Brain-dead woman must carry fetus to birth because of abortion ban, family says

[stealthycat]

And here it is again.
That terror and anger at women being able to enjoy sex AND have independent choice in how they live their lives.

and here it is again - you want women to be able to enjoy sex and then have the unborn baby killed because its an inconvenience to them

The anger at women righties have is absolutely staggering.

its not anger at all - stop injecting something that isn't there, its very dishonest

killing an unborn baby .... you support it, I do not

 

[ClaraD]

and here it is again - you want women to be able to enjoy sex and then have the unborn baby killed because its an inconvenience to them


its not anger at all - stop injecting something that isn't there, its very dishonest

killing an unborn baby .... you support it, I do not

How enjoyable is it to die from pregnancy complications? Men cannot die from pregnancy because they can’t get pregnant

 

[EnchantedMuggle]

and here it is again - you want women to be able to enjoy sex and then have the unborn baby killed because its an inconvenience to them

Keep up this rhetoric and ensure that a large percentage of women will have a child neither they nor the father can afford b/c they don't want to be murderers.

And yes. I do believe people should be free to enjoy sex and if something happens, end a pregnancy.

its not anger at all - stop injecting something that isn't there, its very dishonest

No it isn't. You repeat aggressive words like "killed" and get furious that the woman can enjoy sex but then not have an 18-year burden as punishment.

killing an unborn baby .... you support it, I do not

"Killing" Keep it up. Righties are ensuring far more babies that people can in no way afford, or are in no way capable of raising because they have serious issues of their own, are born. And then, oh my GOD, the fathers won't be able to just wander away.

I know. The tragedy of it all.

 

[stealthycat]

And there this is again. More "you're killing your sweet child" rightie stuff. The same stuff these pregnant women have been hearing all their lives, as we all have.

um .... .its a baby ..... how do you view babies?

You don't think that figures into how a woman "chooses"? You really think it's all about partying?

its partying, school, life ..... there are many reasons women want to have their babies killed, you're right but all of them are because the baby is an inconvenience

I mean way to go, righties have ensured that a large percentage of women WILL choose to have their child even when they can't afford it, b/c otherwise they're vile murderesses.

no no ... we've already established wealth doesn't matter when it comes to the value of unborn life. Remember ?

Sure he does. For one thing, finding a deadbeat dad and forcing him to pay is incredibly hard. MANY men literally do just walk. Others work under the table for somebody so they can claim a very low or no income.

none the less legally they cannot do that

Um...what good is spilling the tea with a sister when your child can't eat and you live in a rat and roach infested place where you hear gunshots all day b/c that's what you can afford?

so now you're back to poor babies don't deserve to live - Sanger and Nazi eugenics ?

Well there you go. They play, they pay. Both of them.

Isn't that what you want? The person who dares to enjoy sex but isn't 1000% responsible about it or the condom breaks, is punished? The woman and the man.

absolutely

the woman for 10 months to give birth and then walk away and give it for adoption
the man 18 years financially to support that baby

that's responsibility for the life they created when they engaged in sex which is what causes babies - that's how I would do it yes

 

[stealthycat]

I don’t know about rare it’s increasingly common for grandparents and single fathers to take over parenting. My so is raising his girls. We didn’t ask for child support but the court would have ordered it had we asked for it

My ex-husband did that too, and this was 30 years ago.

rare for women to lose custody - those were some messed up women

A friend of mine got custody - wife was big drug user. She remained out of the picture but give her credit - she didn't kill her babies

 

[stealthycat]

How enjoyable is it to die from pregnancy complications? Men cannot die from pregnancy because they can’t get pregnant

you're right men cannot

has nothing to do with unborn babies being killed in the womb

 

[stealthycat]

Keep up this rhetoric and ensure that a large percentage of women will have a child neither they nor the father can afford b/c they don't want to be murderers.
And yes. I do believe people should be free to enjoy sex and if something happens, end a pregnancy.

stop

you only want the WOMAN to have that choice right ? and you want the man to have NO CHOICE , right ?

No it isn't. You repeat aggressive words like "killed" and get furious that the woman can enjoy sex but then not have an 18-year burden as punishment.

what do you think ending something that is alive/living is ? its killing - that's what abortion is - its killing the unborn to stop the pregnancy

don't you know that ?

