Cheney: US should restart harsh interrogations, back Haspel (AP)

[j-mac]

https://apnews.com/b01b7b389dfb47cdafae4eb341ee0f5c

WASHINGTON (AP) — Former Vice President Dick Cheney said the U.S. should restart the harsh detention and interrogation practices used on terror suspects after 9/11, and called on the Senate to confirm CIA nominee Gina Haspel.

Brutal interrogation practices are currently banned under U.S. law, but debate on the issue has re-surfaced during Haspel’s confirmation process because she was once involved in the CIA’s interrogation program.
==========================================
Good old Dick Cheney wants to bring back water boarding & worse.

That guy that he shot in the face apologized for getting in the way but Cheney still wants his birdshot back.

What Cheney says today is largely irrelevant...He is a private citizen. He has his opinions, you have yours...But don't let that stop any of you progressives look completely deplorable in your hopes for him to die.....

 

[Aristaeus]

It's very effective. It's thousands of years old. If it didn't work, someone would have figured it out centuries ago.

Torture is not very effective, and even if it was, it would still be immoral.

When you find yourself supporting torture, it's time to step back and have a word with yourself.

 

[j-mac]

Because you are simply making crap up.

Yes, there were times we used torture. But it's been banned since the beginning, we've fought to stop it across the world, and we played a role in developing effective interrogation techniques.

You are embracing an Anti-American barbarism that doesn't work. The reason I mentioned the Jesuit Friedrich Spee was that he proved it didn't work 400 years ago.

For f**ks sake.

He also thought 'witchcraft' was real...Do you believe that witchcraft is real?

 

[j-mac]

Torture is not very effective, and even if it was, it would still be immoral.

When you find yourself supporting torture, it's time to step back and have a word with yourself.

Waterboarding led to the death of OBL which liberals are so fond of taking credit for.

 

[apdst]

Torture is not very effective, and even if it was, it would still be immoral.

When you find yourself supporting torture, it's time to step back and have a word with yourself.

You're mistaken.

When you find yourself putting fairy tail morals and the physical and mental comfort of a terrorist ahead of the safety of your own country and your countrymen, you need to seriously ask yourself whose side you're really on.

 

[late]

He also thought 'witchcraft' was real...Do you believe that witchcraft is real?

You need a point.

 

[apdst]

You need a point.

Do you believe witchcraft is real?

 

[late]

Ever hear of PO Box 1142? U.S. interrogators used torture to extract information from German POW's.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/P._O._Box_1142

Not according to your link:

"The former interrogators say they did not use physical torture..."

There is losing, and then there are things that are a lot worse.

You are in the 'lot worse' territory.

 

[late]

Do you believe witchcraft is real?

He was trying to discredit the Jesuit by changing the subject.

What he needs is a point, an actual argument that says the guy was wrong.

And that he simply does not have.

 

[apdst]

Not according to your link:

"The former interrogators say they did not use physical torture..."

There is losing, and then there are things that are a lot worse.

You are in the 'lot worse' territory.

Torture doesn't have to be physical, according to the Geneva Convention. U.S. interrogators used fear, intimidation, food and water deprivation and sleep deprivation to coerce prisoners to talk. All those things are considered torture.

One of my favs was they would dress an American up as a Russian officer and tell the prisoner he could talk, or he was going to be handed over to the Russians. Those ****ers couldn't stop talking after they were faced with that option...lol

PO Box 1142 was a violation of the GC, by it's very existance. But, it helped win the war. The United States had several black sites during WW2.

 

[Aristaeus]

You're mistaken.

When you find yourself putting fairy tail morals and the physical and mental comfort of a terrorist ahead of the safety of your own country and your countrymen, you need to seriously ask yourself whose side you're really on.

The rest of the western world made torture illegal in the 17th and 18th centuries. I guess that makes your views on torture medieval. How apt.

I'll leave you with the words of Napoleon from 1798:

"The barbarous custom of whipping men suspected of having important secrets to reveal must be abolished. It has always been recognized that this method of interrogation, by putting men to the torture, is useless. The wretches say whatever comes into their heads and whatever they think one wants to believe. Consequently, the Commander-in-Chief forbids the use of a method which is contrary to reason and humanity."

 

[MSgt]

It makes perfect sense. With 9/11 happening seventeen years ago and no such attacks since, our brave and courageous CIA agents must start waterboarding and bludgeoning these constant offenders to our soil while strapped helplessly to chairs. Cuz...we're apparently great again. Had they done their job at all and investigated all the angles that they are on official record for choosing not to see, 9/11 would not have happened. Hey, CIA, instead of beating the deranged horse after it gets into the barn, close the goddamn door.

Cheney, and especially Rumsfeld, are the two responsible most for how badly the Iraq invasion/occupation was executed. There is a reason they were hated by military generals. I would toss Bush into this as the actual President, but let's face it, he was like a lost kid in search of guidance from his parents. He made the right decision about Iraq on accident and with the worst guidance imaginable. And "enhanced interrogation" came from their minds.

