1: Its not supposed to be a parallel to what happened in Iraq- it addresses the ridiculous notion that stating what you think to be the truth as fact is a lieThat nonsense is nothing like what happened.
No, its not. Guessing is different than knowing what you are saying is wrong.
I say again:Guessing is not lying, but guessing and passing it off as fact, is in fact lying. End of story.
I say again:
Yawn.
Me: "Hey -- is Steve across the street?"
You: Having seen Steve just walk across the street "Yep"
Me: "You sure"
You: "yep"
Me: "Great!"
I walk across the street. Steve is not there, having just gotten into his girlfriends car. I walk back to talk to you
Me: "Steve isn't there -- why did you lie to me?"
You: "......... (add words here)
I say again:
Yawn.
Me: "Hey -- is Steve across the street?"
You: Having seen Steve just walk across the street "Yep"
Me: "You sure"
You: "yep"
Me: "Great!"
I walk across the street. Steve is not there, having just gotten into his girlfriends car. I walk back to talk to you
Me: "Steve isn't there -- why did you lie to me?"
You: "......... (add words here)
No need to be vague...
(all quotes valid from 1992 to 2004)
Pres Bill Clinton- "Saddam has WMDs and is a credible threat. Thats why I repeatedly attacked him for 8 years."
Sen Hillary Clinton- "he has them...we know he has them. He has used them. He will use them again. Thats why we have to vote to allow the president to hold him accountable."
Sec State Madeline Albright- "We know he has them. We know he has not accounted for them. We know because we sold them to him. He is a threat. He has used them. He will use them again. Thats why we have to vote to allow the president to hold him accountable."
Sen Tom Daschle- "He has WMDs. He has used WMDs on his people and the Iranians. He is an active threat. Thats why we have to vote to allow the president to hold him accountable."
Clintons Def Sec William Cohen- "He has them. He has lied about them. He has blocked UN inspection teams. We have watched them hold inspection teams at front gates while trucks rolled out the back gate. Then rolled back in after he left. He has failed to comply with UN requirements. Thats why we have to vote to allow the president to hold him accountable."
Damn near every other elected democrat- "He has them. We know he has them. He has used them in the past. He is still a threat. Thats why we have to vote to allow the president to hold him accountable."
George Bush "He has them. There are stockpiles unaccounted for. He is a credible threat"
Mindless liberal ideologues "George Bush lied!"
Does it make you guys feel better if we say George didn't lie, he just made a stupid mistake? I guess for you it's better to be stupid than a liar.
On Sept. 18, 2002, CIA director George Tenet briefed President Bush in the Oval Office on top-secret intelligence that Saddam Hussein did not have weapons of mass destruction, according to two former senior IA officers. Bush dismissed as worthless this information from the Iraqi foreign minister, a member of Saddam’s inner circle, although it turned out to be accurate in every detail. Tenet never brought it up again. Nor was the intelligence included in the National Intelligence Estimate of October 2002, which stated categorically that Iraq possessed WMD.
No one in Congress was aware of the secret intelligence that Saddam had no WMD as the House of Representatives and the Senate voted, a week after the submission of the NIE, on the Authorization for Use of Military Force in Iraq. The information, moreover, was not circulated within the CIA among those agents involved in operations to prove whether Saddam had WMD.
On April 23, 2006, CBS’s “60 Minutes” interviewed Tyler Drumheller, the former CIA chief of clandestine operations for Europe, who disclosed that the agency had received documentary intelligence from Naji Sabri, Saddam’s foreign minister, that Saddam did not have WMD. “We continued to validate him the whole way through,” said Drumheller. “The policy was set. The war in Iraq was coming, and they were looking for intelligence to fit into the policy, to justify the policy.”
Does it make you guys feel better if we say George didn't lie, he just made a stupid mistake? I guess for you it's better to be stupid than a liar.
On Sept. 18, 2002, CIA director George Tenet briefed President Bush in the Oval Office on top-secret intelligence that Saddam Hussein did not have weapons of mass destruction, according to two former senior IA officers. Bush dismissed as worthless this information from the Iraqi foreign minister, a member of Saddam’s inner circle, although it turned out to be accurate in every detail. Tenet never brought it up again. Nor was the intelligence included in the National Intelligence Estimate of October 2002, which stated categorically that Iraq possessed WMD.
