Also bear in mind that profiling for Arabs (whatever Arabs are supposed to look like) would not have helped in this situation.

 

[Zyphlin]

It is my understanding studies of law enforcement have found that generalized racial profiling increases cost, increases the amount of wrongful detainment and arrest, and little actual increase in deterence or decrease of crime.

To a point we must weigh the potential benefit we'd get from such profiling to the precedence it sets and the damage it does to our rights. But far be it for me to think its laughable that so called conservatives are in favor of expansion of government, big government, and big government power. :roll:

Glad that intelligence agencies and law enforcement around the world are working dilligently on this, that cells like this are found, and that when looking at everything in the scope of the big picture we have been incredibly effective and a bit lucky in regards to these things, with few if any attacks actually reaching a point where potential damage could be, or is, done.

 

[dontworrybehappy]

I just thought about this. An airline is a business, right? A private business has the right to refuse service to anyone, right? Why don't airlines simply refuse to board anyone of middleeastern decent? They have that right. Refund the money, or don't sell them a ticket in the first place, and make them take a bus. There are other ways to get around other than an airplane.

If a service station can refuse to serve me because I don't have shoes on my feet then an airline can refuse to serve a muslim due to the possible threat they pose to the public.

What say you, DP?

 

[Hatuey]

I just thought about this. An airline is a business, right? A private business has the right to refuse service to anyone, right? Why don't airlines simply refuse to board anyone of middleeastern decent? They have that right. Refund the money, or don't sell them a ticket in the first place, and make them take a bus. There are other ways to get around other than an airplane.

If a service station can refuse to serve me because I don't have shoes on my feet then an airline can refuse to serve a muslim due to the possible threat they pose to the public.

What say you, DP?

Somalis and Pakistanis are not Middle Eastern. Learn Geography.

Somalia :

Pakistan :

Middle East :

The majority of Muslims DO NOT live in the Middle East.

 

[Tucker Case]

How will profiling Arabs have help prevent attacks from people who are of Indian and African decent?

 

[dontworrybehappy]

Um, we had a lot more damage done by men of middleeastern decent then any other.

Learn history.

 

[Tucker Case]

Um, we had a lot more damage done by men of middleeastern decent then any other.

Learn history.

What do you mean by "damage"?

 

[zimmer]

When was the last time someone on here condemned profiling on the basis of not offending Muslims? Making up arguments on others behalf..........not cool.

Also bear in mind that profiling for Arabs (whatever Arabs are supposed to look like) would not have helped in this situation.

Who's talking about people here... I'm talking in general.

Cartoons offend them ... racial profiling doesn't.
They complain about racial profiling, but it doesn't offend them?
May I suggest google?

Gotcha.

I wonder when bombs, death and mutilation by their brethren will offend to the point they start condemning the antics of these beasts?

.

 

[Tucker Case]

Cartoons offend a lot of people. I could come up with cartoons that could offend people of any race/religion/creed/nationality/sexual orientation/nationality.

What's the big deal about being offended by a cartoon?

 

[dontworrybehappy]

What do you mean by "damage"?

This cat the other day burned up his leg. The men on 9-11 knocked down 2 buildings and killed 3000 people.

If you can't contemplate the destructive difference between the two then our conversation is over.

I say then, no MUSLIMS on airplanes, period. You can nit pick geography if you want, but they were all Muslims so, no muslims on aircraft. Period.

What problem do you have with that? They were ALL muslim, were they not?

 

[Hatuey]

Um, we had a lot more damage done by men of middleeastern decent then any other.

Learn history.

Middle Eastern are two separate words. Please learn this. It's annoying. Secondly, your theory obviously works. Stop Arabs from flying and terrorists won't start recruiting elsewhere. No. Your profiling technique is also a failure.

 

[Hatuey]

This cat the other day burned up his leg.

He was Nigerian. Not Middle Eastern.

The men on 9-11 knocked down 2 buildings and killed 3000 people.

And how many similar attacks have we had in the last 100 years? Yeah. No your stupidity is showing.

If you can't contemplate the destructive difference between the two then our conversation is over.

I say then, no MUSLIMS on airplanes, period. You can nit pick geography if you want, but they were all Muslims so, no muslims on aircraft. Period.

What problem do you have with that? They were ALL muslim, were they not?

How do you profile a Muslim?

