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Any Amendments you'd like to see repealed?

How are either of those statements indicative of hatred? Also, I said nothing about capability.



"X is not the business of Y"=/="Y cannot be trusted to do X"

It's a matter of proper roles. I don't approve of elections in the first place, but if they do exist the vote should be restricted to men. Because women as a general rule should be married, and they can be represented in the process by their husband.

Why do you keep on saying 'hatred'? Your statement is sexist towards women, that is undeniable. It doesn't really matter to me if you're being hateful or not.

Women should be allowed into the political process just like everyone else, which is why they have the ability to vote today, and also the ability to run for political office.

And not all women want to be married.
I'm certainly one of them.
 
"Blacks shouldn't ride in the front of the bus" is NOT a hateful statement ?

Is that what you are saying ?

Yes. How is it one?

Why do you keep on saying 'hatred'? Your statement is sexist towards women, that is undeniable. It doesn't really matter to me if you're being hateful or not.

Because Cisero accused me of hatred. You would know this if you bothered to read.

Women should be allowed into the political process just like everyone else, which is why they have the ability to vote today, and also the ability to run for political office.

Why?

And not all women want to be married.
I'm certainly one of them.

The law should not be made for exceptional cases.
 
Because Cisero accused me of hatred. You would know this if you bothered to read.

If you're talking to Cisero, then address Cisero. Don't try to insult me when I had nothing to do with that.


Because everyone in this country (and in other countries) should have the ability to vote and participate in the political process. And because I believe in giving people the freedom to do whatever they please as long as no one is directly harmed from it. Allowing women to vote and participate in the political process does not harm you in any way shape or form.
 
If you're talking to Cisero, then address Cisero. Don't try to insult me when I had nothing to do with that.

I did. You would know this if you bothered to read.

Because everyone in this country (and in other countries) should have the ability to vote and participate in the political process.

Why?
 
I did. You would know this if you bothered to read.

Then don't misconstrue my argument with his.



Because everyone should have the right to "Life, Liberty, and the Pursuit of Happiness".

We should all let everyone participate in the political process. After all, they are a part of the nation as well.
 
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Then don't misconstrue my argument with his.

I didn't. You would know this if you bothered to read.

Because everyone should have the right to "Life, Liberty, and the Pursuit of Happiness".

What does this have to do with voting?
 
I didn't. You would know this if you bothered to read.
Yes, you did. You would know this if you bothered to read.

What does this have to do with voting?

It has everything to do with with voting. If women want to pursue their own "happiness", which is in their case voting, then they should be able to do so.

And I don't support any group being excluded from the political process. We are all a part of the nation, so we all should be able to decide what happens in our nation.
 
Yes, you did. You would know this if you bothered to read.

No, I did not.

It has everything to do with with voting. If women want to pursue their own "happiness", which is in their case voting, then they should be able to do so.

Why is voting necessary for happiness?

And I don't support any group being excluded from the political process. We are all a part of the nation, so we all should be able to decide what happens in our nation.

Why?
 
No, I did not.



Why is voting necessary for happiness?



Why?


]No, I did not.

Whoops. I apologise then.

Why is voting necessary for happiness?

It's not necessary for everyone, but for the overwhelming majority of women they enjoy their right to vote. Shoot, every previously discriminated class in society enjoys their equal rights.


Because we are ALL part of this nation. No select group gets to decide what direction this country takes, or what representatives get elected, without the rest having the ability to participate as well.
 
It's not necessary for everyone, but for the overwhelming majority of women they enjoy their right to vote. Shoot, every previously discriminated class in society enjoys their equal rights.

Why should the law cater to personal desires?

Because we are ALL part of this nation. No select group gets to decide what direction this country takes, or what representatives get elected, without the rest having the ability to participate as well.

Why not?
 
Why should it?



Why is that bad?
Unbelievable.

If you can't understand why discrimination is a terrible thing, then we're done here. I'll go crazy if I continue any longer.

Tootles. [emoji8]
 
Unbelievable.

If you can't understand why discrimination is a terrible thing, then we're done here. I'll go crazy if I continue any longer.

Tootles. [emoji8]

You wouldn't have many rights without discrimination. Just sayin'.

I know that I love discrimination because otherwise I would have to buy from every company and buy one of everything in the store, and that would suck. Plus, I'm not even sure how long it would take to visit all the forums on the internet. You way of thinking would be expensive and time consuming.
 
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Hatred? Meh, probably not. "Hate" has become so overused these days.

Complete lack of respect? Absolutely.

How is it disrespectful?

Unbelievable.

