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Build Roads, Save the World

Jack Hays

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Build roads, save the world. I'm intrigued. What do you think?

How to fix the world worker glut: Build more roads

"Maybe everyone is overcomplicating America's economic challenges today. Maybe there are no deep mysteries behind the slow growth, the stagnating incomes and the widespread economic anxieties that have given rise to populist movements on the left and the right.

Maybe the problem is simple: too many workers.
That is the argument made in a new paper released by the centrist Democratic think tank Third Way, which theorizes that the world economy is suffering from an oversupply of labor and too little demand for the goods and services those workers produce.
But the solution, they say, also is simple, though politically unpopular: roads and bridges, and a lot of them.
Penned by investment banker Daniel Alpert, the paper, builds on his 2013 book “The Age of Oversupply,” and it's Third Way’s latest effort to shape the liberal policy conversation in the 2016 presidential primaries. It does so in decidedly un-centrist fashion — by embracing a larger infrastructure spending program than Bernie Sanders does. . . "


 

KevinKohler

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That would, by definition, require an increase in tax revenue. Which would, most likely, need to be shouldered by those most able to do so.


Lewis Black has known this for years. "You wanna fix the ****ing economy? Get some money together, and build a big ****ing thing! Then you open the big ****ing thing restaurant, the big ****ing thing gift shop, and the big ****ing thing casino hotel and resort..."


He goes on that diatribe fro quite a while.
 

Orly?

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"You wanna fix the ****ing economy? Get some money together, and build a big ****ing WALL! Then you open the big ****ing WALL restaurant, the big ****ing WALL gift shop, and the big ****ing WALL casino hotel and resort..."
 

Jack Hays

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That would, by definition, require an increase in tax revenue. Which would, most likely, need to be shouldered by those most able to do so.

Actually, the authors say the money should be borrowed.

". . . Alpert says the government should borrow the money for infrastructure, echoing the liberal economists Larry Summers and Brad DeLong. They argued in a 2012 paper that with interest rates low and economic activity depressed in the wake of the Great Recession, government spending on infrastructure could pay for itself, in terms of new tax revenue generated by increased economic growth. . . ."
 

What if...?

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"You wanna fix the ****ing economy? Get some money together, and build a big ****ing WALL! Then you open the big ****ing WALL restaurant, the big ****ing WALL gift shop, and the big ****ing WALL casino hotel and resort..."

But nobody will go there when its covered with cobwebs because the illegals went another route.

HUGE waste of resources.
 

Jetboogieman

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"You wanna fix the ****ing economy? Get some money together, and build a big ****ing WALL! Then you open the big ****ing WALL restaurant, the big ****ing WALL gift shop, and the big ****ing WALL casino hotel and resort..."

Oh I get it now, you're a parody.

Nice.
 

gavinfielder

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"You wanna fix the ****ing economy? Get some money together, and build a big ****ing WALL! Then you open the big ****ing WALL restaurant, the big ****ing WALL gift shop, and the big ****ing WALL casino hotel and resort..."
Well, yeah, actually, that is the point. We could just build lots of walls, and keep building walls, employ everyone. Walls on every border of every state, and when we're done, we'll make them higher. Why not? China built tons of useless crap, and they're perfectly fin...well. Hm.
 

Harry Guerrilla

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Build roads, save the world. I'm intrigued. What do you think?

How to fix the world worker glut: Build more roads

"Maybe everyone is overcomplicating America's economic challenges today. Maybe there are no deep mysteries behind the slow growth, the stagnating incomes and the widespread economic anxieties that have given rise to populist movements on the left and the right.

Maybe the problem is simple: too many workers.
That is the argument made in a new paper released by the centrist Democratic think tank Third Way, which theorizes that the world economy is suffering from an oversupply of labor and too little demand for the goods and services those workers produce.
But the solution, they say, also is simple, though politically unpopular: roads and bridges, and a lot of them.
Penned by investment banker Daniel Alpert, the paper, builds on his 2013 book “The Age of Oversupply,” and it's Third Way’s latest effort to shape the liberal policy conversation in the 2016 presidential primaries. It does so in decidedly un-centrist fashion — by embracing a larger infrastructure spending program than Bernie Sanders does. . . "



Well depending on how it's done, it can be really, really stupid or good.
We don't want a bunch of roads to nowhere, that are and will be completely un/under utilized.
 

Jack Hays

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I disagree.
Destroying the environment to build roads that people may use is not a smart plan.
Better to improve existing roads, build roads that are needed and to spend on getting roads that aren't needed/used.

Any road is a needed road.
 

laska

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Infrastructure is important but if you overspend on it where it is unneeded then you are just racing faster towards national bankruptcy and widespread poverty. Build a 1 billion dollar bridge in middle of nowhere that will not come close to ever being profitable in adding needed and relevant wealth creation is not too bright. It would be basically the same "smart" policy of creating a huge gravel pit and hiring everyone at $25/rh to dig in it and calling it 100% employment. Spending on infrastructure is smart if it is needed and will more than pay for itself in aiding wealth creation. And the lower it costs, and the lower amount of labor to create it, the better. This frees up labor to create other wealth.
 