 

[apdst]

The rest of the western world made torture illegal in the 17th and 18th centuries. I guess that makes your views on torture medieval. How apt.

I'll leave you with the words of Napoleon from 1798:

"The barbarous custom of whipping men suspected of having important secrets to reveal must be abolished. It has always been recognized that this method of interrogation, by putting men to the torture, is useless. The wretches say whatever comes into their heads and whatever they think one wants to believe. Consequently, the Commander-in-Chief forbids the use of a method which is contrary to reason and humanity."

Yeah, ok...lol

https://amp.theguardian.com/uk-news...rture-northern-ireland-court-rules-hooded-men

The Spanish government categorically denies the existence of torture.[104]

However, the Spanish authorities consistently fail to implement recommendations by the Council of Europe's Committee for the Prevention of Torture and the UN Committee Against Torture to combat the use of torture in detention. The UN committee expressed its concern "about the length of judicial procedures and made reference to reports that indicated that five years had sometimes passed between crime and sentence. The Committee warned that this problem reduces the effect of penal action and discourages people to file complaints." It further indicated that "all members of the Committee were also deeply concerned about the legal practice of five days incommunicado detention" (since October 2003, a reform of the Criminal Procedure Code has extended that period to a maximum of 13 days)

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Use_of_torture_since_1948

Algeria torture: French general Paul Aussaresses dies - BBC News

 

[Aristaeus]

Yeah, ok...lol

https://amp.theguardian.com/uk-news...rture-northern-ireland-court-rules-hooded-men



Algeria torture: French general Paul Aussaresses dies - BBC News

Governments and the military sometimes break laws. Does not refute my point that most western countries outlawed torture hundreds of years ago.

What torture methods do you like the most? Thumbscrews? The rack? Slow cutting? pulling teeth out with red-hot pliers? electrodes? Turkas?

 

[apdst]

Governments and the military sometimes break laws. Does not refute my point that most western countries outlawed torture hundreds of years ago.

What torture methods do you like the most? Thumbscrews? The rack? Slow cutting? pulling teeth out with red-hot pliers? electrodes? Turkas?

Actually, I not only proved that they only recently got nitpicky sbout torture, but have used torture well into the 21st Century.

I think comfort deprivation (food, water, sleep, climate control) and fear and intimidation are far more effective than buchery.

 

[j-mac]

You need a point.

No, I need an answer...it was a question.

 

[Aristaeus]

Actually, I not only proved that they only recently got nitpicky sbout torture, but have used torture well into the 21st Century.

I think comfort deprivation (food, water, sleep, climate control) and fear and intimidation are far more effective than buchery.

Your first link about Spain said nothing about them using torture, just a concern about the length of time between arrest and trial.

Torture was made illegal in Spain in 1808, and in France in 1789.

No butchery, huh? Perhaps you would enjoy holding their feet above a fire. No physical contact involved with that one. Nice and painful. You could even force the prisoner's family to watch - that would provide extra incentive for the prisoner to talk. You could even threaten to rape his wife & daughter in front of him. I don't think that counts as butchery, so you might like that as well.

 

[apdst]

Your first link about Spain said nothing about them using torture, just a concern about the length of time between arrest and trial.

Torture was made illegal in Spain in 1808, and in France in 1789.

No butchery, huh? Perhaps you would enjoy holding their feet above a fire. No physical contact involved with that one. Nice and painful. You could even force the prisoner's family to watch - that would provide extra incentive for the prisoner to talk. You could even threaten to rape his wife & daughter in front of him. I don't think that counts as butchery, so you might like that as well.

But it does say Spain isn't onboard with conventions to prevent torture:

However, the Spanish authorities consistently fail to implement recommendations by the Council of Europe's Committee for the Prevention of Torture and the UN Committee Against Torture to combat the use of torture in detention.

 

[Aristaeus]

But it does say Spain isn't onboard with conventions to prevent torture:

That doesn't mean they use torture or aren't opposed to torture. It's more likely that they feel they already implement those practices under current national law or practice.

You still support torturing people. Nothing you say changes that horrific point. What's the name of that torture where they strap you in a hollowed out log and covered in honey, vomit, and feces, and you're slowly eaten alive by insects and maggots? I bet that's right up your street. Probably makes you a little bit excited 'down below'?

The iron maiden? A bit clichéd perhaps, but always a torture classic.

 

[tres borrachos]

https://apnews.com/b01b7b389dfb47cdafae4eb341ee0f5c

WASHINGTON (AP) — Former Vice President Dick Cheney said the U.S. should restart the harsh detention and interrogation practices used on terror suspects after 9/11, and called on the Senate to confirm CIA nominee Gina Haspel.