I don't care if women have sex and men too - but they are going to be consequences and if there is a baby? big consequences

"Killing" Keep it up. Righties are ensuring far more babies that people can in no way afford, or are in no way capable of raising because they have serious issues of their own, are born. And then, oh my GOD, the fathers won't be able to just wander away.
I know. The tragedy of it all.

again its the process of the abortion - it kills the living unborn ending the pregnancy

its literally what it is - why does the words disturb you ?

 

[EnchantedMuggle]

How enjoyable is it to die from pregnancy complications? Men cannot die from pregnancy because they can’t get pregnant

Nor can they break their pelvis, like I did. Not the actual bone. The cartilege that makes a seam connecting the two front bones. Torn entirely clean down. I couldn't walk for a month and strapped my little guy to my chest in a carrier so I could use a walker and shuffle my feet forward. They wouldn't actually lift off the ground initially because of the nerve damage and instability so I shuffled ice skater-style, not lifting either foot.

After that I had to teach my body to walk again. It was a long process. BTW, I was back at work at this time using canes, b/c the US in no way guarantees anything more than 6 weeks maternity leave and some offices don't even offer that.

I had to sleep sitting up for a couple of months because my body physicially would not stretch out to lie down, it was odd. Because of the instability my hip also dislocated out of the socket and would pop in and out, pitching me forward even holding onto canes.

I can walk today but I've never been out of pain since. Now do I think my guy was worth it? 100%! He has special needs, indeed the exceeding large circumference of his head has been theorized to be a part of whatever caused his special needs (but genetic testing didn't reveal any one specific gene or set of genes). I love him to death. He was worth it, to me.

But pregnancy and childbirth are NOT without their dangers. A woman risks a whole host of bizarre things happening when she keeps a pregnancy. The woman has to be willing to potentially be physically affected for a lifetime (or for me, 22 years so far and counting) because it *can* come to that. Just like a woman and man risk the smaller chance of a condom breaking. Things can happen even if you think you won't be the one with the bizarre story. I literally never envisioned this happening even though I had DSP (an overextension of ligaments and constant pain) in my last 2 months of pregnancy.

Pregnancy is no freakin' walk in the park, I'll say that much.

Now, where's the "equal choice" in that...why doesn't the man also have to have his pelvis torn and earn a lifetime of pain...and blah...blah...blaaaaaah...no fair no fair. (Just giving a righty-style answer, LOL) It is the woman who assumes the physical risk, period. That's life.

 

[EnchantedMuggle]

stop

you only want the WOMAN to have that choice right ? and you want the man to have NO CHOICE , right ?

Biology gives him that choice at a specific time. Remember how righties are so big on biology being biology and that's that? The man has the choice to not have sex or to use adequate birth control. That's his biological window.

They both have choices.

what do you think ending something that is alive/living is ? its killing - that's what abortion is - its killing the unborn to stop the pregnancy

There you go, a huge reason so many women give birth instead of aborting. But that's a willy-nilly "choice"? The threat of going to hell is real for many people in the U.S.

don't you know that ?

I don't care if women have sex and men too - but they are going to be consequences and if there is a baby? big consequences

Yes you do, because you're furious that a man doesn't have "a choice" all the way through, as if men and women are biologically the same. Are they? I thought righties have been arguing over and over again that they're not.

I think you're going to need to take this particular complaint up with God.

again its the process of the abortion - it kills the living unborn ending the pregnancy

its literally what it is - why does the words disturb you ?

It doesn't disturb me. But it does disturb many, many women who will feel forced into keeping their baby or else go to hell after living a lifetime of thinking of themselves as murderesses. That's just a fact.

 

[stealthycat]

Biology gives him that choice at a specific time. Remember how righties are so big on biology being biology and that's that? The man has the choice to not have sex or to use adequate birth control. That's his biological window.
They both have choices.

100% agree - they can both choose not to have sex

There you go, a huge reason so many women give birth instead of aborting. But that's a willy-nilly "choice"? The threat of going to hell is real for many people in the U.S.

I don't know what any of that means

Yes you do, because you're furious that a man doesn't have "a choice" all the way through, as if men and women are biologically the same. Are they? I thought righties have been arguing over and over again that they're not.

#1 I think both men and women should be 100% responsible - I've made that very clear if you'll read
#2 NOT the same - no way, very different. Women are incredible in ways men never will be absolutely.

its hypocritical for anyone to want women to have a choice to 100% walk away from a pregnancy they didn't want by having the unborn killed but not want the man to be able to 100% walk away as well

I think you're going to need to take this particular complaint up with God.

which God? who's God ?

