Bomb disposal squad in Gaza faces risks amid little protection

[Phys251]

Bomb disposal squad in Gaza faces risks amid little protection

The squad has carried out 1,200 missions to neutralise, defuse and destroy unexploded warheads in residential areas.

www.aljazeera.com

On May 19, shortly after midnight, a reconnaissance missile tore through the roof of the Muhareb family home in Rafah in the south of the besieged Gaza Strip.

Two minutes later, an Israeli warplane dropped another missile, which crashed through two storeys of the house, but somehow did not explode.

“My brother and his family, who live on the second floor, were all injured from the reconnaissance missile,” Waseem Muhareb told Al Jazeera. “My four-month-old baby was in a coma for two days, and my eight-year-old niece Layan was in the intensive care unit for 10 days with burns all over her body.”

The extended Muhareb family home, inhabited by 36 adults and children, was ruined. The second missile had crashed through one of the children’s bedrooms before landing on the first floor.

How exactly are Palestinians supposed to live like this? How can one reasonably expect that they won't become radicalized when they can't even sleep without the fear of getting bombed by Israel?

(This question is specific to Palestinians and their day-to-day lives.)

 

[MaryP]

Should they ask themselves why Israel was bombing them? Short answer: because Palestine sent hundreds of rockets at them.

I get your point, though. With good manipulation of the facts, Palestinians can certainly be led to believe they're entirely innocent. It goes on both ways and has for decades.

 

[Mika-El]

Bomb disposal squad in Gaza faces risks amid little protection

The squad has carried out 1,200 missions to neutralise, defuse and destroy unexploded warheads in residential areas.

www.aljazeera.com

How exactly are Palestinians supposed to live like this? How can one reasonably expect that they won't become radicalized when they can't even sleep without the fear of getting bombed by Israel?

(This question is specific to Palestinians and their day-to-day lives.)

How about you ask Hamas. Your trying to be woke and only ask Palestinians is a crock of crap.

 

[Phys251]

Should they ask themselves why Israel was bombing them? Short answer: because Palestine sent hundreds of rockets at them.

I get your point, though. With good manipulation of the facts, Palestinians can certainly be led to believe they're entirely innocent. It goes on both ways and has for decades.

How about you ask Hamas. Your trying to be woke and only ask Palestinians is a crock of crap.

Perhaps the following statement in the OP was not clear:

(This question is specific to Palestinians and their day-to-day lives.)

This means that for the purpose of this discussion, the Hamas rockets are a separate issue.

So. How are Palestinians expected to live their lives like this without becoming radicalized?

 

[Mithrae]

Perhaps the following statement in the OP was not clear:



This means that for the purpose of this discussion, the Hamas rockets are a separate issue.

So. How are Palestinians expected to live their lives like this without becoming radicalized?

What kind of expectations and radicalization are you talking about? Are black men in America expected to live their lives without becoming "radicalized" by the fear of getting killed by cops? Should black men be "expected" to start bombing civilian targets in order to exert political pressure as an irrational and counter-productive way of fixing the problem?

By my rough calculations the risks faced by Palestinians from Israel are about ten times worse than the risks black men face from American cops, so even allowing for the differences between civilian policing and military conflicts, obviously that's a problem for those affected. But does that warrant an expectation of radicalization? Especially when the tactics of radicalized folk in that area seem so stupidly counterproductive? They'd be much better off taking a leaf out of Gandhi's book. I've read that when folk suffer trauma at the hands of another they often end up either identifying with the abuser and adopting similar sorts of behaviours themselves, or identify with the sufferer (which runs the risk of putting themselves in more abusive situations going forwards). Something similar might occur on a social/cultural level, a choice of either trying to dish it out back at the oppressors or of saying "That stuff is bad, so I'm going to find a better way of doing things." Obviously it seems that the former tends to be the more common approach, or at least common enough as to seize the biggest headlines, perpetuate the conflict and keep the terrorists in elected office.

So perhaps that's the more interesting question: Obviously stressful and dangerous situations will tend to shape people's views and actions; but instead of responding to violence with a 'radical' pacifism or repudiation of violence, why would a society more commonly respond to violence with ineffectual, irrational violence of their own for decade after decade when it obviously hasn't been a successful approach?

