Again, why Medicare for All would never work

[rahl]

1. You are welcome to provide the research on survival rates with lung cancer refuting my cited research.
2. Sure it does . As my citation shows
And it matters if you are waiting for elective surgery.
3. Depends on your definition of “ better”.
If you don’t have insurance in the us? Absolutely. If you have Medicare or Medicaid ?
You are better off here. If you have private insurance”. Mostly you are better off here.
4. Not better care. If they did , issues with like cancer wouldn’t be found or increase wait times for elective surgeries like a total shoulder wouldn’t be found now would they.?

You don’t really have a response now do you.?

Single payer systems provide better care than US system at a fraction of the cost. Sorry.

 

[jaeger19]

Single payer systems provide better care than US system at a fraction of the cost. Sorry.

If so why are they so less timely and have less success with cancer treatment?

Hmmm. lol.
Facts over mantras

 

[rahl]

Well it would in that lowered reimbursement would speed up facilities including hospitals closing and reduce the number of physicians and other healthcare providers .

No it wouldn’t.

That would decrease the timeliness and perhaps the quality of care.

Single payer systems provide better care than we have, and at a fraction of the cost.

 

[Citizen]

Well it would in that lowered reimbursement would speed up facilities including hospitals closing and reduce the number of physicians and other healthcare providers .

That would decrease the timeliness and perhaps the quality of care.

But you have no facts on that. That is just speculation on your part

 

[rahl]

If so why are they so less timely and have less success with cancer treatment?

They don’t.

Hmmm. lol.
Facts over mantras

Facts show single payer systems provide better care at a fraction of our cost.

 

[jaeger19]

No it wouldn’t.

Single payer systems provide better care than we have, and at a fraction of the cost.

Why not? Why do you think while facilities are already closing due to reduce reimbursement,
Reducing reimbursement won’t speed up the process.
?

2. Your opinion was noted and refuted.
Unless you care to address the fact that the us does better with cancer treatments and timeliness of care?
lol.

 

[jaeger19]

But you have no facts on that. That is just speculation on your part

No I do.

700+ rural hospitals at risk of closing​

Financial challenges, like low reimbursement rates, are putting pressure on small hospitals.

700+ rural hospitals at risk of closing

Financial challenges, like low reimbursement rates, are putting pressure on small hospitals.

www.healthcare-brew.com

How Much More Than Medicare Do Private Insurers Pay? A Review of the Literature | KFF

This brief reviews findings from recent studies that compare Medicare and private health insurance payment rates for both hospital and physician services.

www.kff.org

• Private insurers paid nearly double Medicare rates for all hospital services (199% of Medicare rates, on average), ranging from 141% to 259% of Medicare rates across the reviewed studies.
• The difference between private and Medicare rates was greater for outpatient than inpatient hospital services, which averaged 264% and 189% of Medicare rates overall, respectively.
• For physician services, private insurance paid 143% of Medicare rates, on average, ranging from 118% to 179% of Medicare rates across studies.

 

[jaeger19]

They don’t.

Facts show single payer systems provide better care at a fraction of our cost.

My citation show they do.

Facts show that your mantra. No marter how often you repeat it isn’t as accurate as you believe.

 

[Citizen]

No I do.

700+ rural hospitals at risk of closing​

Financial challenges, like low reimbursement rates, are putting pressure on small hospitals.

700+ rural hospitals at risk of closing

Financial challenges, like low reimbursement rates, are putting pressure on small hospitals.

www.healthcare-brew.com

They don’t risk closing because of Medicare. Rural hospitals are closing primarily due to financial instability, exacerbated by low reimbursements from insurance plans and high operational costs.Other factors contributing to closures include staffing shortages, declining patient volumes, and regulatory barriers

 

[rahl]

Why not?

Same reason they aren’t closed in every other first world nation.

Why do you think while facilities are already closing due to reduce reimbursement,
Reducing reimbursement won’t speed up the process.
?

Same reason they aren’t closed in every other first world nation.

2. Your opinion was noted and refuted.

I haven’t offered an opinion.

Unless you care to address the fact that the us does better with cancer treatments and timeliness of care?
lol.

We don’t.

 

[rahl]

My citation show they do.

