Appeals court denies Michael Flynn and Justice Department's effort to end his case

[lwf]

At times it strikes me that those who dislike Trump and the people around him are bound and determined to make damn sure no outsider like Trump ever runs for president again. So what if Flynn did nothing wrong? We got him by his cojones as he LIED to an FBI agent. Oh my God, what a terrible crime. We will have to send him to prison for the rest of his life.

Flynn was never going to go to prison for the rest of his life. But obstruction of justice is a serious crime. Or at least it used to be. Just ask Bill Clinton.

 

[NWRatCon]

Lying to the FBI is not a non existent crime. It is, in fact, a crime.

I guess that means Clinesmith should get a pardon, too. Goose/gander and all.

 

[NWRatCon]

The fact that Flynn lied to investigators is not disputed even by Barr. Their argument in the DOJ motion (which was not signed by any career DOJ prosecutor) was not that Flynn did not lie but that his lie was not material to the FBI's investigations which is pretty incredibe considering the fact that the FBI at the time was also into a possible counterintelligence investigation of the possible scenario that Russians were using people close to Trump to gain access to the highest level of the US government. So, any lie that misrepresenting a dialogie between Flynn and the Ryssian ambassador seemed very relevant to the FBI's case/ But heck, the DOJ has the transcripts of the conversation, so they can reveal it to Sulivan and explain why Flynn's lie was not material to the case!

Especially since both the government and Flynn himself told the judge it was.

 

[pamak]

Especially since both the government and Flynn himself told the judge it was.

And especially since Trump fired Flynn for lying to Pence. That was the story at the time.

Trump alters story on why he fired Flynn


Trump’s tweet: “I had to fire General Flynn because he lied to the Vice President and the FBI. He has pled guilty to those lies. It is a shame because his actions during the transition were lawful. There was nothing to hide!”



Now Barr tries to ague that having a person like Flynn (who was already under investigation at the time for possible collussion with the Russians) lying to the vice president elect about a conversation he had with the Russian ambassador was not material to the FBI investigation...

I am waiting for the day when Barr will be under investigation.

 

[NWRatCon]

And especially since Trump fired Flynn for lying to Pence. That was the story at the time.

Trump alters story on why he fired Flynn


Trump’s tweet: “I had to fire General Flynn because he lied to the Vice President and the FBI. He has pled guilty to those lies. It is a shame because his actions during the transition were lawful. There was nothing to hide!”



Now Barr tries to ague that having a person like Flynn (who was already under investigation at the time for possible collussion with the Russians) lying to the vice president elect about a conversation he had with the Russian ambassador was not material to the FBI investigation...

I am waiting for the day when Barr will be under investigation.

I am waiting for the completion of the counterintelligence investigation into Donald Trump and the Trump Organization. Michael Schmidt's new book: Trump vs the United States comes out tomorrow. Looks like a fascinating and devastating, well researched and reported book.

 

[Athanasius68]

The fact that Flynn lied to investigators is not disputed even by Barr. Their argument in the DOJ motion (which was not signed by any career DOJ prosecutor) was not that Flynn did not lie but that his lie was not material to the FBI's investigations which is pretty incredibe considering the fact that the FBI at the time was also into a possible counterintelligence investigation of the possible scenario that Russians were using people close to Trump to gain access to the highest level of the US government. So, any lie that misrepresenting a dialogie between Flynn and the Ryssian ambassador seemed very relevant to the FBI's case/ But heck, the DOJ has the transcripts of the conversation, so they can reveal it to Sulivan and explain why Flynn's lie was not material to the case!

No. They were investigating whether the Trump campaign was conspiring with Russia, not whether Russia was targeting the Trump campaign.

 

[JANFU]

It appears the Deep State is still out to get Flynn for doing nothing illegal. Meanwhile Hillary waltzes away scot-free for putting highly classified information on a improperly secured and unauthorized server. If I would have mishandled classified data and been caught I would have been indicted, prosecuted and sentenced to time in prison.

In the end it looks like Trump will have to pardon Flynn and he will.

Why dismiss the Flynn case? Because the FBI can't prove it
Why dismiss the Flynn case? Because the FBI can't prove it | TheHill

Where ya been for the last 3 years?

 

[JANFU]

Wonder who is paying his lawyers??

 

[JANFU]

Assume you pled guilty to robbing a bank twice but the bank had never been robbed.

So he lied?
What else did he lie about- oh yeah Russian contacts

 

[CaughtInThe]

the party that supports our modern Confederacy also supports massive liars and religious con men.



makes sense to me.

 

[Batcat]

Where ya been for the last 3 years?

If you referring to my absence on this board I signed up here when the Democratic Underground & its sister site Discussionist went off line after Trump won the election. When those boards came back up I went back. Discussionist ended and Democratic Underground is now far too liberal for me. I have decided to try a couple of other forums to discuss events.

 

[Captain America]

Assume you pled guilty to robbing a bank twice but the bank had never been robbed.

Are you one of those Q people?

 

[JANFU]

If you referring to my absence on this board I signed up here when the Democratic Underground & its sister site Discussionist went off line after Trump won the election. When those boards came back up I went back. Discussionist ended and Democratic Underground is now far too liberal for me. I have decided to try a couple of other forums to discuss events.

Not at all- You were here then you were gone.

