You brought this gun debate on yourselves conservatives.

[Bonzai]

Hey Bonz, hope you didn't go to war with my fellow Houstonian after I left last night...

I do know how you love southerners.

Oh, General Wayno, you do go on so.................................

 

[Wayno]

CHICAGOLAND: Boy, 12, Armed With Replica Gun Robs 11-Year-Old At School...


Time to ban toy guns, too............

 

[Bonzai]

CHICAGOLAND: Boy, 12, Armed With Replica Gun Robs 11-Year-Old At School...


Time to ban toy guns, too............

Human beings need to give serious thought to the world in which they'd like to live..........................

 

[sangha]

DUH-like the street. how are you going to get black market sales to do background checks

Most of the guns on the street were purchased legally without a BCG

 

[sangha]

I guess the fact that any improper USE of a firearm is already extremely illegal. You get mandatory jail time in both the federal and most state systems for even possessing a firearm in many felonies

But selling a gun to a felon is NOT illegal at all.

 

[TurtleDude]

Most of the guns on the street were purchased legally without a BCG

again you don't know that. many guns on the street were stolen from those who did buy them after a BGC. of course guns more than 20 years old-you are correct since there were no federal BGC then

and if a criminal bought a gun even without a BGC that was still illegal

 

[TurtleDude]

But selling a gun to a felon is NOT illegal at all.

depends on what you know.

and the felon is breaking the law by

buying the gun

possessing the gun


attempting to possess the gun

 

[Wayno]

Human beings need to give serious thought to the world in which they'd like to live..........................

No doubt........

This is what happens when liberals set out to destroy families, to keep people on their plantation.....

 

[sangha]

again you don't know that. many guns on the street were stolen from those who did buy them after a BGC. of course guns more than 20 years old-you are correct since there were no federal BGC then

and if a criminal bought a gun even without a BGC that was still illegal

Many <> most

But it doesn't matter if it's many or most. A whole lot of weapon sales to felons could be stopped if BCGs were required for every sale. Not all sales to felons would be stopped, but many would.

And yes, it is illegal for a felon to buy a gun, but it's not illegal to sell a gun to a felon. Requiring BCG's on all sales would greatly reduce the # of sales to people who are felons

 

[sangha]

depends on what you know.

Exactly!

*Knowingly* selling a weapon to a felon is a crime; not merely selling a weapon to a felon. SO all the seller has to do is say "I did not know he was a felon"

As you have pointed out endlessly, the buyer is a criminal so the fact that his buying a gun is a crime is no deterrence to him (the buyer). However, the seller, who is *not* a criminal, will be deterred from selling the weapon if a BCG is required because then, the seller would not be able to claim that he did not know the buyer was a felon.[/quote]

and the felon is breaking the law by buying the gun

Again, the felon is a criminal, who is not deterred by it being a crime. The seller is not a criminal, so the seller will be deterred from completing the sale if he is required to perform a BCG

Without a seller, the buyer can't buy a gun

 

[Bonzai]

No doubt........

This is what happens when liberals set out to destroy families, to keep people on their plantation.....

Um. Wayno, no one is ever going to destroy the "family". Any more than anyone is going to eliminate the choice of who's on top and who's on bottom...............................

 

[joko104]

It is the gun controllers who brought on these issues by incessantly advertising "gun free zones" and convincing schools to be unable to defend children and colleges to disarm students and overall convincing people not to worry, the police are everywhere and will protect you. This gun debate is due to the slaughters brought on by the gun controllers and media hounds and laws preventing and convincing people not to be able to protect each other and themselves.

 

[joko104]

Machine guns have existed such as in the 50 round Thompson machine gun when anyone could buy one, no background checks and not limites - but NO stories of mass killing shootings of children, people in restaurants etc. But, then, there was NO anti-gun sentiment.

Thus, we know it is NOT the firearms. A modern 30 round magazine is less than a 1920 50 round Thompson canister. Therefore, we have to look at the anti-gun media and liberal message - combined with the extreme if not incessant presentations of violence on the media itself - the same people who preach against guns.

 

[TurtleDude]

Many <> most

But it doesn't matter if it's many or most. A whole lot of weapon sales to felons could be stopped if BCGs were required for every sale. Not all sales to felons would be stopped, but many would.

