Biden teases new eviction freeze, admits likely unconstitutional

[Grizzly Adams]

Its in nobody's best interests, including landlords, to evict 11 million renters

I agree with this, but it should be left to individual landlords to make arrangements with their tenants, not the federal government making things up on the fly.

 

[Atomic Kid]

It’s quite a requirement to make landlord prove what the (non-paying) tenant‘s income is. Rest assured that I wouldn’t give household income information to my landlord, but we don’t refuse to pay our rent.

Is that what you really believe? That the majority of these people are simply "refusing" to pay their rent? Could it not be that they can't pay their rent because they have no income due to job loss or cut hours from the pandemic? A lot of landlords do credit checks btw.

 

[Court Jester]

Where have we come in America when landlords no longer own their own properties, and the tenant contracts they hold mean nothing. I have no sympathy for people who have not paid their rent or vacated, especially in areas where there is a high demand for willing renters to take those people's places.

Can't pay your rent, move back with your parents or siblings. This is a YOU problem, not a me problem.

 

[Gatsby]

Of all the ways to fight poverty, an extralegal, arbitrary rent freeze (which is what this amounts to, for some people) has to be one of the worst and least efficient solutions.

And of all the ways to fight covid, this is...also one of the worst and least efficient solutions.

I consider myself liberal and I'm interested in reducing inequality. But the left undermines those efforts when it wastes its limited political capital on stupid stuff like this.

If you want people to have money so they can pay rent, just give them money. And if you want them to not get covid, just make sure they have easy access to the free vaccine. Why are we complicating this?

 

[j-mac]

Of all the ways to fight poverty, an extralegal, arbitrary rent freeze (which is what this amounts to, for some people) has to be one of the worst and least efficient solutions.

And of all the ways to fight covid, this is...also one of the worst and least efficient solutions.

I consider myself liberal and I'm interested in reducing inequality. But the left undermines those efforts when it wastes its limited political capital on stupid stuff like this.

If you want people to have money so they can pay rent, just give them money. And if you want them to not get covid, just make sure they have easy access to the free vaccine. Why are we complicating this?

We have done both.

 

[dixon01767]

Really?

Really. You and I in response were speaking of

Those programs require the tenant to ‘qualify’.

I see now you want to talk about the landlords instead.

 

[ttwtt78640]

Really. You and I in response were speaking of

I see now you want to talk about the landlords instead.

Yep, because the landlord is the one getting paid.

 

[cpwill]

Who said that? Not me. I said DeSantis had the back of the unvaccinated and instead of pushing the vaccine he spent his time suing companies that required it.

Here is a direct quote of what you said:

It is amusing that you say that given the Republican governors in Florida and Texas were blindsided by the Delta surge that caused the CDC to renew the eviction moratorium. Had they not encouraged people not to vaccinate or wear masks this would not have been needed.

You make two arguments:

1. The Delta variant is the reason for the renewal of the eviction moratorium
2. Had Florida and Texas Republicans not encouraged people not to vaccinate or wear masks*, the Delta variant would not have required the CDC to renew the eviction moratorium.

*and we can go here after you explain how the actions of the Texas and Florida governors caused the development of the Delta virus, which then caused the CDC to renew the eviction moratorium, because I would very much like to see any links to either DeSantis or Abbot encouraging people not to vaccinate

Then there is his fighting masks like they were the problem and not covid. When spreaders wear masks the virus they exhale is greatly reduced. Can you explain the mechanism where not wearing masks is helping prevent this surge? Also why doing nothing means he is doing a good job? We have the highest number of new cases in the country now.

You appear to be confusing "not mandating masks" with "not wearing masks". While mask-wearing helps individuals avoid spread, and is associated with slower spread during low-transmission periods, it is not associated with slower spread during high-transmission periods. It also turns out that mask mandates do not help slow transmission. Texas, for example, lifted it's mask mandate in early March, and, despite widespread predictions of impending doom, COVID continued to decline in the state.