If you can't understand why discrimination is a terrible thing, then we're done here. I'll go crazy if I continue any longer.

Tootles. [emoji8]

Why is discrimination bad?
 
17th: Upsets a proper balance of power. States now get unfunded mandates, and get blackmailed with, "If you don't do what we want, we'll take away your highway money.", because they have no voice to speak for them in Congress. It would not be taking anything away from the people, as they have the House to represent their interests.


Maybe the cold I have is scrambling my brains, but I don't follow. Isn't the 17th Amd. the one to allow the direct popular election of senators, rather than have state party bosses decide who to run for nepostist reasons?**

I was fairly certain that the Highway Fund blackmail has to do with an overly broad Tax & Spend clause, not any amendment. (And I agree it should be limited).



Here's another non-amendment that should be limited: interpretation of Interstate Commerce clause so broad that the federal government can make laws about whether you're allowed to grow pot or wheat in your own backyard.....



EDIT: adding...

**
The Senate of the United States shall be composed of two Senators from each State, elected by the people thereof, for six years; and each Senator shall have one vote. The electors in each State shall have the qualifications requisite for electors of the most numerous branch of the State legislatures.

When vacancies happen in the representation of any State in the Senate, the executive authority of such State shall issue writs of election to fill such vacancies: Provided, That the legislature of any State may empower the executive thereof to make temporary appointments until the people fill the vacancies by election as the legislature may direct.

This amendment shall not be so construed as to affect the election or term of any Senator chosen before it becomes valid as part of the Constitution

**

I don't follow how that's supposed to lead directly to Highway Fund blackmail.
 
the 16th is another one to repeal because it gives the federal government power over the people, "the power to tax is the power to destroy"

when the 16th amendment was made into law, it violated the founding principles set forth for this nation by the declaration of independence, which is that money is property.

with the federal government using a direct tax, it is taking property by FORCE.

If you had your way on this and other points, we'd be stuck with a federal government barely distinguishable from the Articles of Confederation. That might work in a perfect world (a "utopia"), but not in this modern world. For better or worse - and generally worse - the US federal government needs to be strong for this vast country to function as a country. To that it needs to be able to raise vast amounts of money.

If it functioned as a loosely associated federation of mostly autonomous states, we wouldn't be anything like the power we are. We'd also likely succumb to foreign enemies in the future.

(It'd also be pretty dumb to have to distribute tax dollars to the states without regard for population. You'd have people moving to places like ND to retire and do nothing, living off of Alaska-style tax payments to the citizens instead of contributing to society......except the rebates wouldn't be coming from oil surplus money, they'd be coming from CA and NY taxpayers.)



The world at the time of the founding is not the world of 2016.
 
If you had your way on this and other points, we'd be stuck with a federal government barely distinguishable from the Articles of Confederation. That might work in a perfect world (a "utopia"), but not in this modern world. For better or worse - and generally worse - the US federal government needs to be strong for this vast country to function as a country. To that it needs to be able to raise vast amounts of money. If it functioned as a loosely associated federation of mostly autonomous states, we wouldn't be anything like the power we are. We'd also likely succumb to foreign enemies in the future. (It'd also be pretty dumb to have to distribute tax dollars to the states without regard for population. You'd have people moving to places like ND to retire and do nothing, living off of Alaska-style tax payments to the citizens instead of contributing to society......except the rebates wouldn't be coming from oil surplus money, they'd be coming from CA and NY taxpayers.)The world at the time of the founding is not the world of 2016.

how how that be, since the constitutional convention fixed the problemS of the AOC.there is nothing wrong with taxes, its how they are collected thats the problem.

the constitution has not changed as much as you think
 
Maybe the cold I have is scrambling my brains, but I don't follow. Isn't the 17th Amd. the one to allow the direct popular election of senators, rather than have state party bosses decide who to run for nepostist reasons?**

I was fairly certain that the Highway Fund blackmail has to do with an overly broad Tax & Spend clause, not any amendment. (And I agree it should be limited).


Here's another non-amendment that should be limited: interpretation of Interstate Commerce clause so broad that the federal government can make laws about whether you're allowed to grow pot or wheat in your own backyard.....



EDIT: adding...

**
The Senate of the United States shall be composed of two Senators from each State, elected by the people thereof, for six years; and each Senator shall have one vote. The electors in each State shall have the qualifications requisite for electors of the most numerous branch of the State legislatures.

When vacancies happen in the representation of any State in the Senate, the executive authority of such State shall issue writs of election to fill such vacancies: Provided, That the legislature of any State may empower the executive thereof to make temporary appointments until the people fill the vacancies by election as the legislature may direct.