No one in Congress was aware of the secret intelligence that Saddam had no WMD as the House of Representatives and the Senate voted, a week after the submission of the NIE, on the Authorization for Use of Military Force in Iraq. The information, moreover, was not circulated within the CIA among those agents involved in operations to prove whether Saddam had WMD.
On April 23, 2006, CBS’s “60 Minutes” interviewed Tyler Drumheller, the former CIA chief of clandestine operations for Europe, who disclosed that the agency had received documentary intelligence from Naji Sabri, Saddam’s foreign minister, that Saddam did not have WMD. “We continued to validate him the whole way through,” said Drumheller. “The policy was set. The war in Iraq was coming, and they were looking for intelligence to fit into the policy, to justify the policy.”
Or how about this as an alternative...it would make me feel just as good if you and all the other ideolgues said..."Bill Clinton, every elected democrat, and George Bush LIED!"
Saddam feared an invasion by Iran. That is why he left a little doubt as to WMDs. The truth is they had been destroyed years ago and he had complied with UN resolutions. He could not show what didn't exist.Well...you COULD start with the actual reason..."Iraqs refusal to comply with UN resolutions regarding accountability and disposition of their WMDs."
..
Its a perfectly good example. By your argument, you lied.That's a horrible example. Steve was across the street when I told you he was.
“The policy was set. The war in Iraq was coming, and they were looking for intelligence to fit into the policy, to justify the policy.”
Recall that may of the quotes ( any many others) came in October 2002 just before the vote to authorize force against Iraq.No need to be vague...
(all quotes valid from 1992 to 2004)
Pres Bill Clinton- "Saddam has WMDs and is a credible threat. Thats why I repeatedly attacked him for 8 years."
Sen Hillary Clinton- "he has them...we know he has them. He has used them. He will use them again. Thats why we have to vote to allow the president to hold him accountable."
Sec State Madeline Albright- "We know he has them. We know he has not accounted for them. We know because we sold them to him. He is a threat. He has used them. He will use them again. Thats why we have to vote to allow the president to hold him accountable."
Sen Tom Daschle- "He has WMDs. He has used WMDs on his people and the Iranians. He is an active threat. Thats why we have to vote to allow the president to hold him accountable."
Clintons Def Sec William Cohen- "He has them. He has lied about them. He has blocked UN inspection teams. We have watched them hold inspection teams at front gates while trucks rolled out the back gate. Then rolled back in after he left. He has failed to comply with UN requirements. Thats why we have to vote to allow the president to hold him accountable."
Damn near every other elected democrat- "He has them. We know he has them. He has used them in the past. He is still a threat. Thats why we have to vote to allow the president to hold him accountable."
George Bush "He has them. There are stockpiles unaccounted for. He is a credible threat"
Mindless liberal ideologues "George Bush lied!"
Its a perfectly good example. By your argument, you lied.
According to the standards of your argument you made a statement of fact that you did know to me true -- and thus, you lied.No I didn't. He was there when I said he was.
According to the standards of your argument you made a statement of fact that you did know to me true -- and thus, you lied.
It was true when you saw him last. But that's now that you told me -- you said he IS there.No, I knew it was true because I saw him there and it was true.
It was true when you saw him last. But that's now that you told me -- you said he IS there.
Thus, according to you, you lied.
Saddam feared an invasion by Iran. That is why he left a little doubt as to WMDs. The truth is they had been destroyed years ago and he had complied with UN resolutions. He could not show what didn't exist.
Supposing facts not in evidence.No lie. He was there when I told you. He left when you went over there.
You -thnk- he lied, but cannot prove it.OK this is enough. I think he lied. You don't think he lied.
He couldn't fully comply with the UN resolutions without showing their destruction.Saddam feared an invasion by Iran. That is why he left a little doubt as to WMDs. The truth is they had been destroyed years ago and he had complied with UN resolutions. He could not show what didn't exist.
I already did.
Actually the vote was not for war, but a vote to shirk their responsibility and allow the president to decide. Just saying . . . . :coffeepap
You dont recall the December 1998 missile and bombing campaign in retalliation for Iraq not living up to its obligations?
Here -- read:
Transcript President Clinton explains Iraq strike - CNN
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