Would it be better to leave Obamacare alone?

[Greenbeard]

Insurers..... meanwhile rates went up on average of 25%.... people can't afford it.

The tax credits scale with the benchmark premiums. If the benchmarks go up, the tax credits go up. Helping people afford plans.

People are already in "high deductible plans", and what your MSM doesn't tell you, is that not only rates are going up but so are the deductables. all for less coverage and more expensive that what was available prior to ACA.

Again, OOP expenses (including deductibles) are currently capped. What you're proposing is to uncap them so they can be higher. So I don't know why you're complaining that they're high right now.

 

[ReverendHellh0und]

your post is dishonest. most on ACA have subsidized premiums

Do they? can you show me?

 

[ReverendHellh0und]

The tax credits scale with the benchmark premiums. If the benchmarks go up, the tax credits go up. Helping people afford plans.

From what I read is that most are not takine said deductions, don't know about them, etc.

Again, OOP expenses (including deductibles) are currently capped. What you're proposing is to uncap them so they can be higher. So I don't know why you're complaining that they're high right now.

yes, at like 15 grand minimum for a family of 4.


How long can this system last if no one's actually paying for it?

 

[Greenbeard]

From what I read is that most are not takine said deductions, don't know about them, etc.

They're advanceable. You don't wait until April to take them, they're provided through the exchange to reduce your premium when you're buying coverage.

That's why if you play around with the healthcare.gov plan viewer and put in an income eligible for subsidy, you'll see that below the listed premium they show what the full premium was before the tax credit.

yes, at like 15 grand minimum for a family of 4.

How long can this system last if no one's actually paying for it?

It sounds like you keep saying deductibles are too high right now (even though the large majority of people don't choose to buy the plan offerings with the highest deductibles allowed under the law anyway), and yet your expressed policy preferences seem to say they're not high enough.

 

[Mycroft]

With all the kicking and screaming about will or might or won't happen if Obamacare is repealed, would it be better if congress and the administration just stepped back, did nothing at all, and let nature take it's course?

No.

Letting nature take its course is like telling someone with a serious disease or injury...that you caused...that you won't treat them. That you'll just let nature take its course.

 

[Jack Fabulous]

No.

Letting nature take its course is like telling someone with a serious disease or injury...that you caused...that you won't treat them. That you'll just let nature take its course.

I guess what the point of this thread was, was to say that if there is pretty much universal agreement that Obamacare is going to implode unless something is done, why is there so much uproar over people actually attempting to do something?

 

[Mycroft]

I guess what the point of this thread was, was to say that if there is pretty much universal agreement that Obamacare is going to implode unless something is done, why is there so much uproar over people actually attempting to do something?

Oh...

Well, the way I see it, there are various points of view.

1. Those who say it needs to be tossed in the dumper to prevent more damage than it's already caused.

2. Those who want to keep it around, but say it could be tweaked to make it work better.

3. Those who don't want to change a thing.

4. Those who say get rid of it and go to a bigger government takeover.

I fall into number 1. To those who want number 2, I say...if you put lipstick on a pig, it's still a pig (though you might think it's a pretty pig). To those who want number 3, I say...don't be an idiot. To those who go with number 4, I say...why do you hate the American people?

 

[katzgar]

So you want us to take the word of an activist site, citing another activist site?



Obamacare will implode if nothing is done. It is unsustainable, and the myth of "affordable health care" is a horrid lie. People can barely pay for the premiums, nevermind the out of pocket.

give it up dude. it is common knowledge there has been a hiring boom in the health care sector since the ACA was past. catch up.

 

[Jack Fabulous]

give it up dude. it is common knowledge there has been a hiring boom in the health care sector since the ACA was past. catch up.

I can't seem to find any statistical data to either confirm or deny that claim. Do you have any?

 

[poweRob]

It'd be better to make it single payer. Remove people's will to stay alive and be healthy from being a commodity to be preyed upon for money and get the burden off of employers to pay for it.

 

[katzgar]

I can't seem to find any statistical data to either confirm or deny that claim. Do you have any?

yeah, it on the internet. this is from 2014 buy you get the gist. Forbes Welcome

 

[Jack Fabulous]

yeah, it on the internet. this is from 2014 buy you get the gist. Forbes Welcome

Do you realize that this article actually says that healthcare employment has SLOWED DOWN since the passage of Obamacare?

The title... Since Obamacare Passed 50 Months Ago, Healthcare Has Gained Almost 1 Million Jobs

1 million jobs in 50 months. 1 million divided by 50 equals 20,000 jobs per month.


Quoted from the article...

Booming growth in the heath care industry shouldn’t come as a surprise. The health care sector was gaining about 25,000 jobs per month in the years before the Affordable Care Act

Care to rethink that claim?

 

[katzgar]

Do you realize that this article actually says that healthcare employment has SLOWED DOWN since the passage of Obamacare?

The title... Since Obamacare Passed 50 Months Ago, Healthcare Has Gained Almost 1 Million Jobs

1 million jobs in 50 months. 1 million divided by 50 equals 20,000 jobs per month.


Quoted from the article...



Care to rethink that claim?

things are rather simple "Since Obamacare Passed 50 Months Ago, Healthcare Has Gained Almost 1 Million Jobs"

 

[Jack Fabulous]

things are rather simple "Since Obamacare Passed 50 Months Ago, Healthcare Has Gained Almost 1 Million Jobs"

...and in the 50 months prior, healthcare gained 1,250,000 jobs.

See how that works?

 

[katzgar]

...and in the 50 months prior, healthcare gained 1,250,000 jobs.

See how that works?