No it doesn’t.

Facts show that your mantra. No marter how often you repeat it isn’t as accurate as you believe.

Single payer systems provide better care at a fraction of our cost. We know this empirically. Nobody cares that you don’t like reality.

 

[jaeger19]

Same reason they aren’t closed in every other first world nation.

Same reason they aren’t closed in every other first world nation.

I haven’t offered an opinion.

We don’t.

1. Hmm. Please explain. If they are closing now due to lower reimbursement , why won’t they close with even lower reimbursement?

Magic? Lmao.

As an aside to the people following this thread.
You can now see how the left side is as intractable and devoid of reality as the right is.

 

[rahl]

1. Hmm. Please explain. If they are closing now due to lower reimbursement , why won’t they close with even lower reimbursement?

Same reason they don’t close in every other first world nation with single payer.

Magic? Lmao.

No, reality.

As an aside to the people following this thread.
You can now see how the left side is as intractable and devoid of reality as the right is.

We know empirically single payer systems provide better care at a fraction of the cost. Sorry.

 

[jaeger19]

Same reason they don’t close in every other first world nation with single payer.

No, reality.

We know empirically single payer systems provide better care at a fraction of the cost. Sorry.

1. Great . Please explain in detail. They are closing now due to lower reimbursement , o when it drops lower why won’t they then close.
Give some details of exactly why,

2, see above.

3. Empirically we know that wait times for surgery are longer and we treat things like cancer better.

 

[rahl]

1. Great . Please explain in detail. They are closing now due to lower reimbursement ,

No they aren’t.

o when it drops lower why won’t they then close.

Same reason they don’t close in every other first world nation with single payer.

Give some details of exactly why,

I did.

2, see above.

Refuted above.

3. Empirically we know that wait times for surgery are longer

No they aren’t.

and we treat things like cancer better.

No we don’t.

 

[aociswundumho]

I don't believe anyone is advocating "free no copay", no deductible insurance on a walk-in basis. Medicare is not that; nor would Medicare for all be that.

Bernie's plan was exactly that:

1. Create a Medicare for All, single-payer, national health insurance program to provide everyone in America with comprehensive health care coverage, free at the point of service.

2. No networks, no premiums, no deductibles, no copays, no surprise bills.

3. Medicare coverage will be expanded and improved to include: include dental, hearing, vision, and home- and community-based long-term care, in-patient, and out-patient services, mental health and substance abuse treatment, reproductive and maternity care, prescription drugs, and more.

4. Stop the pharmaceutical industry from ripping off the American people by making sure that no one in America pays over $200 a year for the medicine they need by capping what Americans pay for prescription drugs under Medicare for All.

Bernie's plan would also expand benefits way beyond current medicare.

Sorry, but the one area the government seems far to superior to private industry is in the management of health insurance systems. The US spends 50% more on this than any other country, yet has the poorest outcomes in the 1st world.

We are already about half way to single payer:

https://kffhealthnews.org/morning-b...riven-by-baby-boomers-shifting-into-medicare/

Do you really think having the government pay the other half is going to improve anything?

 

[noonereal]

Weird how every other civilized country has universal healthcare in some fashion..but somehow it just isn’t possible here.

Agree but it is true.

The Healthcare industry needs to be turned on it's head before Healthcare for all is possible.

 

[eohrnberger]

I'm not aware of anyone ever suggesting implementation of an NHS in the U.S.

Perhaps not by name, but aren't some purporting that 'Single Payer Healthcare', i.e. government controlled healthcare, is the path the nation should take?

 

[Lex Talionis]

Coming to the USA as a foreigner, it's been clear to me that healthcare here cares little for prevention, and more about managing the illness or disease.

 

[jaeger19]

No they aren’t.

Same reason they don’t close in every other first world nation with single payer.

I did.

Refuted above.


No they aren’t.

No we don’t.

You do you. Lmao

 

[MAGAnificent]

I am the one providing scientific articles , objective research, .

Cherry picked articles and not necessarily objective.

You are the one using twitterx as your source.

You are making it up as you go along. I do have an X account, however I rarely access it, when it was named Twitter or since. I have posted there maybe twice in the last 10 years. I have not been on the site at all in the year 2025. Understand?