Brutal interrogation practices are currently banned under U.S. law, but debate on the issue has re-surfaced during Haspel’s confirmation process because she was once involved in the CIA’s interrogation program.
==========================================
Good old Dick Cheney wants to bring back water boarding & worse.

That guy that he shot in the face apologized for getting in the way but Cheney still wants his birdshot back.

This thread is sad in so many ways. Not your OP, but the blood thirst from so many DP posters - "Yay, torture is awesome! Let's torture all evil people!". How freaking scary those comments are. Torture is bad, which is why this country never did it. Dating back to our Founding Fathers, we didn't do it. Now we have crazy people wetting their pants in excitement about the idea of doing it.

Roman emperors adored torture. They used it widely and against everyone who they deemed "evil". And looked how well it worked, because they are still the most powerful people in the world, and their empire didn't collapse. Um....

I liked Vice President Cheney then and I still respect him, but not for these comments. He is flat out wrong in what he said.

 

[apdst]

That doesn't mean they use torture or aren't opposed to torture. It's more likely that they feel they already implement those practices under current national law or practice.

You still support torturing people. Nothing you say changes that horrific point. What's the name of that torture where they strap you in a hollowed out log and covered in honey, vomit, and feces, and you're slowly eaten alive by insects and maggots? I bet that's right up your street. Probably makes you a little bit excited 'down below'?

There's evidence that refutes your claim.

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/wor...anctioned-for-torture-were-promoted-1.3036718

In September, the High Court dropped the request for the extradition from Switzerland of Nekane Txapartegi. The term for enforcing a December 2009 conviction against her had expired. In April, the Special Rapporteur on torture had urged the Swiss authorities to oppose the extradition. Nekane Txapartegi said she was subjected to torture and other ill-treatment when she was held incommunicado for five days in a police station in Madrid in 1999. She had been arrested on suspicion of terrorism-related offences and of being an ETA member. Investigations into her torture allegations had not been conducted thoroughly in the past.

https://www.amnesty.org/en/countries/europe-and-central-asia/spain/report-spain/

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/europe/un-says-spain-tortured-eta-terrorists-565914.html

BTW, maggots want eat you alive...lol

 

[late]

Torture doesn't have to be physical, according to the Geneva Convention. U.S. interrogators used fear, intimidation, food and water deprivation and sleep deprivation to coerce prisoners to talk. All those things are considered torture.

One of my favs was they would dress an American up as a Russian officer and tell the prisoner he could talk, or he was going to be handed over to the Russians. Those ****ers couldn't stop talking after they were faced with that option...lol

PO Box 1142 was a violation of the GC, by it's very existance. But, it helped win the war. The United States had several black sites during WW2.

That doesn't refute anything I said.

My parents, and grandparents, lived through WW2. What they almost never talked about was the first year of the war. We got the crap kicked out of us. Germany was a technologically supreme juggernaut, it looked unstoppable. They were terrified. Right up to V-E day, everyone worried that Germany would pull some unstoppable weapon out that would crush us.

So we cut some corners.

But what came out of that was the realisation that the most successful interrogators developed a relationship with their subjects.

The other guy was right, perhaps more than he knows. The Right has gone medieval, and not just about torture.

 

[late]

There's evidence that refutes your claim.

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/wor...anctioned-for-torture-were-promoted-1.3036718



https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/europe/un-says-spain-tortured-eta-terrorists-565914.html

BTW, maggots want eat you alive...

Nope.

That was the Guardia Civil. You've never been to Spain. Spain has come a long way, but there are still some little bits of their fascist past kicking around. Exception proves the rule, in this case.

Maggots only eat dead flesh. They are actually quite useful to keep certain types of wounds from necrotising.

 

[Hatuey]

Quoting The Sermon on The Mount and a religious slur in the same post. That's perfect.

While we're invoking the Bible, let's remember what else The Lord said:

Ecclesiastes 3:1-8

3 For everything there is a season, and a time for every purpose under heaven: 2 a time to be born, and a time to die; a time to plant, and a time to pluck up that which is planted; 3 a time to kill, and a time to heal; a time to break down, and a time to build up; 4 a time to weep, and a time to laugh; a time to mourn, and a time to dance; 5 a time to cast away stones, and a time to gather stones together; a time to embrace, and a time to refrain from embracing; 6 a time to seek, and a time to lose; a time to keep, and a time to cast away; 7 a time to rend, and a time to sew; a time to keep silence, and a time to speak; 8 a time to love, and a time to hate; a time for war, and a time for peace.

If only I could be like your Jesus and give you enough bs passages for you to not be in favor of torture.

You do realize Jesus was tortured, don't you?

Lol.

Sent from a memo written by Nunes and edited by Trump.

 

[leekohler2]

If only I could be like your Jesus and give you enough bs passages for you to not be in favor of torture.

You do realize Jesus was tortured, don't you?

Lol.

Sent from a memo written by Nunes and edited by Trump.

Did he really just use the Bible as a justification for torture? Wow...