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Bin Laden offers truce

cherokee

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Sure. Then when he goes to sign it put two rounds thru his head.
 

Binary_Digit

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"there are operations that need preparations, and you will see them" A truce amid threats. Of course it's because al'Qaeda is and has been losing, but he's keeping up the threats to save face.
 

TimmyBoy

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Killing Bin Laden and his top henchmen won't stop Al-queda's ability to strike inside the US nor will it diminish such capability. They will just be replaced.
 

aps

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How is he losing? He killed more than 3000 people on September 11th and he has killed at least 1000 more Americans since we have been in Iraq. I'm sure he's pretty proud of himself right now.
 

Binary_Digit

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TimmyBoy said:
Killing Bin Laden and his top henchmen won't stop Al-queda's ability to strike inside the US nor will it diminish such capability. They will just be replaced.
I wouldn't exactly go that far. I'm sure their capability to strike within the U.S. has been extremely low since 9/11, the threat just won't go away completely as long as their complaints are not resolved to their liking. That's how terrorists work.
 

TimmyBoy

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Binary_Digit said:
I wouldn't exactly go that far. I'm sure their capability to strike within the U.S. has been extremely low since 9/11, it just won't go away completely as long as their complaints are not resolved to their liking. That's how terrorists work.

I would go that far, I personally believe that these security measures the US has implemented won't do much good in the long term. No matter how many terrorist leaders you kill, no matter what security precautions you make, as long as circumstances exist that makes terrorism a possibility, they will eventually suceed, like they did on September 11 in making another successful attack on the US. Remember, September 11 was not their first attempt to bring the WTC down and they had arrested others in the past for attempting to do so. They vowed they would keep up the fight and bring the WTC down one day and they did on September 11. No amount security or killings of terrorist leaders, without addressing the root cause of terrorism, is going to make the US safe from terrorism.
 

TimmyBoy

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Just like Benjamin Franklin said that those who would trade away their liberties for security deserve neither. He was so so so right and we see his wisdom here today.
 

Binary_Digit

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aps said:
How is he losing? He killed more than 3000 people on September 11th and he has killed at least 1000 more Americans since we have been in Iraq. I'm sure he's pretty proud of himself right now.
If body count is the measure of winning or losing, then we're completely dominating. But just like Viet Nam, there's more to winning this war than inflicting more casualties than you take. But that's another topic..

Remember that a large majority of our 2100+ dead in Iraq were killed in battles with Iraqi, Saudi, and Syrian insurgents, not al'Qaeda. M14 asked about al'Qaeda. Considering only al'Qaeda, they are public enemy #1 on the planet right now. Not one nation wants to be associated with them in any way, not even Syria and Iran. We have caught or killed dozens of key al'Qaeda leaders, and dismantled the entire organization as it was known, forcing them to live like rats in caves. Something that makes it exponentially more difficult for them to organize attacks compared to being under the Taliban's protection and approval. Something they are evidently getting tired of, based on this pathetic offer for truce.
 

TimmyBoy

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Binary_Digit said:
If body count is the measure of winning or losing, then we're completely dominating. But just like Viet Nam, there's more to winning this war than inflicting more casualties than you take. But that's another topic..

Remember that a large majority of our 2100+ dead in Iraq were killed in battles with Iraqi, Saudi, and Syrian insurgents, not al'Qaeda. M14 asked about al'Qaeda. Considering only al'Qaeda, they are public enemy #1 on the planet right now. Not one nation wants to be associated with them in any way, not even Syria and Iran. We have caught or killed dozens of key al'Qaeda leaders, and dismantled the entire organization as it was known, forcing them to live like rats in caves. Something that makes it exponentially more difficult for them to organize attacks compared to being under the Taliban's protection and approval. Something they are evidently getting tired of, based on this pathetic offer for truce.

Wars are not won on the battlefield or by inflicting more casualties on the enemy. Wars are won in the hearts and minds of people.
 

Binary_Digit

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TimmyBoy said:
I would go that far, I personally believe that these security measures the US has implemented won't do much good in the long term. No matter how many terrorist leaders you kill, no matter what security precautions you make, as long as circumstances exist that makes terrorism a possibility, they will eventually suceed, like they did on September 11 in making another successful attack on the US. Remember, September 11 was not their first attempt to bring the WTC down and they had arrested others in the past for attempting to do so. They vowed they would keep up the fight and bring the WTC down one day and they did on September 11. No amount security or killings of terrorist leaders, without addressing the root cause of terrorism, is going to make the US safe from terrorism.
I agree with all of that, like I said the threat will never go away as long as the "root cause" is still there. But considering Federal Air Marshals and secure cockpits, the good parts of the Patriot Act, the dismantling of the Taliban and most of al'Qaeda, you don't think al'Qaeda's capability to strike within the U.S. has been reduced since 9/11?
 
