Amazon is looking for a 2nd headquarter city, a 'full equal to Seattle'

[Chomsky]

You need to look at the metro population of the city, not just the jurisdictional population. By that measure Atlanta has 6 million or so

Alright, that might be a fair point. I wasn't aware Atlanta was so big with it's suburbs.

But is their adequate public transport supporting the 6M?

 

[Lord Tammerlain]

Bu they are usually companies trying to expand into Canadian markets without realizing that Canadians are not identical to American consumers, but Amazon is already here and pretty successful.

Only a few retailers have failed. Most notably Target.

Target failed because they were not the same Target in the US, but basically a re-branding of Zellars which they bought. They just renovated the stores already existing. Nothing special compared to Walmart, no better cloths, no better prices, smaller stores.

The next was Krispy Kreme

But a second HQ is not trying to sell products like a retailer, it will be taking direction from the main one in Seattle

 

[Hawkeye10]

Bu they are usually companies trying to expand into Canadian markets without realizing that Canadians are not identical to American consumers, but Amazon is already here and pretty successful.

Ya, and they could have Seattle run USA operations and Vancouver say do International so that the different laws and taxes are not ridiculously difficult to overcome. .

WORLD DOMINATION!

 

[Carjosse]

Ya, and they could have Seattle run USA operations and Vancouver say do International so that the different laws and taxes are not ridiculously difficult to overcome. .

WORLD DOMINATION!

The biggest problem with Vancouver is that land is insanely expensive and transportation is poor. Amazon does not really have to deal with trade compliance so there is not much of an issue of having a second HQ in Canada, the only major difference I can see is labour laws not allowing them to have the slave labour they are used to.

 

[faithful_servant]

And your behavior under Obama was, what, respectful and thoughtful?

Always... While I may not have agreed with him on a lot of issues, I NEVER showed the kind of gross disrespect that is being shown to Pres. Trump.

 

[Lord Tammerlain]

The biggest problem with Vancouver is that land is insanely expensive and transportation is poor. Amazon does not really have to deal with trade compliance so there is not much of an issue of having a second HQ in Canada, the only major difference I can see is labour laws not allowing them to have the slave labour they are used to.

It would be an HQ, wages for people employed directly by Amazon would be $75K +. Temp workers from India will still see high wages. The only low paid would be those in food/janitorial positions and those are contracted out

 

[Hawkeye10]

The biggest problem with Vancouver is that land is insanely expensive and transportation is poor. Amazon does not really have to deal with trade compliance so there is not much of an issue of having a second HQ in Canada, the only major difference I can see is labour laws not allowing them to have the slave labour they are used to.

That's true...Wife works at Starbucks, #1 daughter Microsoft, they tell me that the rumours about Amazon Human Eating Culture tend to be true.....but you know what, that is another argument for why they would never end up in Canada at all.

 

[justabubba]

Yeah, Atlanta may be the up & coming underdog challenger. Plus it has Heartsfield.

but it has a terrible transportation system

hope they look closely at my berg. sixth busiest airport in the world. new intermodal rail system from the airport to the charleston harbor. immediate access to two interstate highways and two more 70 minutes away. light rail expansion underway. in an established distribution center with a growing population and a good work ethic

 

[Hawkeye10]

East Coast still very liberal. Texas a bridge too far. Chicago is dying. St Louis is not doing well....seems to be dying. Florida has hurricanes. California forget about it to expensive and headed for a cliff. Salt Lake City...maybe, but how does that help the brand?

I vote Atlanta if they wont take Kansas City.

 

[OlNate]

But you're missing Amazon's point:

They want to go where there's already a talent pool, or areas that talent would desire to locate.

They are not interested in taking time and effort to "build-up" an area, which may or may not even occur.

Ya, fair enough...I think this point in the conversation I was probably going off topic...I tend to do that sometimes, don't mind me. I'm big into the decentralization of work forces, as I think the housing crisis we're facing here is a form of corporate subsidization, forcing people to move where the jobs and infrastructure are, vs. corporations investing in the place where they want to do business, and spreading things out so we don't have a house that would sell for $250 000 in, say, Belleville Ontario, selling for $1 million in Toronto. Some of that is driven by folks wanting to be in a city center, but those prices could be brought more in line if people had the opportunity to work in cheaper areas...there are a lot of benefits to that model, or, more benefits still, in a telecommute where possible model.

And here I go off topic again...

 

[Bucky]

At any rate, the Supreme Court ruled decades ago in a case involving mail-order sales that this is a problem that CONGRESS can fix, and Congress has failed to do their job. Trump can use his bully pulpit if he wants, but it doesn't help when he singles out Amazon, when they now collect sales taxes everywhere that has sales tax.

I have seen the damage Amazon has caused. Good companies like Sears, Macy's, JC Penny, etc... are going under because of Amazon's unfair advantage.

 

[reinoe]

I have seen the damage Amazon has caused. Good companies like Sears, Macy's, JC Penny, etc... are going under because of Amazon's unfair advantage.

You're right: it's not because of those companies refusing to modernize and poor inflexible leadership.

 

[reinoe]

acknowledging that new laws may be required to get the high level of incentives necessary to hold the company’s attention.

Oh nevermind. Amazon wants to **** people in the ass. I guess I was being too hopeful about this being an expansion. It's just a rich guy looking for handouts. Nevermind and I take back what I said about Las Vegas getting in a bid.

 

[ttwtt78640]

https://www.yahoo.com/finance/news/amazon-looking-2nd-headquarter-city-105636241.html



How about chicago?

I am willing to bet that Amazon's true intention is to transfer operations to a new location and not to add a second corporate megaplex. Tech talent is highly paid and thus would likely not be averse to relocating to a state with no state income tax.