 

[ttwtt78640]

Here is a direct quote of what you said:



You make two arguments:

1. The Delta variant is the reason for the renewal of the eviction moratorium
2. Had Florida and Texas Republicans not encouraged people not to vaccinate or wear masks*, the Delta variant would not have required the CDC to renew the eviction moratorium.

*and we can go here after you explain how the actions of the Texas and Florida governors caused the development of the Delta virus, which then caused the CDC to renew the eviction moratorium, because I would very much like to see any links to either DeSantis or Abbot encouraging people not to vaccinate




You appear to be confusing "not mandating masks" with "not wearing masks". While mask-wearing helps individuals avoid spread, and is associated with slower spread during low-transmission periods, it is not associated with slower spread during high-transmission periods. It also turns out that mask mandates do not help slow transmission. Texas, for example, lifted it's mask mandate in early March, and, despite widespread predictions of impending doom, COVID continued to decline in the state.

The effectiveness of mask wearing depends on the type of mask worn and how well it is fitted. Mandating masks be worn, without regard to the type of mask which qualifies, is largely symbolic.

 

[dcsports]

Is that what you really believe? That the majority of these people are simply "refusing" to pay their rent? Could it not be that they can't pay their rent because they have no income due to job loss or cut hours from the pandemic? A lot of landlords do credit checks btw.

Majority? I don't know. Certainly there's a good percentage where that's the case.

We're way past the initial shock and job losses. People with job losses had unemployment + a bonus. Not to mention, tax credits, government payments, and rental assistance programs. Employers are desperate for employees. The justification for continuing this just isn't there a year and a half later.

 

[ttwtt78640]

Is that what you really believe? That the majority of these people are simply "refusing" to pay their rent? Could it not be that they can't pay their rent because they have no income due to job loss or cut hours from the pandemic? A lot of landlords do credit checks btw.

I doubt that the majority are doing so, but there is no COVID-19 related income reduction impact requirement to qualify for the eviction moratorium.

 

[iguanaman]

Here is a direct quote of what you said:



You make two arguments:

1. The Delta variant is the reason for the renewal of the eviction moratorium
2. Had Florida and Texas Republicans not encouraged people not to vaccinate or wear masks*, the Delta variant would not have required the CDC to renew the eviction moratorium.

*and we can go here after you explain how the actions of the Texas and Florida governors caused the development of the Delta virus, which then caused the CDC to renew the eviction moratorium, because I would very much like to see any links to either DeSantis or Abbot encouraging people not to vaccinate




You appear to be confusing "not mandating masks" with "not wearing masks". While mask-wearing helps individuals avoid spread, and is associated with slower spread during low-transmission periods, it is not associated with slower spread during high-transmission periods. It also turns out that mask mandates do not help slow transmission. Texas, for example, lifted it's mask mandate in early March, and, despite widespread predictions of impending doom, COVID continued to decline in the state.

You could be the most naive person on this board if you believe not mandating masks is not the same as discouraging their use and that suing companies for requiring vaccines does not make people feel that being vaccinated is not a priority in Florida. In fact it sends the message that vaccinations are a choice like what flavor ice cream you prefer. Ron Death Sentence has decided that fighting science is more important than fighting the virus. Speaking of death sentences, Florida had 140 covid deaths yesterday the most in the nation by a mile.

 

[iguanaman]

The effectiveness of mask wearing depends on the type of mask worn and how well it is fitted. Mandating masks be worn, without regard to the type of mask which qualifies, is largely symbolic.

Any mask that covers the nose and mouth greatly reduces the virus exhaled by the asymptomatic spreaders that drive the spread of covid. The caveat is the EVERYONE must wear them since even one spreader indoors will fill the air with virus which can find its way around most masks.