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Binary_Digit

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TimmyBoy said:
Wars are not won on the battlefield or by inflicting more casualties on the enemy. Wars are won in the hearts and minds of people.
You're right. But when people's hearts and minds lead them to violence against you, it behooves you to remove that threat by force. Hearts and minds are not won by flying airplanes into buildings either.
 

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We don't even know if the tape is authenic or when it was made.......Why no video from this guy in a year and a half? If it is him you don't offer a truce to the infidels if your winning.......

Tell Bin Laden to stick his truce where the sun don't shine.............
 

TimmyBoy

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Binary_Digit said:
I agree with all of that, like I said the threat will never go away as long as the "root cause" is still there. But considering Federal Air Marshals and secure cockpits, the good parts of the Patriot Act, the dismantling of the Taliban and most of al'Qaeda, you don't think al'Qaeda's capability to strike within the U.S. hasn't been reduced since 9/11?

I am not a terrorism expert by any stretch of the imagination. Maybe in the short term we have suceeded in disrupting some of their operations. But we need to be more concerned with finding a long term solution to the problem. I feel that we have not properly addressed the long term solution. I do support Bush's push for democracy in Iraq and promoting it in theh Middle East, though I still distrust his ulterior motives for going in and the way he went about going in, especially given that it appears he used the September 11 attacks to further an agenda of seizing more power, pushing his own agenda through rather than trying to fight terrorism and keep the nation safe.
 

TimmyBoy

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Binary_Digit said:
You're right. But when people's hearts and minds lead them to violence against you, it behooves you to remove that threat by force. Hearts and minds are not won by flying airplanes into buildings either.

And neither are hearts and minds won by dropping bombs on nations that offer huge economic incentives for stronger powers to take, while ignoring the vast murders, genocides in nations that are poor and offer no resources or economic interests.
 

aps

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Binary_Digit said:
If body count is the measure of winning or losing, then we're completely dominating. But just like Viet Nam, there's more to winning this war than inflicting more casualties than you take. But that's another topic..

Remember that a large majority of our 2100+ dead in Iraq were killed in battles with Iraqi, Saudi, and Syrian insurgents, not al'Qaeda. M14 asked about al'Qaeda. Considering only al'Qaeda, they are public enemy #1 on the planet right now. Not one nation wants to be associated with them in any way, not even Syria and Iran. We have caught or killed dozens of key al'Qaeda leaders, and dismantled the entire organization as it was known, forcing them to live like rats in caves. Something that makes it exponentially more difficult for them to organize attacks compared to being under the Taliban's protection and approval. Something they are evidently getting tired of, based on this pathetic offer for truce.

Binary, you raise excellent points. I hadn't thought of it that way. :)
 

TimmyBoy

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aps said:
Binary, you raise excellent points. I hadn't thought of it that way. :)

Time will tell, if these tatics, that Binary describes, have worked.
 

Binary_Digit

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TimmyBoy said:
Maybe in the short term we have suceeded in disrupting some of their operations. But we need to be more concerned with finding a long term solution to the problem. I feel that we have not properly addressed the long term solution.
I couldn't agree more. I've always said Bush is good at removing the flame but not the fuel that ignites it. I think some of the things he's done has actually added more fuel i.e. torture.
 

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So, if we give up Afghanistan and Iraq, aQ will play nice?

I'm not sure that really counts as a truce so much as a request for capitulation.
 

TimmyBoy

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Simon W. Moon said:
So, if we give up Afghanistan and Iraq, aQ will play nice?

I'm not sure that really counts as a truce so much as a request for capitulation.

I would have to agree with you on that one. We certainly need to keep the pressure on them.
 

Binary_Digit

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Simon W. Moon said:
So, if we give up Afghanistan and Iraq, aQ will play nice?
No, according to ObL aQ will play nice if:

1. America withdraws all troops from the Middle East, especially Saudi Arabia.
2. America stops supporting Israel so that Palestinians can take their "holy land" back.
3. America lifts economic sanctions that starve civilians more than curtail rogue leaders.
 

GarzaUK

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I believe it's a trick. AQ obviously wants us to think they are weak by offering a truce. Hoping that the US sensing this weakness will pour effort in the war. Costing more money, more men, more hatred among Muslim nations.
Bin Ladens main aim is a holy war between Islam and the West. I doubt he is even thinking of surrendering.
 

Simon W. Moon

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Binary_Digit said:
No, according to ObL aQ will play nice if:

1. America withdraws all troops from the Middle East, especially Saudi Arabia.
2. America stops supporting Israel so that Palestinians can take their "holy land" back.
3. America lifts economic sanctions that starve civilians more than curtail rogue leaders.
Still doesn't seem like 'truce' is the right word for it.

Still seems like he's saying, "If you give in to my demands, I won't go on w/ the planned attacks."

Sounds like more extortion.
 
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Anyone who thinks OBL is offering a truce is crazier than he is.
 
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