It doesn't disturb me. But it does disturb many, many women who will feel forced into keeping their baby or else go to hell after living a lifetime of thinking of themselves as murderesses. That's just a fact.

if they feel disturbed by having their unborn babies killed - well they SHOULD feel disturbed. Its a horrible act, killing innocent human life isn't it ?

if you had someone kill someone for you .. wouldn't you feel remorse ?


my daughter had her baby killed by abortion. few months later her boyfriend was murdered. she lives with the knowledge that the only thing she has left of him she had killed and nothing of him can ever be again. She could have had a beautiful baby ... and she's haunted by it

that's real - that's reality

 

[stealthycat]

Nor can they break their pelvis, like I did. Not the actual bone. The cartilege that makes a seam connecting the two front bones. Torn entirely clean down. I couldn't walk for a month and strapped my little guy to my chest in a carrier so I could use a walker and shuffle my feet forward. They wouldn't actually lift off the ground initially because of the nerve damage and instability so I shuffled ice skater-style, not lifting either foot.

After that I had to teach my body to walk again. It was a long process. BTW, I was back at work at this time using canes, b/c the US in no way guarantees anything more than 6 weeks maternity leave and some offices don't even offer that.

I had to sleep sitting up for a couple of months because my body physicially would not stretch out to lie down, it was odd. Because of the instability my hip also dislocated out of the socket and would pop in and out, pitching me forward even holding onto canes.

I can walk today but I've never been out of pain since. Now do I think my guy was worth it? 100%! He has special needs, indeed the exceeding large circumference of his head has been theorized to be a part of whatever caused his special needs (but genetic testing didn't reveal any one specific gene or set of genes). I love him to death. He was worth it, to me.

But pregnancy and childbirth are NOT without their dangers. A woman risks a whole host of bizarre things happening when she keeps a pregnancy. The woman has to be willing to potentially be physically affected for a lifetime (or for me, 22 years so far and counting) because it *can* come to that. Just like a woman and man risk the smaller chance of a condom breaking. Things can happen even if you think you won't be the one with the bizarre story. I literally never envisioned this happening even though I had DSP (an overextension of ligaments and constant pain) in my last 2 months of pregnancy.

Pregnancy is no freakin' walk in the park, I'll say that much.

Now, where's the "equal choice" in that...why doesn't the man also have to have his pelvis torn and earn a lifetime of pain...and blah...blah...blaaaaaah...no fair no fair. (Just giving a righty-style answer, LOL) It is the woman who assumes the physical risk, period. That's life.

a personal question if I may ........... you'd do it all again too for him wouldn't you ?

 

[EnchantedMuggle]

100% agree - they can both choose not to have sex


I don't know what any of that means



#1 I think both men and women should be 100% responsible - I've made that very clear if you'll read
#2 NOT the same - no way, very different. Women are incredible in ways men never will be absolutely.

its hypocritical for anyone to want women to have a choice to 100% walk away from a pregnancy they didn't want by having the unborn killed but not want the man to be able to 100% walk away as well



which God? who's God ?




if they feel disturbed by having their unborn babies killed - well they SHOULD feel disturbed. Its a horrible act, killing innocent human life isn't it ?

And there you go. Because of this, you think it's some easy "choice" for all pregnant women. Some women feel they have no choice at all. So they have the baby but then it's a cruel cruel world b/c the father has to pay money, like she does, each to their capabilities? Say what?

if you had someone kill someone for you .. wouldn't you feel remorse ?

I don't know. You tell me. Have you ever met the man who had the woman "kill" someone b/c he didn't feel like dealing with a kid, who feels remorse?

my daughter had her baby killed by abortion. few months later her boyfriend was murdered. she lives with the knowledge that the only thing she has left of him she had killed and nothing of him can ever be again.

Um therefore every woman should choose to give birth? Just in case their boyfriend is murdered?

BTW, I am so very, very sorry and sad for your daughter. She made a tough choice and then she lost her love.

But...was he by any chance a factor in her decision to abort? Did he threaten to not help support the baby if she had it? Did he talk to her and say they just weren't ready?

Does the man bear any responsibility in the woman's "choice" at all when it comes to abortion? What do you think?

Yet he's not the "murderer," he gets to talk his woman into getting an abortion and then he walks away, apparently not a murderer.

Life isn't fair, eh?

