Brain-dead woman must carry fetus to birth because of abortion ban, family says

[ClaraD]

ask them - its not my argument and don't try and wrap me up in it


I'm using biology 101 a normal pregnancy HAS to have a living unborn and a living mother

that's fact

is a 1 day old baby is deserving of life, then 1 day before is as well - its the same living human isn't it ? there truly is no difference is there ?

A 1 day old baby is viable. A 9 week pregnancy is not

 

[stealthycat]

The mother was brain dead

true

and the fetus only 9 weeks gestation.

10 or 11 weeks I think yes

They should be allowed to disconnect her from artificial life.

then you'd have been killing Chance

If you think they should try to save a 9 week embryo then create the tech that allows it independently from the DEAD mother.

she wasn't dead - stop repeating that liberal media lie. If she was dead, the baby would have died too

do you not understand what's alive and living and what isn't ? serious question

 

[stealthycat]

A 1 day old baby is viable. A 9 week pregnancy is not

viability doesn't define a living human being

every time someone gets put on a ventilator .... are they dead and no longer alive ?

 

[ClaraD]

viability doesn't define a living human being

every time someone gets put on a ventilator .... are they dead and no longer alive ?

Actually, it does. If a 9 week gestation cannot survive outside the womb, it cannot survive. A 1 day born baby can survive outside the womb.
Are you one of those that thinks a miscarriage can be stopped?

 

[Gordy327]

killing human life should be up to the family? this family never requested she be taken off machines and later her baby boy was delivered, the family got a grandson, a son, a nephew, a 1st cousin .... wonderful isn't it ?

Ideally its up to the individual in question to make that determination for themselves, such as through advanced directives and such. Barring that, the decision belongs to the legal next of kin.

what relevancy is "negative outcomes" ?

Very relevant, especially to the family.

did she have a medical power of attorney set up ?

If not, the legal next of kin makes the decisions.

stop that liberal left lie please - she wasn't dead. If she was, the baby would have died too. YOU KNOW THIS ... why continue to spread the lie ?

Yes, she was dead. Brain death is equivalent to biological death in medicine and the law.

viability doesn't define a living human being

every time someone gets put on a ventilator .... are they dead and no longer alive ?

Viability defines when a fetus is capable of survival outside the womb. "Human being" is irrelevant.

 

[stealthycat]

Actually, it does. If a 9 week gestation cannot survive outside the womb, it cannot survive. A 1 day born baby can survive outside the womb.
Are you one of those that thinks a miscarriage can be stopped?

so a person on a ventilator (not viable) is a dead person, that's what you're saying ? of course it isn't, you know it, I know it

Viability doesn't fully define "living life" because it is just one characteristic among many that distinguish living organisms from non-living things. Viability means the ability to survive, grow, and develop

Biology 101

The above is why doctors can operate on unborn babies in the womb - they're not "dead" they are very much living human beings. Surely you can see that



I don't know what you are asking on miscarriages, which is an unborn living human dying in the womb and the pregnancy ending.

 

[stealthycat]

I never cease to be amazed at the same handful of “men” constantly whining and complaining about child support.

It really is quite pathetic.

our money our choices right? if a man didn't want the baby why should be be shackled with the responsibility? it'll impact his career/college/job choices, it'll get in the way of game night, golfing and partying, it'll get in the way of his current GF's and maybe he has other kids and that financial drains will really impact them. He should have a choice right ??

 

[ClaraD]

viability doesn't define a living human being

every time someone gets put on a ventilator .... are they dead and no longer alive ?

You can’t put a 9 week embryo on a ventilator. Also, Smith was on more than a ventilator. She was brain dead which means machines had to operate all of her organs

 

[ClaraD]

so a person on a ventilator (not viable) is a dead person, that's what you're saying ? of course it isn't, you know it, I know it

Viability doesn't fully define "living life" because it is just one characteristic among many that distinguish living organisms from non-living things. Viability means the ability to survive, grow, and develop

Biology 101

The above is why doctors can operate on unborn babies in the womb - they're not "dead" they are very much living human beings. Surely you can see that



I don't know what you are asking on miscarriages, which is an unborn living human dying in the womb and the pregnancy ending.

You do realize she was brain dead…not just on a ventilator.

 

[stealthycat]

So then you do in fact believe the mother's life has more value than the fetus's life.

can you point to the post that said that ???

 

[Lursa]

pro-abortion talks choice and after the pregnancy the woman should have the ability to choose to walk away from the pregnancy by having the unborn killed

It would be nice if she could walk away from a pregnancy consequence-free, but she cant...dont lie. You know this.

She cannot escape her consequences, remember? These are the only outcomes and some arent even "choices."

--have a kid
--have a miscarriage
--have an abortion
--die during pregnancy/childbirth

Too bad that you dont get to decide for women eh?, decisions that change their entire lives, their bodies, can cost their health and even their lives, eh? I'm thankful that you cant and I'm sure all the other women are too.

yet at the same time they want the man to have zero choices at all. If the man doesn't want the baby at all, why can't he choose to never financially support it? His money, his life, his choice right? its a big burden to financially be shackled like that and the impacts on a man's life.

I've asked you this already...did the man know she has that decision before he decided to sleep with her? Yes. Then why is HIS OWN DECISION her fault? Please explain?

I think BOTH need to be held to the consequences of their choices/actions. Most pro-abortion people don't, they want women freedom to choose and men have no choice at all

She is so then of course, so should he.