 

[bryann380]

We can't afford to offend Muslims. They might get angry and begin attacking us.

What do you think they have been doing since Sept 2001?? They already ARE angry and attacking us. Why should Americans care if any muslim is offended when they clearly don't care about us?

 

[Ikari]

And how many similar attacks have we had in the last 100 years? Yeah. No your stupidity is showing.

I think this is a point which isn't stressed enough. How many terrorist attacks have we suffered on State soil (the 50 proper) like 9/11. That successful and that destructive? And even with how destructive and deadly the 9/11 attacks were, they still didn't get as many as cars do in a year.

Another thing was that 9/11 spoiled doing something like that again. Look at this case. Some dude tried to blow up a plane and it didn't work out so well (BTW, what is up with terrorists and planes, it's getting old). You're not going to repeat a 9/11, conditions are different.

As for racial profiling, I think maybe we can be more aware of certain races as they are statistically more prone to belong to certain groups. But racially profiling in full is not going to yield anything beneficial. You can't restrict yourself to a few races and not conceive the possibility that maybe these groups will start recruiting different races to easily bypass the racial profiling.

 

[Arcana XV]

I just thought about this. An airline is a business, right? A private business has the right to refuse service to anyone, right? Why don't airlines simply refuse to board anyone of middleeastern decent? They have that right. Refund the money, or don't sell them a ticket in the first place, and make them take a bus. There are other ways to get around other than an airplane.

If a service station can refuse to serve me because I don't have shoes on my feet then an airline can refuse to serve a muslim due to the possible threat they pose to the public.

What say you, DP?

I say good luck finding even ONE airline that will ago along with this. :lol:

 

[Charles Martel]

It isn't nationality...this man Nigerian, the 9-11 hijackers from Yemen and Saudi Arabia, Major Hasan born and raised American, the 5 northern Va boys being held by Pakistan are a mix of ethnicities, the Gitmo prisoners from Chinese Ughars to Indonesian al-Qaeda.

The Iranians aren't even Arab, they're Persian, the English doctor's airplane attacks, no....there is no ethnicity that is a common denominator.

And this Nigerian came from a priviledged life, the 9-11 hijackers not poverty stricken, Osama Bin Laden himself a millionaire and educated engineer, so, it's not your plot or position of economics that is telling here.

The common denominator is militant Islam, all those listed above were devout Muslims.

 

[Hatuey]

It isn't nationality...this man Nigerian, the 9-11 hijackers from Yemen and Saudi Arabia, Major Hasan born and raised American, the 5 northern Va boys being held by Pakistan are a mix of ethnicities, the Gitmo prisoners from Chinese Ughars to Indonesian al-Qaeda.

The Iranians aren't even Arab, they're Persian, the English doctor's airplane attacks, no....there is no ethnicity that is a common denominator.

And this Nigerian came from a priviledged life, the 9-11 hijackers not poverty stricken, Osama Bin Laden himself a millionaire and educated engineer.

The common denominator is militant Islam, all those listed above were devout Muslims.

Now tell us. How do you profile a Muslim? What do they eat? What do they study? How do they dress? Do they all dress the same? Wear the same type of beard? Do they all have beards? What about turbans? How do you tell a person's religion short of stamping them with it? Is that what you're suggesting? A star of david arm band for Muslims? We just write everybody's religion on passports? Good luck getting anybody to pass that.

 

[Tucker Case]

This cat the other day burned up his leg. The men on 9-11 knocked down 2 buildings and killed 3000 people.

If you can't contemplate the destructive difference between the two then our conversation is over.

I say then, no MUSLIMS on airplanes, period. You can nit pick geography if you want, but they were all Muslims so, no muslims on aircraft. Period.

What problem do you have with that? They were ALL muslim, were they not?

How would you spot the Muslims in order to prevent them from getting on the plane?

Also, this doesn't define what you mean by "damage". Way my history books tally it, white Christians did the most "damage" to this country in the Civil war.

 

[Red_Dave]

Who's talking about people here... I'm talking in general.

Cartoons offend them ... racial profiling doesn't.
They complain about racial profiling, but it doesn't offend them?
May I suggest google?

Gotcha.

I wonder when bombs, death and mutilation by their brethren will offend to the point they start condemning the antics of these beasts?

.

Oh so its "Them" of course.......