She could have had a beautiful baby ... and she's haunted by it

Or like 40% of women she could have had a miscarriage. She'll never know.

that's real - that's reality

a personal question if I may ........... you'd do it all again too for him wouldn't you ?

I would and did! We had a second son. However, I chose a C-section for him as I was at a very high risk of this happening again. And his size was constantly monitored b/c damage could have been done to me while he was still in utero if he got too big.

But he was my little peanut, my tiniest of three babies, 7 lbs. 14 oz. OMG what a cutie and to this day my sons are wonderful people.

I would choose it again but would every woman? Should every woman? Why? I had an ideal situation. I was married, we both had great jobs, we were (and are) in love, nobody was a junkie.

I had a choice, why do rightiess think "choice" automatically means abortion? It doesn't.

My ultra-conservative friend had an abortion at age 20, got married later and chose to have three children.

Choice.

 

[EnchantedMuggle]

Adrianna's funeral is this Friday.

 

[Gordy327]

LOL classic

you can't even say if a 1 day old baby's life has value

why ? I know why, you know why ... you just won't admit it

You can't even explain what this value is. As expected!

you and other I caught in hypocrisy and you see it .... but you don't care, isn't that the truth ?

you and other pro-abortion people want the woman to have every choice in the world - kill the baby or keep it or give it for adoption but you ALSO want the man to have no choices and if someone killed the unborn other than the woman's choice of "doctors" its a crime and needs punished

hypocritical to the extreme don't you think ?

Explain what choice a man has regarding a woman's pregnancy and autonomy!

answer - f if I know ... every man is different

you can keep asking a what if and I keep answering it and you don't like it ... I mean I don't know what to say. She chose sex, he doesn't have to know anything about her mind and decisions making process nor her his ... they chose sex than can lead to a baby being made

I've repeated over and over they're both responsible


or, just tell me what answer you're trying to get me to say ??? and then go back and answer mine please

I keep asking what the value is and thats 1 question you never answer. Classic indeed.

 

[Gordy327]

and here it is again - you want women to be able to enjoy sex and then have the unborn baby killed because its an inconvenience to them

I'll bet the man enjoys the sex too. Whats wrong with enjoying sex? There's nothing wrong with it.

killing an unborn baby .... you support it, I do not

You're free to not do it then. Just as others are free to so if they choose.

 

[Cope]

Same complaint, repeated, altho the resentment of women seems to be leaking out. What 'power?' Over their own bodies and the consent to what happens to them? Dont men want and expect that?

Choice of course.

And since that law protects children and taxpayers...what would the legal grounds be to change it? Please explain. Again, it's not just laws, it's a recognition of a statutory right for every child.

You need no legal ground to write different laws, but it could highlight the unfairness of 2 v 1 choices.

Not at all, dont hide from it. You admit you want the change, a denial of services to create a behavior YOU want in those women. Do you need a dictionary?

I certainly WANT change. I can't force it on anyone though, not even when it is their best interest. But as with most things in life, it is a balancing act of conflicting rights, no matter how you or others want to make it all about only the woman.

Your reasons are clear, why do you need to reiterate them?...your demand for denying single mothers who refuse to have abortions now needs to have a realistic foundation under it. Where is it?

Well, because that's what the debate/discussion is about. It certainly isn't about implementation, no matter how many times you ask HOW.

Just more of you avoiding your desire to punish single mothers who refused to have abortions. That's all it is unless you can show it's realistic and not just resentment and misogyny

If you say so. I'll just let you wallow in that ignorance, and self-assuredness while being wrong about me and my motivations.

So many words to express your resentment that you imagine women have some power over men.

--did the woman force him to have sex with her? no​

--did he know that she has the choice re: abortion? yes​

--did he still choose to risk having sex with her?​

If yes, then why are you claiming that women have power over men? Can men not control themselves and act in their own best interests? (Of course they can. So then why dont they?)

There is NO doubt that in the case of abortion, women get a second choice. THAT choice also happens to CHOOSE for the man.

Your replies, and the requirement to answer them all in pieces is getting lengthy and time consuming for someone who doesn't want, nor will she ever get it, or even attempt to see a different perspective.

So with that, I bid you adios!

 

[Cope]

Why is this about "power" to you?

What if the woman doesn't want to have an abortion because righties have been screaming for a hundred years or so that a woman who aborts is a murderess who will go to hell and a woman who will "kill her child" is unnatural?

We are all, regardless of our actual beliefs, saturated in this constant onslaught of "don't kill your innocent precious baby!" from the time WE'RE born. Nobody in the western world has escaped it.