 

[Phys251]

What kind of expectations and radicalization are you talking about?

Suppose for the sake of argument you lived every day knowing that the government could legally bomb your home, and you had no recourse. That was your life. Nowhere to escape. You couldn't stop it, you couldn't leave, you couldn't vote your way out.

Do you think for just one minute that maybe, just maybe, you would be at a greater risk of becoming radicalized?

If not, I have a guaranteed Middle East peace deal right here to sell you. /s

 

[Valaisee]

Suppose for the sake of argument you lived every day knowing that the government could legally bomb your home, and you had no recourse. That was your life. Nowhere to escape. You couldn't stop it, you couldn't leave, you couldn't vote your way out.

That is not the case with Palestinians living in Gaza.

They don't live "every day knowing that the government could legally bomb your home", Israel only attacks as a response to major Hamas attacks - the last major war was in 2014!

"You had no recourse", "You couldn't stop it" and "you couldn't vote your way out" are also incorrect: Hamas rose to power because they got most votes in the last election, and Hamas was expected to win again in the recent cancelled election. Even without elections history is full with examples of people overthrowing their government - they could do that.

 

[Phys251]

That is not the case with Palestinians living in Gaza.

They don't live "every day knowing that the government could legally bomb your home", Israel only attacks as a response to major Hamas attacks - the last major war was in 2014!

Actually I'm talking about the most recent attacks from a few weeks ago, where Israel bombed some Palestinian apartments. Are you okay with Israel's having doing that?

(I won't answer any questions by you until you answer that one first.)

"You had no recourse", "You couldn't stop it" and "you couldn't vote your way out" are also incorrect: Hamas rose to power because they got most votes in the last election, and Hamas was expected to win again in the recent cancelled election. Even without elections history is full with examples of people overthrowing their government - they could do that.

Then tell me exactly what a Palestinian who is stuck in the Gaza Strip is supposed to do to get out. Not ten or even five years from now. Right now. How do they flee without Israel holding them in?

 

[Valaisee]

Actually I'm talking about the most recent attacks from a few weeks ago, where Israel bombed some Palestinian apartments. Are you okay with Israel's having doing that?

Not happy about it, but I can't think of a better strategy given Hamas infrastructure hides in those apartment buildings. AFAIK the residents of those apartment building were always warned in advance to evacuate the building bafore the fatal strike.

Then tell me exactly what a Palestinian who is stuck in the Gaza Strip is supposed to do to get out. Not ten or even five years from now. Right now. How do they flee without Israel holding them in?

Gaza has a border with Egypt that Israel doesn't control, they can use that.

 

[Fledermaus]

Bomb disposal squad in Gaza faces risks amid little protection

The squad has carried out 1,200 missions to neutralise, defuse and destroy unexploded warheads in residential areas.

www.aljazeera.com

How exactly are Palestinians supposed to live like this? How can one reasonably expect that they won't become radicalized when they can't even sleep without the fear of getting bombed by Israel?

(This question is specific to Palestinians and their day-to-day lives.)

A wonderful question for Hamas.

Would it be more productive to rebuild the infrastructure and protect and employ Palestinians rather than waste money on rockets and mortars with which to stab impotently as Israeli citizens?

 

[Phys251]

A wonderful question for Hamas.

Would it be more productive to rebuild the infrastructure and protect and employ Palestinians rather than waste money on rockets and mortars with which to stab impotently as Israeli citizens?

Whataboutism dismissed per the OP.

 

[Phys251]

Not happy about it, but I can't think of a better strategy given Hamas infrastructure hides in those apartment buildings.

You can't think of a better strategy than bombing civilians? You can't think of a better strategy than giving a pass to Israel's committing literal war crimes?!

 

[Fledermaus]

Whataboutism dismissed per the OP.

How is it "whataboutism"?

You asked : How exactly are Palestinians supposed to live like this?

Hamas has the ability to rebuild infrastructure, provide security and create jobs for the Palestinians in Gaza....

They choose instead to make Gaza a target.

Read the thread about tunnel waste. About rampant corruption and theft of goods. About their attempts to smuggle in more and more expensive munitions.