The main purpose of wearing a mask is to prevent the spread of COVID-19, especially “in public settings and when around people who don’t live in your household, especially when other social distancing measures are difficult to maintain,” according to the CDC.
While masks will help keep the wearer safe, they serve a greater good – stopping others from getting infected if you happen to be the spreader. Masks catch droplets of moisture that may be acting as a transition medium for the virus.

https://www.weforum.org/agenda/2020/08/coronavirus-face-masks-myths/

 

[cpwill]

The effectiveness of mask wearing depends on the type of mask worn and how well it is fitted. Mandating masks be worn, without regard to the type of mask which qualifies, is largely symbolic.

Maybe. There are scenarios where lack of detailed information justifies blanked policies, and where spread is so rapid that every little bit helps.

But you are absolutely right that what we are seeing now - support for mask mandates regardless of whether or not an area is in one of those scenarios, is definitely a totem, a way of signalling tribal membership, etc.

 

[cpwill]

You could be the most naive person on this board if you believe not mandating masks is not the same as discouraging their use

No. That would make me logical.

For example, the government does not currently mandate that I wear a condom during sex. That doesn't mean that the government is discouraging condom use. While the government provides tax benefits for certain kinds of retirement savings, it does not mandate them - that is still government encouraging, not discouraging, retirement savings.

There used to be a Conservative joke that, for leftists, everything that was not required was forbidden. Interesting to see you embrace the stereotype.

and that suing companies for requiring vaccines does not make people feel that being vaccinated is not a priority in Florida. In fact it sends the message that vaccinations are a choice like what flavor ice cream you prefer. Ron Death Sentence has decided that fighting science is more important than fighting the virus.

Again, not mandating something is not the same as discouraging it.

DeSantis urges public to get vaccinated: These shots are 'saving lives'
Ron DeSantis urges Floridians to get vaccinated despite leading anti-lockdown efforts
Florida Health Officials, DeSantis Urge Vaccinations Amid Spike in Covid Cases, Hospitalizations

Partisanship is a bad drug, my friend It leads us to make foolish arguments like "Trump is going to be a great president because he's a great businessman" and "If Romney is elected he's going to put black people back in chains". Or, in this case "DeSantis is trying to discourage people from getting the vaccine."

Speaking of death sentences, Florida had 140 covid deaths yesterday the most in the nation by a mile.

Given their high proportion of elderly, that's not astonishing. However, despite that heavy disproportionate number of elderly, Florida overall is 27th in the nation in terms of COVID deaths per 100,000 people. The top four deadliest states as of this spring were New Jersey, New York, Rhode Island, and Massachussetts.

 

[lurchadams]

I'm not particularly concerned about breakthrough cases considering the infinitesimal risk they pose. The Delta varient is not as lethal. As viruses evolve they tend to become more transmissible and less lethal. If someone doesn't want to be vaccinated that is their choice. All at risk groups have access to a vaccine and have had access to the vaccine for quite some time now. If you aren't aware, COVID-19 is never going away. There will always be breakthrough cases just as there will always be people who elect not to vaccinate.

To the bolded. Tell that to all the unvaccinated kids on life support in MS:

"

2. Is the Delta variant more dangerous than other variants of concern?​

According to surveys conducted in the U.K., where Delta accounts for ~90% of current COVID-19 cases, symptoms of Delta tend to be a little different than other strains, but that does not necessarily mean the associated symptoms are more severe. Fever, headache, sore throat and runny nose are common, while cough and loss of smell are not. Other reports link Delta to more serious symptoms, including hearing impairment, severe gastrointestinal issues and blood clots leading to tissue death and gangrene. Research is ongoing to determine if Delta infection is associated with increased hospitalization and death. One early study assessing the risk of hospital admission in Scotland reported that hospitalization is twice as likely in unvaccinated individuals with Delta than in unvaccinated individuals with Alpha. "

Are you saying you know more than the Scottish doctors? The bottom line is: This is a new virus. We don't know the total extent of it's severity. On what are you basing your opinion on that the Delta variant is less deadly?