What you're saying is you're pro-choice. But you're arguing with other pro-choicers.

What about Chance, the subject of this thread? Are you saying you feel life support should have been removed early in the pregnancy? Or are you saying it shouldn't have? Is life precious or isn't it? I'm not quite getting your stance.



Biology is biology...isn't that what righties are always saying? The woman doesn't have the "power" to choose...she has the REQUIREMENT to choose. B/c the pregnancy isn't just going away.

Tell me. What is a woman? What is a man?

Righties have been asking lefties that for a few years now. Yet when it comes to *actual* biology -- a pregnancy -- righties are furious that women have "the power" to choose. (???)

She *has* to choose.

But come to that, why are you angry that a woman might have some sort of "power"? Why do righties constantly want to punish women? Why are they so afraid of women having any "power" at all?

See post #1541

Most it the post is irrelevant to any argument or conversation I want to have, but if I didn't answer something pertaining to those things. Please condense and I'll attempt.

 

[Lursa]

There is NO doubt that in the case of abortion, women get a second choice.

Nope:

Woman: BEFORE sex: choose to have sex and accept consequences if there's a pregnancy.

Man: BEFORE sex: choose to have sex and accept consequences if there's a pregnancy.

Exactly the same number.

The differences are in the consequences themselves...which are biologically determined and let's face it...dying or miscarrying arent even "choices."

THAT choice also happens to CHOOSE for the man.

So with that, I bid you adios!

You avoided answering the questions. Please answer mine before repeating your previous claims. Or are you just going to run away after I've proven you're wrong?

So many words to express your resentment that you imagine women have some power over men. ​

​

--did the woman force him to have sex with her? no​

--did he know that she has the choice re: abortion? yes​

--did he still choose to risk having sex with her?​

​

If yes, then why are you claiming that women have power over men? Can men not control themselves and act in their own best interests? (Of course they can. So then why dont they?)​

​

All you do is complain about single mothers that refuse to abort and want to deny them public assistance you have to pay for. So then this seems incredibly hypocritical (in bold, again): You are ok with you paying for men who chose to risk having sex and then deciding they want to bail on child support when their gamble doesnt pay off? So then taxpayers have to pay for his choice? "She" already is if she's the custodial parent.​

 

[ClaraD]

rare for women to lose custody - those were some messed up women

A friend of mine got custody - wife was big drug user. She remained out of the picture but give her credit - she didn't kill her babies

Its not actually rare anymore.

 

[Lursa]

Choice of course.

And they have it...so then why shouldnt women?

You need no legal ground to write different laws,

The new law still needs to be "legal." Let's see it. You are aware of basic civics, the Const, equal treatment, discrimination, etc, right?

So? Let's see that foundation?

but it could highlight the unfairness of 2 v 1 choices.

?? What does this mean?

I certainly WANT change. I can't force it on anyone though, not even when it is their best interest. But as with most things in life, it is a balancing act of conflicting rights, no matter how you or others want to make it all about only the woman.

Men know this, right? So then why are you making it about women? It wouldnt be anything about the women if the men chose not to take the risk...right? Yes or no?

Why do men knowingly choose to hand their reproductive status over to women?

Well, because that's what the debate/discussion is about. It certainly isn't about implementation, no matter how many times you ask HOW.

So then it is just about you complaining about it?

If you say so. I'll just let you wallow in that ignorance, and self-assuredness while being wrong about me and my motivations.

Your words are very clear. You want to deny single women public assistance if they dont choose abortion. But ONLY single women. Not families, not single men, not widowers, not married couples, not divorced men. What about widows and divorced women? Do they get public assistance?

 

[Lursa]

you and other I caught in hypocrisy and you see it .... but you don't care, isn't that the truth ?

you and other pro-abortion people want the woman to have every choice in the world - kill the baby or keep it or give it for adoption but you ALSO want the man to have no choices and if someone killed the unborn other than the woman's choice of "doctors" its a crime and needs punished

hypocritical to the extreme don't you think ?

Where's the hypocrisy? For both men and women, they need to decide BEFORE they have sex if they dont want to risk the consequences of a pregnancy. Equal. The consequences differ because of biology. She cannot escape them. Fact. He may.

RE: hypocrisy...explain this:

--did the woman force him to have sex with her? no​

--did he know that she has the choice re: abortion? yes​

--did he still choose to risk having sex with her?​

If yes, then why do they claim that women have power over men? Can men not control themselves and act in their own best interests? (Of course they can. So then why dont they?) Why shouldnt men face the consequences of their decision?