 

[stealthycat]

You can’t put a 9 week embryo on a ventilator.

true

Also, Smith was on more than a ventilator. She was brain dead which means machines had to operate all of her organs

also true

now ...

so a person on a ventilator (not viable) is a dead person, that's what you're saying ? of course it isn't, you know it, I know it

Viability doesn't fully define "living life" because it is just one characteristic among many that distinguish living organisms from non-living things. Viability means the ability to survive, grow, and develop

Biology 101

The above is why doctors can operate on unborn babies in the womb - they're not "dead" they are very much living human beings. Surely you can see that

 

[ClaraD]

our money our choices right? if a man didn't want the baby why should be be shackled with the responsibility? it'll impact his career/college/job choices, it'll get in the way of game night, golfing and partying, it'll get in the way of his current GF's and maybe he has other kids and that financial drains will really impact them. He should have a choice right ??

You made the choice to get someone pregnant when you had sex.
Shackled? So, living children aren’t valuable? Only embryos right? How is paying $500 and never lifting a finger to care for a child shackled?

 

[ClaraD]

true



also true

now ...

so a person on a ventilator (not viable) is a dead person, that's what you're saying ? of course it isn't, you know it, I know it

Viability doesn't fully define "living life" because it is just one characteristic among many that distinguish living organisms from non-living things. Viability means the ability to survive, grow, and develop

Biology 101

The above is why doctors can operate on unborn babies in the womb - they're not "dead" they are very much living human beings. Surely you can see that

Viability does decide life. Viability does not refer to someone born.. it refers to pre birth stages.

 

[stealthycat]

It would be nice if she could walk away from a pregnancy consequence-free, but she cant...dont lie.

choices and decisions in life has consequences don't they ?

She cannot escape her consequences, remember? These are the only outcomes and some arent even "choices."

--have a kid
--have a miscarriage
--have an abortion
--die during pregnancy/childbirth

Too bad that you dont get to decide for women eh?, decisions that change their entire lives, their bodies, can cost their health and even their lives, eh? I'm thankful that you cant and I'm sure all the other women are too.

except society DOES decide for women ..... and we don't let women have their unborn babies killed in many states, restrictions in many other

you'd think men and women would be really conscious when they have sex wouldn't ya ?

I've asked you this already...did the man know she has that decision before he decided to sleep with her? Yes. Then why is HIS OWN DECISION her fault? Please explain?
She is so then of course, so should he.

she's irrelevant to his ability to choose right? pro-abortion people want choice to get out of the pregnancies they've created isn't that true? why not allow men to walk away ?

 

[stealthycat]

Viability does decide life. Viability does not refer to someone born.. it refers to pre birth stages.

do we agree this woman wasn't viable ?

 

[BirdinHand]

our money our choices right? if a man didn't want the baby why should be be shackled with the responsibility? it'll impact his career/college/job choices, it'll get in the way of game night, golfing and partying, it'll get in the way of his current GF's and maybe he has other kids and that financial drains will really impact them. He should have a choice right ??

Deadbeats gonna deadbeat.

 

[ClaraD]

do we agree this woman wasn't viable ?

She was born already so the medical term isn’t viable or not. Its alive or dead and the chances of survival of a critical injury. She was brain dead which means she’s dead

 

[stealthycat]

You made the choice to get someone pregnant when you had sex.

f'in BINGO !!!! the man and the woman made choices and now, they gotta live with the consequences of those choices

Shackled? So, living children aren’t valuable? Only embryos right? How is paying $500 and never lifting a finger to care for a child shackled?

hey, you're pro-abortion right? all I'm doing is showing you either both the man and the woman should have the choice to walk away from the pregnancy or NEITHER should be able to

siding with the woman having a choice and the man none is hypocritical as I've clearly shown


BOTH should be responsible

 

[stealthycat]

She was born already so the medical term isn’t viable or not. Its alive or dead and the chances of survival of a critical injury. She was brain dead which means she’s dead

so a dead woman carried a baby in her womb for 4 months is what you're saying


you absolutely know this isn't possible right? again we go back to a pregnancy - it HAS to have a living mother and a living unborn - it cannot be any other way. Its biologically impossible

 

[ClaraD]

f'in BINGO !!!! the man and the woman made choices and now, they gotta live with the consequences of those choices



hey, you're pro-abortion right? all I'm doing is showing you either both the man and the woman should have the choice to walk away from the pregnancy or NEITHER should be able to

siding with the woman having a choice and the man none is hypocritical as I've clearly shown


BOTH should be responsible

Im not pro abortion Im pro mind your own ****ing business when it comes to pregnancy. Its your side that likes to send born children to suffer and die…not mine

 

[stealthycat]

Deadbeats gonna deadbeat.

well what we can do (because we cannot force women to me mothers and men to be fathers)

is 10 months for the women to give birth and then walk away
18 years for the man to financially be responsible


that's the best we can do

 

[ClaraD]

so a dead woman carried a baby in her womb for 4 months is what you're saying


you absolutely know this isn't possible right? again we go back to a pregnancy - it HAS to have a living mother and a living unborn - it cannot be any other way. Its biologically impossible

What would happen if the machine was turned off?

 

[ClaraD]

well what we can do (because we cannot force women to me mothers and men to be fathers)

is 10 months for the women to give birth and then walk away
18 years for the man to financially be responsible


that's the best we can do

Um mother’s don’t just walk away financially either. They also have to pay child support if not primary care giver

 

[BirdinHand]

well what we can do (because we cannot force women to me mothers and men to be fathers)

is 10 months for the women to give birth and then walk away
18 years for the man to financially be responsible


that's the best we can do

Electing men who cheat on their (multiple) wives is apparently the direction this country is headed. So