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Authorities release new details about police shooting of Jacob Blake

bluesmoke said:
Even if the cop saw him reaching for a knife, the situation was no where near the time to shoot the man. The man was not in possession of a weapon. What the man should have done changes none of that. The cop should not have shot him in the back 7 times and that is where the wrong is.
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The cop should have waited til Blake stabbed him?
 
Luther said:
Just think, if he would have just cooperated with police, we wouldn't even be having this conversation right?
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That seems to be a common thread in most of these events.
 
Metric Mouse said:
Maybe the officers would have just kneeled on him, or put him in a choke hold or given him a rough ride until he died. Sometimes choices are not as clear cut as we would like.
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With respect, using the statistics of deaths to population, any cop is 10 times more likely to be killed on the job than any Black is to be killed by a cop.

Cops are twice as likely to kill a White than they are likely to kill a Black.

The fallacy of cops "hunting" Blacks as that idiot LeBron James puts forth as his belief is a fallacy.
 
Metric Mouse said:
Because in the modern era cooperating with police in the United States has been no guarantee that the cooperative person will not be injured or killed.
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Is there an example of a person being completely cooperative with the cops and also being killed by those cops?
 
Metric Mouse said:
Unfortunately police officers sometimes have to do such things to protect the general public. I imagine the officers were concerned about what might happen to the occupants of the vehicle if a man armed with a knife was allowed inside unimpeded.
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The people inside the vehicle were his kids! Are you serious?!
 
Thom Paine said:
read the police report..
legally, he is not required to see the knife to defend himself. reasonable suspicion and reasonable fear.
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So you're sticking with the defense that the cop was just an idiot who got in close enough to the point where he actually *could* be stabbed versus remaining outside the very short range of a knife. And then shot him seven times in the back.
 
code1211 said:
With respect, using the statistics of deaths to population, any cop is 10 times more likely to be killed on the job than any Black is to be killed by a cop.

Cops are twice as likely to kill a White than they are likely to kill a Black.

The fallacy of cops "hunting" Blacks as that idiot LeBron James puts forth as his belief is a fallacy.
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You do realise that you proved his point right?

If cops are twice as likely to kill a white person than a black person, and the black male population is only around 6.7% of the total population.. then that number should not be 2 to 1.. That means blacks are proportionally far far far far greater at risk of death by cop than compared to a white person.
 
Binary_Digit said:
And if the cop didn't shoot based on scary hypothetical possibilities rather than what he actually saw?
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The man in question was known by authorities and seemed to have had various run ins with the law previously.

The tazer had effect on him.

Police were responding to a call of violence and at least one person was taken to a hospital as a result of the call injured by the actions causing the call.

Police have been called to respond and have been ambushed when they arrive. these cups most certainly knew of this.

There are a bunch of things happening in a call like this, in real time, that are cause for extraordinary caution.

As a society, we give our police extraordinary powers and weapons to help us as a society. As individuals within the society, we need to understand this and help them in performance of their duties.

As we have seen, there are many people that are working assertively AGAINST our police.

Motives of those working against the police seem disconnected from helping society.
 
Metric Mouse said:
The correction officers I have trained with have stated "the first thing to know about fighting a guy with a knife is that you're going to be stabbed."

It did seem odd that the first version of events was that "Jacob Blake stopped to break up a fight between two women, and when police arrived they followed him to his car and shot him in the back." That's why I'm glad more information is coming out.

I can't think of a good way to de-escalate this situation once the tasers were deployed ineffectively.
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My son permanently lost use of a finger, had to have 3 surgeries on that hand. It's a dangerous job. Of course, he didn't have the option of shooting the guy--CO's don't carry--but I hope to God he wouldn't have, even if he had that option. I swear, maybe cops ought to be downgraded, too, if they can't stop over-utilizing lethal force. I support the hard job police do, but not when they forget themselves. The thought of shooting someone doesn't enter the mind of our cops around here--and they deal with all sorts, a lot of them dangerous as hell, even the ones on PCP that take five cops to subdue and cuff. Maybe city cops need an attitude readjustment. I don't know.
 
MaryP said:
I figured he was more involved in that call than first thought. Thinking he'd pull a knife on a bunch of armed cops wasn't using his brain cells, but the cop who shot him ? He wasn't either. Everyone was just reacting. There are pretty simple maneuvers for disarming a guy with a knife. Every correction officer knows how, so I'm assuming cops do too.
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When a person in this situation pulls a knife, he has made a commitment to kill.

If you don't stop him, you have made a commitment to die.

The victim's injuries were tragic, but this guy was not a choir boy.
 
Oborosen said:
I really wish more people practiced compliance with the police and not try to start anything. I can bet you that up to 90% of these deaths could have been avoided if the person/persons just complied.

It's still a sad story, but this madness has to end at some point.
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Yes, training your cops properly would help.

UK Cops Disarm Man Wielding a Machete | Firsthand | CBC - YouTube

A far more potentially dangerous scenario. No guns, nobody in hospital comatose and paralysed for life with his internal organs shredded.
 
bluesmoke said:
Even if the cop saw him reaching for a knife, the situation was no where near the time to shoot the man. The man was not in possession of a weapon. What the man should have done changes none of that. The cop should not have shot him in the back 7 times and that is where the wrong is.
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Exactly when and where is the time to shoot him?

Were you there?

Were you there on the previous occasions when this guy was arrested?
 
Jredbaron96 said:
Absolutely true. People have been shot while laying on the ground screaming "don't shoot". It's a failure of law enforcement training.
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Was this person laying on the ground shouting, "Don't shoot!"?
 
tacomancer said:
Ok thank you, admittedly, I am not following this bit of news very closely.
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Isnt this exactly the problem? Forming opinions with limited information. Harmless on a debate forum, but many people in the real world are dead because of the reactions of people with limited info.
 
code1211 said:
With respect, using the statistics of deaths to population, any cop is 10 times more likely to be killed on the job than any Black is to be killed by a cop.

Cops are twice as likely to kill a White than they are likely to kill a Black.

The fallacy of cops "hunting" Blacks as that idiot LeBron James puts forth as his belief is a fallacy.
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I am not arguing that cops are writ large hunting anyone. I'm pointing out that there are systematic training and expectation issues that lead to more civilian deaths at the hands of police than should be acceptable in the United States.
 
Metric Mouse said:
Have you seen the video of Daniel Leetin Shaver's death? George Floyd, while perhaps uncooperative at the time of his arrest, was handcuffed and prone on the ground when he was suffocated by 4 police officers kneeling on him for several minutes, long after he stopped struggling. People die following police commands far too often.
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According to information released, Floyd wasnt following police commands, which is why he was on the ground. Thats no excuse for him to die, but accuracy matters.
 
snakestretcher said:
If the kids had been in any danger from Blake up to that point, the authorities would have had them in care.
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Yes, no one has ever snapped and killed their kids. Please.
 
code1211 said:
Was this person laying on the ground shouting, "Don't shoot!"?
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Did I say he was? Or did I point out that cooperating with, or not threatening law enforcement at all, has not prevented people from getting shot by cops?
 
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