Men knowingly choose to hand their reproductive status over to women. So stop complaining about the system and acting as if it's all women's fault. Or crying that "it's so unfair!" Obviously it's not. Can men control their decisions or not?

 

[EnchantedMuggle]

See post #1541

Most it the post is irrelevant to any argument or conversation I want to have, but if I didn't answer something pertaining to those things. Please condense and I'll attempt.

Please be brave enough to answer the post and I'll respond.

 

[jaeger19]

were they unborn and dead ? unborn and not alive? a pregnancy doesn't work that way

A fertilized egg is a collection of living cells

different stage of development you're right - hard to see a newborn baby and see it the same as a 85 year old man isn't it? but they really are, just different stages of life

But those different stages matter.
Taking birth control which kills a fertilized egg is not the same as hitting an 84 year old over the head with a hammer.

ahhh so your argument is that how a life impacts "previous and any future children" dictates its value ?

No. You are tge one that makes the “ value of life claim” though you can’t explain it nor define it objectively.

I don’t use “ value of life “ in the decision making. There are many lives involved.

a first child in a rich family would have fare more right to life/value than a 6th child in a poor family ? that's your argument ???

No. There are too many variables to know.
The rich family may be in the middle of divorce and tge father may be taking off with another woman. Which leaves the woman with a baby and no resources
Maybe the rich woman is pregnant in the midst of addiction to drugs and or alcohol and
The rich woman has a physical difficulty that makes her pregnancy dangerous and can kill her. Or maybe the issue with the embryo is that it could make her sterile so she can’t have any future children.

 

[stealthycat]

And there you go. Because of this, you think it's some easy "choice" for all pregnant women. Some women feel they have no choice at all. So they have the baby but then it's a cruel cruel world b/c the father has to pay money, like she does, each to their capabilities? Say what?

having money doesn't make life less valuable and there is no woman who doesn't know she can give the baby up for adoption in the USA

I don't know. You tell me. Have you ever met the man who had the woman "kill" someone b/c he didn't feel like dealing with a kid, who feels remorse?

I think you know - there would be remorse. A person cannot outrun the things they've done unless they're serial killer-ish

Um therefore every woman should choose to give birth? Just in case their boyfriend is murdered?
BTW, I am so very, very sorry and sad for your daughter. She made a tough choice and then she lost her love.
But...was he by any chance a factor in her decision to abort? Did he threaten to not help support the baby if she had it? Did he talk to her and say they just weren't ready?

so those things would have made the baby less valuable than a baby from a wealthy family who wanted it? back to the "kill those poor babies" Sanger/Nazi thing again ?

Does the man bear any responsibility in the woman's "choice" at all when it comes to abortion? What do you think?

Now THAT is a solid question. No. Neither the mom, the father nor both should decide to have an unborn baby killed. No

Or like 40% of women she could have had a miscarriage. She'll never know.

true - the baby could have died naturally and pregnancy ended. We'll never know, she had it killed instead

I would and did! We had a second son. However, I chose a C-section for him as I was at a very high risk of this happening again. And his size was constantly monitored b/c damage could have been done to me while he was still in utero if he got too big.
But he was my little peanut, my tiniest of three babies, 7 lbs. 14 oz. OMG what a cutie and to this day my sons are wonderful people.

thank you for giving them life

I would choose it again but would every woman? Should every woman? Why? I had an ideal situation. I was married, we both had great jobs, we were (and are) in love, nobody was a junkie.

again ... you are wanting to assign importance/value of life differently to each baby in the womb because of their mothers situation/wealth ??

I had a choice, why do rightiess think "choice" automatically means abortion? It doesn't.

it doesn't - and never should abortion be allowed (though to ban 98% of abortions I would make concessions, some pro-life people would not)

My ultra-conservative friend had an abortion at age 20, got married later and chose to have three children.
Choice.

she had 4 children

one she had killed, the other two she gave life

I'm very sorry for her to carry that now

 

[stealthycat]

You can't even explain what this value is. As expected!

Explain what choice a man has regarding a woman's pregnancy and autonomy!

I keep asking what the value is and thats 1 question you never answer. Classic indeed.

you need to really really answer that yourself Gordy ... you don't believe human life has any value and I'm sorry for you on that. I can't help you, I'm sorry