 

[Tucker Case]

Moderator's Warning:

Cease the personal attacks

 

[Charles Martel]

Now tell us. How do you profile a Muslim?

For starters, this man was already marked, already on watch lists and in intelligence databases. Two, the man's father had become concerned for his son's radical Islamic leanings and contacted authorities back in mid-2009. Course, all of these connect the dots themes are only done during a Bush era investigation where there are those who have obviously been asleep at the wheel trying to blame others.

You don't profile a Muslim, Hatuey. You become unconcerned if a Umar Farouk Abdulmutallab boards a plane with a valid US Visa is what we do. We're afriad to profile, afraid to take a harder....much harder look...at a man who paid for his ticket in cash, is but 23 years old, and is in intel databases.

He should be subject to stricter searches, no one should be afraid for a political or racial profiling charge, THAT IS YOUR JOB.

You don't profile, you use experience and a fearless strategy to guage all passengers and not be the least bit afraid of pulling young Muslims, Jews, Christians, whatever from the queue for an airplane.

Furthermore, another look at procedure is also warranted. Dutch anti-terrorism officials stressed that proper procedures had been followed on their end, and that US authorities had cleared the flight for departure. If that's true, someone in the US needs another job. THis man was to be watched, his own father had tried to warn us. Thank God the even bigger man above was looking out for us all, everyone on that plane, I trust, went to church this past weekend. They need to thank someone else for their fortune.

 

[Hatuey]

For starters, this man was already marked, already on watch lists and in intelligence databases. Two, the man's father had become concerned for his son's radical Islamic leanings and contacted authorities back in mid-2009. Course, all of these connect the dots themes are only done during a Bush era investigation where there are those who have obviously been asleep at the wheel trying to blame others.

You don't profile a Muslim, Hatuey. You become unconcerned if a Umar Farouk Abdulmutallab boards a plane with a valid US Visa is what we do. We're afriad to profile, afraid to take a harder....much harder look...at a man who paid for his ticket in cash, is but 23 years old, and is in intel databases.

He should be subject to stricter searches, no one should be afraid for a political or racial profiling charge, THAT IS YOUR JOB.

You don't profile, you use experience and a fearless strategy to guage all passengers and not be the least bit afraid of pulling young Muslims, Jews, Christians, whatever from the queue for an airplane.

Furthermore, another look at procedure is also warranted. Dutch anti-terrorism officials stressed that proper procedures had been followed on their end, and that US authorities had cleared the flight for departure. If that's true, someone in the US needs another job. THis man was to be watched, his own father had tried to warn us. Thank God the even bigger man above was looking out for us all, everyone on that plane, I trust, went to church this past weekend. They need to thank someone else for their fortune.

Okay - here - how do you profile people who are devout then? Short of increasing the size of government and start surveilling anybody goes to mosque/church every single day?

 

[Zyphlin]

Charles, you make the point though.

The fact he was going one way paying all cash the fact he was on terrorist watch lists are bother greater reasons for why this guy needed higher scrutinty than his name, the way he looks, or his religion.

I agree, we don't need a society and an atmosphere where people are afraid to look harder at someone because they happen to have a muslim name. However those on the anti-PC crowd need to pull their head out of the sand and realize that those on THEIR side who are bigots, racists, and Big Government conservatives who push heavily for over the top, unneeded, and non-beneficial racial profiling help CAUSE that atmosphere as well by always pushing from an extreme point.

 

[apdst]

Charles, you make the point though.

The fact he was going one way paying all cash the fact he was on terrorist watch lists are bother greater reasons for why this guy needed higher scrutinty than his name, the way he looks, or his religion.[/'b]

I agree, we don't need a society and an atmosphere where people are afraid to look harder at someone because they happen to have a muslim name. However those on the anti-PC crowd need to pull their head out of the sand and realize that those on THEIR side who are bigots, racists, and Big Government conservatives who push heavily for over the top, unneeded, and non-beneficial racial profiling help CAUSE that atmosphere as well by always pushing from an extreme point.

But, the profile has to be complete. It doesn't make sense to tie down security personel doing a cavity search on Susie Q, from Omaha, Nebraska, just because she paid cash for a one way ticket. All the while, Mustaffa the suicide bomber skates right on through without notice, because he bought a two way ticket and used a credit card. We have to look at every single detail that might tip us off the the identity of a wouldbe hi-jacker/bomber.