This amendment shall not be so construed as to affect the election or term of any Senator chosen before it becomes valid as part of the Constitution

**

I don't follow how that's supposed to lead directly to Highway Fund blackmail.
Congress passes bills that they want states to follow. Sometimes there is a direct dictate, sometimes it has to be with something of a carrot/stick approach.

Example: Back in the 1980s all the states had varying drinking age laws. Some 21, some 18, and some in between. Congress wanted all states to have 21 as the minimum drinking age. Problem was, Constitutionally they couldn't do it. It would have been struck down and they knew it. So, they used highway money as their carrot. "If you don't raise your drinking age to 21, we'll not give you any highway money." Not all states wanted to comply, but states like their highway money, so all the states complied. Blackmail.

That's just one example. There have been others. And it's not always highway money, but that does seem to be a favorite. This works for unfunded mandates, as well, Congress telling states they have to do something then leaving it up to the state to figure out funding.

Congress, which is the House and Senate combined, does this. Congress is popularly elected. There's no fear of retribution because (theoretically) the people's ox isn't the one being gored. If the Senate were still state appointed, then the Senate could stand up and say, "No!" The Senate would be representing the state's interest, and the people would still have the House. A balance of power. The way it is now, there is no balance of power, so of course the interest with no representation is going to be on the losing end.
 
Congress passes bills that they want states to follow. Sometimes there is a direct dictate, sometimes it has to be with something of a carrot/stick approach.

Example: Back in the 1980s all the states had varying drinking age laws. Some 21, some 18, and some in between. Congress wanted all states to have 21 as the minimum drinking age. Problem was, Constitutionally they couldn't do it. It would have been struck down and they knew it. So, they used highway money as their carrot. "If you don't raise your drinking age to 21, we'll not give you any highway money." Not all states wanted to comply, but states like their highway money, so all the states complied. Blackmail.

That's just one example. There have been others. And it's not always highway money, but that does seem to be a favorite. This works for unfunded mandates, as well, Congress telling states they have to do something then leaving it up to the state to figure out funding.

Congress, which is the House and Senate combined, does this. Congress is popularly elected. There's no fear of retribution because (theoretically) the people's ox isn't the one being gored. If the Senate were still state appointed, then the Senate could stand up and say, "No!" The Senate would be representing the state's interest, and the people would still have the House. A balance of power. The way it is now, there is no balance of power, so of course the interest with no representation is going to be on the losing end.

I suppose I just plain don't agree.

As it is, if the people didn't like being blackmailed, they could get rid of their senators.

Under the old system, if they didn't like being blackmailed, they'd first have to get rid of the state party machine, and hope the new machine would get rid of the senators.



It seems the old system is more cumbersome for this purpose, and both systems are vulnerable to the dangers of a two party system where lobbyists are the ones who actually run congress: if both parties like the blackmailing, the only way to stop it is election of enough third party candidates in enough states willing to probably be 1-termers, who simultaneously break the federal hold and end the blackmailing.
 
I suppose I just plain don't agree.

As it is, if the people didn't like being blackmailed, they could get rid of their senators.

Under the old system, if they didn't like being blackmailed, they'd first have to get rid of the state party machine, and hope the new machine would get rid of the senators.

It seems the old system is more cumbersome for this purpose, and both systems are vulnerable to the dangers of a two party system where lobbyists are the ones who actually run congress: if both parties like the blackmailing, the only way to stop it is election of enough third party candidates in enough states willing to probably be 1-termers, who simultaneously break the federal hold and end the blackmailing.
That's fine. We can disagree.

But, from my vantage point, it is precisely the people who are still getting screwed, and they don't even realize it because they're not taking the time to connect the dots. All this unfunded mandate stuff is still coming back to them to pay for, just via the states instead of federally. It's too easy for Congress to pass feel-good legislation and spend other people's money when there's nobody in-house to fight against it.
 
Yes. How is it one?

I hate to be the one who has to copy/paste a dictionnary, but hey I guess you need it :

verb (used with object), hated, hating.
1.
to dislike intensely or passionately; feel extreme aversion for or extreme hostility toward; detest:


Source : Hate | Define Hate at Dictionary.com

How can one say "I don't want blacks sitting at the front of the bus" & not intensely dislike black people ?
I'm trying really hard to respect your point of view Paleocon, but the more you post, the more you sound intolerant, bigoted, narrow-minded & apathic.
 
How can one say "I don't want blacks sitting at the front of the bus" & not intensely dislike black people ?

By believing they should, but not hating them . . . I don't see the apparent contradiction here.
 
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