 

[Fledermaus]

You can't think of a better strategy than bombing civilians? You can't think of a better strategy than giving a pass to Israel's committing literal war crimes?!

No, they are bombing HAMAS.

 

[Phys251]

No, they are bombing HAMAS.

And apartment buildings. Do you deny this?

 

[Fledermaus]

And apartment buildings. Do you deny this?

Where is HAMAS using human shields?

BTW - Not a "war crime".

 

[Phys251]

Where is HAMAS using human shields?

You didn't answer my question.

BTW - Not a "war crime".

Bombing residences with residents inside is a war crime.

War Crimes And Breach of Geneva Convention

As per Rome Statute of the International Criminal Court WarWar Whenever Christians wage a war, it...

advocatetanmoy.com

"War crime of attacking civilians" is in this list.

It does not matter for the purpose of this discussion whether Hamas is doing it to. That is a separate question. War crimes by Hamas do not justify the war crimes by Israel.

 

[Fledermaus]

You didn't answer my question.



Bombing residences with residents inside is a war crime.

War Crimes And Breach of Geneva Convention

As per Rome Statute of the International Criminal Court WarWar Whenever Christians wage a war, it...

advocatetanmoy.com

"War crime of attacking civilians" is in this list.

It does not matter for the purpose of this discussion whether Hamas is doing it to. That is a separate question. War crimes by Hamas do not justify the war crimes by Israel.

Bombing military targets is not a "war crime".

Attacking HAMAS is not "attacking civilians".

If you actually read the laws the elimination of a military target is allowed. Even if there are civilians killed in the process. And the IDF goes above and beyond in trying to prevent civilian casualties.

 

[Phys251]

Bombing military targets is not a "war crime".

Attacking HAMAS is not "attacking civilians".

If you actually read the laws the elimination of a military target is allowed. Even if there are civilians killed in the process. And the IDF goes above and beyond in trying to prevent civilian casualties.

So war crimes are OK if they help with the military objective? You realize that's what everyone who's ordered a war crime would also say?

 

[Fledermaus]

So war crimes are OK if they help with the military objective? You realize that's what everyone who's ordered a war crime would also say?

Who said "war crimes" are OK?

If there is a military objective and the civilians losses are not excessive there IS NO war crime.

Try understanding the law if you are going to argue the law.

 

[Phys251]

Who said "war crimes" are OK?

If there is a military objective and the civilians losses are not excessive there IS NO war crime.

Try understanding the law if you are going to argue the law.

Considering how many Palestinians civilians had their lives cut short or their homes bombed in just the latest attack a couple months ago, you're going to have to do a much, much better job of selling me that that didn't constitute war crimes by Israel.

 

[Fledermaus]

Considering how many Palestinians civilians had their lives cut short or their homes bombed in just the latest attack a couple months ago, you're going to have to do a much, much better job of selling me that that didn't constitute war crimes by Israel.

I don't have to "sell" you anything. The laws of war are the laws of war.

 

[Phys251]

I don't have to "sell" you anything. The laws of war are the laws of war.

And Israel has broken them.

 

[Fledermaus]

And Israel has broken them.

You don't even know the laws....

 

[Evilroddy]

@Phys251

That Palestinians Arabs cannot live under such conditions is the whole point.

The State of Israel wants the land upon which many Palestinian Arabs have lived for centuries. That state does not want the Palestinian Arabs themselves, however. The solution is to make conditions so bleak for these unwanted inhabitants that Palestinians either leave or become radicalised. If they leave, point finale. If they radicalise, become militants/terrorists and ultimately commit violent acts, then the occupying military power can arrest, try, convict and jail them, demolish their families' homes, wall their neighbours off into ever shrinking ghettos, replace their people with illegal settlers and finally forcibly displace them for reasons of military security or historical site preservation. That's the slow-motion land clearing which is behind the continual suffering of the vast majority of Palestinian Arabs who commit no acts of war or terrorism against the State of Israel or its people.
UXBs are just another reminder to Palestinian Arabs that they must leave.

The Palestinians are not supposed to live this way. They are supposed to leave, be displaced or if militants, die as members of a surplus population which is unwanted by the occupying colonialist power in order to clear the land for incorporation into the ever growing frontiers of Eretz Israel.

Be well.
Evilroddy.