Using opinion from right wingers and you are the one that’s stated that they refuse to read just 28 pages to better understand Medicare.

Face it. You don’t know what you are talking about when it comes to Medicare , medical research etc.

Projection.

And frankly you’ve made it clear you don’t want to know. It makes you uncomfortable to realize you are being lied to by your masters.

More silly projection. You are just frustrated that not everyone takes your positions as the last word, just because you claim to be in the medical profession. The "your masters" angle is simply juvenile.

 

[rahl]

You do you. Lmao

I’m sorry you don’t like reality.

 

[dockside]

Because of CAPITALISM. Geezus ****.




They also lack affordable preventative care.



BECAUSE OF CAPITALISM.


Less people die or go bankrupt from medical bills, have a longer and healthier life.



Translation: The rich don't get to cut in line.



Doctors are prevented from practicing in America in some part because they need to restrict access, not because there aren't enough doctors.



See above.



Not for urgent care. Urgent care gets taken care of very quickly.



Conservative Think funded by the Heritage Foundation have confirmed that Medicare For All would save enormous money.

'A conservative think tank, the Mercatus Center, has admitted that Medicare for All could save the U.S. at least $2 trillion over a decade. However, their study also suggests that the federal government would face an additional cost of nearly $33 trillion more than the current system, assuming significant savings in administrative costs and drug prices, and reduced reimbursement rates to health care providers.'

Do you know what the administrative cost is on Medicare? 3 cents on every dollar. For private insurance? 18 cents.

Medical schools are not enlarging, thereby graduating the same number of doctors they did 30 years ago. But, the population of the US has increased and unhealthy practices (i.e., eating too much, eating non-nutritive "food", not getting enough exercise) have also increased. And, the multitude of insurance companies takes up so much time and expense for medical practitioners that the cost of medical care increases and the time available to treat patients decreases. I saw a documentary a couple of years ago about hospitals in Maryland. One hospital had 32 people on staff just to make claims to the thousands of different medical insurers. What a great system!! /s

 

[jaeger19]

Cherry picked articles and not necessarily objective.

You are making it up as you go along. I do have an X account, however I rarely access it, when it was named Twitter or since. I have posted there maybe twice in the last 10 years. I have not been on the site at all in the year 2025. Understand?



Projection.

More silly projection. You are just frustrated that not everyone takes your positions as the last word, just because you claim to be in the medical profession. The "your masters" angle is simply juvenile.

1. No cherry picking by me. You are of course welcome to provide your own scientific research that refutes me.
So far,,,,
2. i understand that you repeat the far right wing memes continuously.
3. You need to look up what projection means. You are using it incorrectly.

No frustration on my part. Believe me , the frustration came when I watched people go on ventilators and die from covid because they believed the right wing when it told them lies about Covid and vaccines.

What else could I call the people who dictate what you believe . You freely admit that you aren’t going to read even a 28 page paper to understand Medicare.
Masters seems to fit.

 

[MAGAnificent]

2. i understand that you repeat the far right wing memes continuously.

Projectgion.

3. You need to look up what projection means. You are using it incorrectly.

I know what it means and you are projecting your ass off.

No frustration on my part.

Alot of frustration on your part.

Believe me , the frustration came when I watched people go on ventilators and die from covid because they believed the right wing when it told them lies about Covid and vaccines.

My bet is most of them died from the first two very deadly variants, many of them before the vaccines became available. And though you are too much of a partisan librul to admit it, the first public anti-vaxxers were Joe Biden and Kamala Harris.

What else could I call the people who dictate what you believe . You freely admit that you aren’t going to read even a 28 page paper to understand Medicare.
Masters seems to fit.

Just more projection. The "Your masters" angle is a poster boy example of projection and your own frustration. And again, no, I am not going to read a 28 page pdf file to prove to you that I understand Medicare. While I do not have an insurance broker level of Medicare, I do have a basic understanding of it, as I consulted a professional insurance broker who specializes in Medicare before deciding whether or not to accept Part B. I know how it works. I also know that congress critters have been dipping into the trust funds since the early 1980s, which is the biggest single reason SS and Medicare are on financially shaky ground.