Harry Guerrilla

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Any road is a needed road.

Doubtful.
We could always force the telecoms we give tons of money to, to actually build the infrastructure they're supposed to.

Building a bunch of roads for no other reason that to stimulate the economy, is in line with the broken window fallacy.
 

Jack Hays

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Doubtful.
We could always force the telecoms we give tons of money to, to actually build the infrastructure they're supposed to.

Building a bunch of roads for no other reason that to stimulate the economy, is in line with the broken window fallacy.

Broken window policing is not a fallacy.
 

Harry Guerrilla

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Broken window policing is not a fallacy.

Spending money just to spend it is stupid.
Sure you can borrow, spend and inflate away the interest, but it should still be for something economically beneficial.
Not just build a mess of roads to nowhere.

Spend to give everyone fiber optic, increase road capacity, increased or better green spaces, etc.
 

longview

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We have viable things we could be doing, our infrastructure is in bad need of repair.
We, (the US) seems to thrive on BIG challenges, perhaps we need some.
We could design and electrify the federal interstate system, so the next generation of vehicles could
power themselves from the grid while underway. Hybrid and battery power to get to of from the interstate.
We could plane and install 80 million solar roofs, on every home in the US, and improve the electrical grid while we are at it.
We could develop and implement much better water reclamation, and limit future droughts.
 

laska

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Building hyperloops to drastically lower cost of shipping goods would be the way to go on infrastructure. It runs on solar, can move freight and people at about the speed of sound, and it is cost effective.
 

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Infrastructure is important but if you overspend on it where it is unneeded then you are just racing faster towards national bankruptcy and widespread poverty. Build a 1 billion dollar bridge in middle of nowhere that will not come close to ever being profitable in adding needed and relevant wealth creation is not too bright. It would be basically the same "smart" policy of creating a huge gravel pit and hiring everyone at $25/rh to dig in it and calling it 100% employment. Spending on infrastructure is smart if it is needed and will more than pay for itself in aiding wealth creation. And the lower it costs, and the lower amount of labor to create it, the better. This frees up labor to create other wealth.

Every bridge is a bridge to nowhere, until you build it, then nowhere becomes somewhere.
 

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Villiage Idiot
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Infrastructure is important but if you overspend on it where it is unneeded then you are just racing faster towards national bankruptcy and widespread poverty. Build a 1 billion dollar bridge in middle of nowhere that will not come close to ever being profitable in adding needed and relevant wealth creation is not too bright. It would be basically the same "smart" policy of creating a huge gravel pit and hiring everyone at $25/rh to dig in it and calling it 100% employment. Spending on infrastructure is smart if it is needed and will more than pay for itself in aiding wealth creation. And the lower it costs, and the lower amount of labor to create it, the better. This frees up labor to create other wealth.


A government that issues money can not become bankrupt. Government infrastructure spending simply results in economic growth by employing resources that would have otherwise not been utilized. There is no cost to me if the slacker sitting on the couch gets a productive job creating something that provides value to me, but otherwise wouldn't exist if he didn't get a job building it.
 

laska

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A government that issues money can not become bankrupt. Government infrastructure spending simply results in economic growth by employing resources that would have otherwise not been utilized. There is no cost to me if the slacker sitting on the couch gets a productive job creating something that provides value to me, but otherwise wouldn't exist if he didn't get a job building it.

So you are a perpetual motion econ guy. Magic monopoly money.
 

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Villiage Idiot
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So you are a perpetual motion econ guy. Magic monopoly money.

Yup, pretty much.

There is nothing really magic about it, its just policy. dollars are issued by the government, and then spent into our economy. If the government didn't issue dollars first (out of thin air), there would be no dollars to tax. Spending HAS to happen before taxation.

Really, where do you think US Dollars come from? [FONT=arial, sans-serif] Hasbro? [/FONT]Walmart? Microsoft? China?
 

laska

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A government that issues money can not become bankrupt. Government infrastructure spending simply results in economic growth by employing resources that would have otherwise not been utilized. There is no cost to me if the slacker sitting on the couch gets a productive job creating something that provides value to me, but otherwise wouldn't exist if he didn't get a job building it.

Just because a government can print any amount of money to pay bills doesn't mean it will not suffer the same effects of being bankrupt. When they cannot legitimately pay the bills and start just printing extra money it devalues it, then no one is going to loan money to the government. Who pays for this devaluing of money, first those who save and those on fixed incomes, their money becomes devalued and eventually becomes basically worthless.
 

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Just because a government can print any amount of money to pay bills doesn't mean it will not suffer the same effects of being bankrupt. When they cannot legitimately pay the bills and start just printing extra money it devalues it, then no one is going to loan money to the government. Who pays for this devaluing of money, first those who save and those on fixed incomes, their money becomes devalued and eventually becomes basically worthless.

The devaluation of money is typically called "inflation". Inflation is caused by increasing scarcity of goods.

As long as we make sufficient goods and services, then inflation isn't an issue. Creating money in itself isn't the cause of inflation, although if we simply gave away money it would lead to inflation.

I'm not suggesting that we give away money, I'm suggesting that we use money to motivate people to produce goods and services of value.
 
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