And yes, it is illegal for a felon to buy a gun, but it's not illegal to sell a gun to a felon. Requiring BCG's on all sales would greatly reduce the # of sales to people who are felons

really? you actually believe that? do you have any clue about illegal narcotics trafficking in the USA?

 

[TurtleDude]

Exactly!

*Knowingly* selling a weapon to a felon is a crime; not merely selling a weapon to a felon. SO all the seller has to do is say "I did not know he was a felon"

As you have pointed out endlessly, the buyer is a criminal so the fact that his buying a gun is a crime is no deterrence to him (the buyer). However, the seller, who is *not* a criminal, will be deterred from selling the weapon if a BCG is required because then, the seller would not be able to claim that he did not know the buyer was a felon.

Again, the felon is a criminal, who is not deterred by it being a crime. The seller is not a criminal, so the seller will be deterred from completing the sale if he is required to perform a BCG

Without a seller, the buyer can't buy a gun[/QUOTE]

and if you know he is a felon and you tend to associate with such people guess what?

 

[sangha]

really? you actually believe that? do you have any clue about illegal narcotics trafficking in the USA?

I know that the rate of addiction to unprescribed narcotics has gone down in most of the country

 

[sangha]

and if you know he is a felon and you tend to associate with such people guess what?

Placing the burden on the govt to prove that the seller knows the buyer was a felon.

WIth BCG's the evidence is evident

 

[TurtleDude]

Placing the burden on the govt to prove that the seller knows the buyer was a felon.

WIth BCG's the evidence is evident

AND AGAIN THOSE WHO know their buyer is a felon or they know the seller is a felon won't conduct the checks and there is nothing in place to enforce them to do so

Indeed it would violate the fifth amendment

 

[TurtleDude]

I know that the rate of addiction to unprescribed narcotics has gone down in most of the country

that wasn't due to making addicts get prescriptions

education is the main reason

the high mortality rates of addicts hasn't hurt either

 

[sangha]

AND AGAIN THOSE WHO know their buyer is a felon or they know the seller is a felon won't conduct the checks and there is nothing in place to enforce them to do so

Indeed it would violate the fifth amendment

Wrong. The law can require them to perform a BCG on all sales, and the govt can enforce the law

 

[sangha]

that wasn't due to making addicts get prescriptions

education is the main reason

the high mortality rates of addicts hasn't hurt either

It wasn't due to any one reason

WHich is why gun safety advocates are calling for a variety of new initiatives

 

[TurtleDude]

Wrong. The law can require them to perform a BCG on all sales, and the govt can enforce the law

how...........

answer tomorrow, I am outta here

we can enforce it on dealers since there is a record of all the guns they receive

how do you know when dave sold bruce a gun that was made 24 years ago? especially if neither one of them plans on telling big brother. bruce shoots a bad guy. the feds do a trace and luckily find out that Dave bought the gun 20 years ago. when did you buy that gun from Dave;

OH 12 years ago

prove otherwise

or if dave and bruce are dope dealers LOL

 

[TurtleDude]

It wasn't due to any one reason

WHich is why gun safety advocates are calling for a variety of new initiatives

is that the new propaganda you get from the VPC-calling restrictions on law abiding gun owners "Gun SAFETY" measures? the anti gunners are generally dishonest but that is the pits

gun safety suggests cutting down on accidents. how does an AWB or a magazine limit increase "safety"

what bogus nonsense

 

[sangha]

how...........

answer tomorrow, I am outta here

we can enforce it on dealers since there is a record of all the guns they receive

how do you know when dave sold bruce a gun that was made 24 years ago? especially if neither one of them plans on telling big brother. bruce shoots a bad guy. the feds do a trace and luckily find out that Dave bought the gun 20 years ago. when did you buy that gun from Dave;

OH 12 years ago

prove otherwise

or if dave and bruce are dope dealers LOL

How???

It's called "legislation".

When Dave sells the gun to Bruce, he has to run a BCG. That's how we know when the gun was sold.

And yes, some sales (of older weapons) will slip by. Again, making the perfect the enemy of the good is unreasonable. Most gun crimes are commited with guns that are less than 20 yo.

 

[joko104]

I know that the rate of addiction to unprescribed narcotics has gone down in most of the country

You know all sorts of untrue "facts."