I'll leave you to your little right wing bubble with this... Healthcare hiring boom will bypass hospitals - Modern Healthcare Modern Healthcare business news, research, data and events

 

[Jack Fabulous]

I'll leave you to your little right wing bubble with this... Healthcare hiring boom will bypass hospitals - Modern Healthcare Modern Healthcare business news, research, data and events

Let me get this straight...

Because I point out that your source does not back up your claim, this means that I "live in a right wing bubble"?


There is a partisan hack here, and it ain't me...

 

[katzgar]

:fart

 

[Mr Person]

With all the kicking and screaming about will or might or won't happen if Obamacare is repealed, would it be better if congress and the administration just stepped back, did nothing at all, and let nature take it's course?

Well, if Trump really wants to replace it with "insurance for everyone", aka single payer, then I can actually agree with him on something.

But chances are he didn't have the slightest clue what he was saying when he said it. Probably just thought it sounded good.

 

[dorsai]

Well, if Trump really wants to replace it with "insurance for everyone", aka single payer, then I can actually agree with him on something.

But chances are he didn't have the slightest clue what he was saying when he said it. Probably just thought it sounded good.

I took that to mean that his plan would have employer provided care, privately provided care, and disaster care of some type for those falling through the cracks. The disaster care (plus possibly a few other benefits) will be much less expensive than plans that have nuns covered for birth control, pre-natal for the elderly, etc.

If the concern, as it was posed 8 years ago, was that families often could not bear the brunt of medical care, the current plans seem to be much more robust than what is needed.

 

[Vern]

With all the kicking and screaming about will or might or won't happen if Obamacare is repealed, would it be better if congress and the administration just stepped back, did nothing at all, and let nature take it's course?

Jack, its not "nature taking its course" when republicans encourage people to not sign up, block the payments in the risk adjustments and not expand Medicaid. And in spite of these attempts to sabotage and undermine Obamacare, it still hasn't "imploded". And fyi, it was supposed to have "imploded" already.

I guess what the point of this thread was, was to say that if there is pretty much universal agreement that Obamacare is going to implode unless something is done, why is there so much uproar over people actually attempting to do something?

jack, not only is there not "universal agreement" that Obamacare will implode, the current uproar is that republicans are not attempting to do anything. They promised you "repeal and replace". Just so you know "repeal and replace" replaced "repeal" when republicans could no longer deny Obamacare was working. The uproar is they are trying to replace "repeal and replace" with "repeal and delay".

 

[Jack Fabulous]

jack, not only is there not "universal agreement" that Obamacare will implode, the current uproar is that republicans are not attempting to do anything. They promised you "repeal and replace". Just so you know "repeal and replace" replaced "repeal" when republicans could no longer deny Obamacare was working. The uproar is they are trying to replace "repeal and replace" with "repeal and delay".

The Republicans aren't attempting to do anything? Gee, that's kind of odd. I'm pretty sure I remember hearing something about bills being passed in both houses that lay the groundwork for repealing the law and I could have sworn that I read about an EO signed by President Trump directing that the personal mandate not be enforced.

 

[Vern]

The Republicans aren't attempting to do anything? Gee, that's kind of odd. I'm pretty sure I remember hearing something about bills being passed in both houses that lay the groundwork for repealing the law and I could have sworn that I read about an EO signed by President Trump directing that the personal mandate not be enforced.

Jack, they definitely started shuffling some papers and opening and closing file cabinets to look busy but they have no plan. Do you at least realize their first "plan" was to propose "repeal and delay"? That caused an uproar from people dependent on Obamacare and actually some republicans. After 6 years, and 3 full years of the exchanges, their first plan was "repeal and delay". shouldn't they have more than what they have by now?

anyhoo, wasn't Obamacare supposed to implode already? You said there was " pretty much universal agreement" it was going to implode. I think there was "pretty much universal agreement" it should have imploded already. And it hasn't imploded yet even thought republicans have been trying to sabotage it and undermine it. Just think how many more people would be have insurance if all states expanded Medicaid and republicans didn't encourage people to not sign up.

 

[Jack Fabulous]

Jack, they definitely started shuffling some papers and opening and closing file cabinets to look busy but they have no plan. Do you at least realize their first "plan" was to propose "repeal and delay"? That caused an uproar from people dependent on Obamacare and actually some republicans. After 6 years, and 3 full years of the exchanges, their first plan was "repeal and delay". shouldn't they have more than what they have by now?

anyhoo, wasn't Obamacare supposed to implode already? You said there was " pretty much universal agreement" it was going to implode. I think there was "pretty much universal agreement" it should have imploded already. And it hasn't imploded yet even thought republicans have been trying to sabotage it and undermine it. Just think how many more people would be have insurance if all states expanded Medicaid and republicans didn't encourage people to not sign up.

The administration has repeatedly said that repealing and replacing Obamacare was top priority and congress has laid the groundwork to do just that. I'll take a "wait and see" approach for now.

 

[Vern]

The administration has repeatedly said that repealing and replacing Obamacare was top priority and congress has laid the groundwork to do just that. I'll take a "wait and see" approach for now.

a truly reasonable response jack. While we "wait and see", could you explain why you think we need to replace Obamacare? the reason I ask is because I think Trumpcare is going to look a lot like Obamacare (if we even get a trumpcare).

 

[Jack Fabulous]

a truly reasonable response jack. While we "wait and see", could you explain why you think we need to replace Obamacare? the reason I ask is because I think Trumpcare is going to look a lot like Obamacare (if we even get a trumpcare).

Trumpcare may well end up looking an awful lot like single payer. As odd as that sounds given the current political make-up in Washington, it wouldn't surprise me if that's where we're headed. It'll be couched in the need to move away from the employer based health insurance model that is "crippling business". I don't necessarily disagree with that, either.