 

[reinoe]

I am willing to bet that Amazon's true intention is to transfer operations to a new location and not to add a second corporate megaplex. Tech talent is highly paid and thus would likely not be averse to relocating to a state with no state income tax.

That's actually what dawned on me when I heard about all the negative stories coming from Amazon and also "2nd headquarters" sounds a bit ridiculous but not impossible. Then when I heard about Seattle Passing a new special tax on people with incomes over $250k I kinda rolled my eyes.

 

[Far right dem]

I am willing to bet that Amazon's true intention is to transfer operations to a new location and not to add a second corporate megaplex. Tech talent is highly paid and thus would likely not be averse to relocating to a state with no state income tax.

Maybe but illinois has a flat income tax. You pay the same percentage no matter how much you make. Also it has a lot of tech talent which some of these no income tax states dont have. It would actually be cheaper to find labor in Chicago than somewhere down south. I work as a Java dev in a big tech firm in Chicago and a new girl from arizona who started said wages are higher in Arizona for developers even though the cost of living in Arizona is cheaper. There are less developers there and Chicago is considered a nicer place to live because you don't have to drive 10 miles to get anything.

 

[Far right dem]

. Temp workers from India will still see high wages.

I hate working temp jobs but many kids now a days take advantage of the situation. When their contract is up they just find new jobs for more money. Contract hopping is pretty popular nowadays

 

[Far right dem]

I have seen the damage Amazon has caused. Good companies like Sears, Macy's, JC Penny, etc... are going under because of Amazon's unfair advantage.

I dont think jcpenny is really a competitor to amazon. Kohls is more of a competitor and they are doing fine last time I checked.

 

[Gonzo Rodeo]

Toronto seems to be pretty enthusiastic about it and will probably stop at nothing to see that it does. Montreal would also make sense as the data and tech hub for Eastern Canada with good connections to both Europe and the US as well as dirt cheap electricity and sever hosting. And both offer corporate tax savings.

I read something last year talking about how data farms are starting to consider countries with very cold climates, as the number one expense in a data center is keeping it cool. Just pipe in cold air from the outside.

 

[JasperL]

I have seen the damage Amazon has caused. Good companies like Sears, Macy's, JC Penny, etc... are going under because of Amazon's unfair advantage.

I agree with the basic observation that Amazon and the entire rest of the online selling community enjoyed an "unfair" advantage for many years versus bricks and mortar retailers. What always surprised me is the big companies like you mention weren't able to exert enough pressure to get the law changed. States really took the lead and forced the issue as Congress sat on it's rear end for years, but I never really saw or heard of the big traditional retailers out there pushing to help states get the law changed to eliminate their big disadvantage, and solve the revenue problem for the states.

Congress still needs to fix the problem, with an exemption for small online retailers. The "complexity" argument was legitimate for quite a while. Literally thousands of different sales tax jurisdictions would have made compliance a real problem in the early years, but there were always ways to get around it - e.g. states agreeing to accept a single sales tax rate, statewide, with some way to allocate the tax revenue. Anyway, now there are canned software programs that apparently do a good jobs and companies willing to take on the task for a reasonable fee. Time for Congress to act.

 

[Carjosse]

I read something last year talking about how data farms are starting to consider countries with very cold climates, as the number one expense in a data center is keeping it cool. Just pipe in cold air from the outside.

That is where Quebec is actually a pretty good option as well, the average annual temperature is 4C is the ideal temperature for servers. Quebec also has the cheapest and most eco-friendly electricity in North America to power coolers during the summer.

 

[Carjosse]

I have seen the damage Amazon has caused. Good companies like Sears, Macy's, JC Penny, etc... are going under because of Amazon's unfair advantage.

Those companies just refused to change and adapt to the digital era instead trying to focus on their physical stores and especially in the case of Sears exceptionally poor management. Amazon won because it embraced the internet.

 

[Bucky]

Those companies just refused to change and adapt to the digital era instead trying to focus on their physical stores and especially in the case of Sears exceptionally poor management. Amazon won because it embraced the internet.

Sears CEO is brilliant. I could see Sears rebound big time.

 

[JasperL]

Those companies just refused to change and adapt to the digital era instead trying to focus on their physical stores and especially in the case of Sears exceptionally poor management. Amazon won because it embraced the internet.

I agree with that for the most part but the bottom line is it's ridiculous that a local mom and pop or Sears in my area has to charge and collect 9.25% sales tax on every purchase, but I can buy the same thing online and evade the tax. So online merchant starts with a 9.25% price advantage because the system encourages tax fraud. I still OWE the tax but no state enforced it except in big purchases like cars or furniture.

A friend owned a fly shop and he was killed by it. Guys would come in his store, try out 6 different top-end rods he had in stock, decide which one they wanted, then go home and buy it online and save $40-50 in sales tax, another $30 on the expensive reel and pay $10 in shipping. He knew it happened because guys would come in later with a brand new rod, and pay him a pittance to to install the backing and the fly line. So he makes $3 on the sale instead of $400 or whatever, and those occasional big sales is what he HAD to have to stay in business. The tax system shouldn't provide online retailers that kind of advantage over local businesses hiring local people and keeping the money in the local economy.

I've had discussions with others who say, "Well, that guy should have embraced the Internet!" Possibly true, but irrelevant. What he should be able to do is compete on a level playing field with online retailers and the best one win without the government providing one side with a nearly 10% pricing head start.

 

[Carjosse]

Sears CEO is brilliant. I could see Sears rebound big time.

Sears is pretty much a lifeless corpse, it has been on the decline for longer than I have been alive due to its amazingly poor management. Management refused to change, it failed to compete with the likes of Wal-Mart and department stores then failed to change and compete with Amazon. Whether you like it or not the world changes, technology marches on.