 

[W_Heisenberg]

 

[W_Heisenberg]

Assume you pled guilty to robbing a bank twice but the bank had never been robbed.

Assume no one knew the bank had been robbed because the people involved in the robbery lied to investigators.

 

[Batcat]

Are you one of those Q people?

Q never made much sense to me so the answer is no.

Q reminds me of CNN and MSNBC. They all predicted a lot of stuff that never happened. It amazes me why some people listen to such crap.

 

[Plasmaball]

I'm guessing the judges all voted according to whether they were nominated by Republicans or Democrats. This was probably more a political than a judicial decision.

I see we went for lazy

 

[Captain America]

Q never made much sense to me so the answer is no.

Q reminds me of CNN and MSNBC. They all predicted a lot of stuff that never happened. It amazes me why some people listen to such crap.

I agree. We can also add FOXNews to your list. (Surprised you left them out considering they are undoubtedly the worst of them all. That says a lot.)

 

[pamak]

No. They were investigating whether the Trump campaign was conspiring with Russia, not whether Russia was targeting the Trump campaign.

You make absolutely no sense...By the way, even the Steele dossier mentioned the scenario that the Russians were using people like Manafort to try to get access to Trump. It is inconceivable that an agency like the FBI would not examine the scenario of having foreign agents trying to get access inside the Trump campaign. Also, at the time of Flynn's misconduct Trump had already won, so the scenario was was not just getting access to a campaign. It was about getting access to the highest levels of the incoming US government.

 

[Batcat]

I agree. We can also add FOXNews to your list. (Surprised you left them out considering they are undoubtedly the worst of them all. That says a lot.)

The reason I left Fox News out was they kept insisting that there was no collusion between Trump or his campaign to defeat Hillary while the other outlets insisted there was. Fox News was therefore more accurate than CNN or MSNBC who had assured me enough evidence would be found to remove Trump from office.

I realize that all news today is propaganda. You get to listen to the propaganda you like and I get to listen to the propaganda I like. Neither one of us knows the truth because we likely can’t handle the truth.

 

[tres borrachos]

Lock him up.

 

[tres borrachos]

Where ya been for the last 3 years?

Trump Fan Club meetings and Stormfront,

 

[Athanasius68]

You make absolutely no sense...By the way, even the Steele dossier mentioned the scenario that the Russians were using people like Manafort to try to get access to Trump. It is inconceivable that an agency like the FBI would not examine the scenario of having foreign agents trying to get access inside the Trump campaign. Also, at the time of Flynn's misconduct Trump had already won, so the scenario was was not just getting access to a campaign. It was about getting access to the highest levels of the incoming US government.

The FBI never warned the Trump campaign that they were investigating Russia trying to infiltrate it. This despite the fact they gave a generic briefing to Mr. Trump and Mr. Flynn warning to be aware of such efforts. The reason why is obvious-- they were investigating Mr. Trump himself.

The FBI had the transcript of the Flynn/Kisylak conversation. Mr. Comey stated there was no issue with it.

The FBI was investigating Mr. Trump for actually conspiring with Russia-- not whether Russia was trying to infiltrate

 

[pamak]

The FBI never warned the Trump campaign that they were investigating Russia trying to infiltrate it. This despite the fact they gave a generic briefing to Mr. Trump and Mr. Flynn warning to be aware of such efforts. The reason why is obvious-- they were investigating Mr. Trump himself.

The FBI had the transcript of the Flynn/Kisylak conversation. Mr. Comey stated there was no issue with it.

The FBI was investigating Mr. Trump for actually conspiring with Russia-- not whether Russia was trying to infiltrate

The stanard practice for the FBI is to not reveal investigations. You provide no evidence for your claim that there was no problem with the trascript. On the other hand, I showe to you that even TRUMP admited that Flynn lied to Pence about his conversations with the Russian ambassador. The lying itself about the content is a legitimate concern for any counter-intelligence agency investigating Russian infiltrations. The mere concept of counter-intelligence includes the investigation of foreign intelligence agents trying to inflitrate friendly agencies and governments!

At the time of Flynn's investigation and interview, Trump was NOT the subject of an FBI investigation and he was already briefed as president-elect (by Comey) about theteele dossier!

 

[Athanasius68]

The stanard practice for the FBI is to not reveal investigations. You provide no evidence for your claim that there was no problem with the trascript. On the other hand, I showe to you that even TRUMP admited that Flynn lied to Pence about his conversations with the Russian ambassador. The lying itself about the content is a legitimate concern for any counter-inteligence agency investigating Russian infiltrations.

At the time of Flynn's investigation and interview, Trump was NOT the subject of an FBI investigation and he was already briefed as president-elect (by Comey) about theteele dossier!

The Rice memo released earlier this year details Comey's statement that he saw nothing illegal or of a national security concern with the conversation.

The Trump campaign had a pair of former federal prosecutors (Christie and Sessions) on it. No reason not to warn them if the concern was Russian infiltration.
Indeed, the FBI agent who gave Trump his generic warning in August 2016 was the same agent who was heading up Crossfire Hurricane. The 'generic' interview wss in fact part of the investigation. Trump was under investigation for conspiracy.

The Obama admin had decided NOT to give Trump a full briefing on the Steele dossier. Comey just told him about the pee tape stuff.