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Why is the average firearm owner, an unsafe gun owner?

Diomedes said:
That's not the only concern. There are other dangers. Most gun owners don't even know how dangerous ricochets are.
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That's incorrect one of the four main rules with firearms is know your Target and what's behind it.

This is you with penetration of the target and ricocheting or possibly damaging something behind the target. This is why for a defensive handguns it's wise to carry hollow points. The increased surface area will slow the bullet down faster within more solid matter.
 
Diomedes said:
That's not the only concern. There are other dangers. Most gun owners don't even know how dangerous ricochets are.
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What’s your evidence for that?
 
Bum said:
:LOL:
I found one incident that corroborates my narrative, so everything I say must be fact....:LOL:
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I killed two doves with one shot, one time. True story. That must mean I killed 50 doves per box of shells.
 
Scatty Kitty said:
That's fair, but it doesn't seem to make sense to me still. Like for example I had a kid once tell me that his parents let him have a firearm when he gets upset to help calm him down. They let him take his hunting rifle to his perch and just sit there with it. They're not uneducated either. One is a well experienced hunter and the other I know has a college education. It doesn't make sense to me why they would let him do it.
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Well----why did intelligent people vote for Trump???? I'll admit that I don't think many with an IQ actually DID vote for him, but.....
Scatty Kitty said:
I get the feeling this will be a reoccurring question in this thread. But do you do the basic safety things I mentioned in the OP?



I don't believe there are millions. I've seen statistics go as high as a tens of thousand, but not millions.
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tshade said:
Well----why did intelligent people vote for Trump????
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They liked what he did in his first term, they found Joe Biden to be profoundly incompetent and Kamala Harris even less competent.
tshade said:
I'll admit that I don't think many with an IQ actually DID vote for him, but.....
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This probably has more to do with your emotional state.
 
tshade said:
Well----why did intelligent people vote for Trump???? I'll admit that I don't think many with an IQ actually DID vote for him, but.....
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I think it's simple, different kinds of IQ lead to different voting patterns.
 
another day goes by .... that my guns stay where I put them and do nothing on their own
 
stealthycat said:
another day goes by .... that my guns stay where I put them and do nothing on their own
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unless you put them in a place they can be stolen, etc...........we need policies that put the gun owner in FULL responsibility for the gun. If that gun is stolen and it was found that you were careless about storage, then YOU should be held liable for whatever that gun is used for...............
 
tshade said:
unless you put them in a place they can be stolen, etc...........
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everyplace can be broken into and things stolen - and don't blame me for being the victim of a robbery, blame the criminals please


tshade said:
we need policies that put the gun owner in FULL responsibility for the gun. If that gun is stolen and it was found that you were careless about storage, then YOU should be held liable for whatever that gun is used for...............
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so hold the victims of crimes accountable for being victims of crimes - gotcha

I'm curious ... do you want to hold all victims of robberies accountable for not having safety measures so high as to eliminate the chance of robbery?


how would you do it ... I'm curious ... to eliminate the ability for someone to rob someone else? what burdens would you put on people? what levels of security is good enough for you ?
 
tshade said:
unless you put them in a place they can be stolen, etc...........we need policies that put the gun owner in FULL responsibility for the gun. If that gun is stolen and it was found that you were careless about storage, then YOU should be held liable for whatever that gun is used for...............
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lol no. The gun owner is a victim of a crime and can’t be held liable for being the victim of a crime. Just like we can’t hold a woman liable for wearing a mini skirt with no panties on for being raped.
 
stealthycat said:
everyplace can be broken into and things stolen - and don't blame me for being the victim of a robbery, blame the criminals please
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Wrong---guns can be safeguarded to a reasonable degree
stealthycat said:
so hold the victims of crimes accountable for being victims of crimes - gotcha
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No----holding those who are IRRESPONSIBLE GUN OWNERS accountable............................guns are to be taken SERIOUSLY
stealthycat said:
I'm curious ... do you want to hold all victims of robberies accountable for not having safety measures so high as to eliminate the chance of robbery?
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gun owners??? usually
stealthycat said:
how would you do it ... I'm curious ... to eliminate the ability for someone to rob someone else? what burdens would you put on people? what levels of security is good enough for you ?
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Most good gun safes/cabinets................not the sissy little wood things----but the solid nasty ones
 
tshade said:
Wrong---guns can be safeguarded to a reasonable degree

No----holding those who are IRRESPONSIBLE GUN OWNERS accountable............................guns are to be taken SERIOUSLY
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So you want to punish people for being victims of theft because they should have stopped the theft?
tshade said:
gun owners??? usually

Most good gun safes/cabinets................not the sissy little wood things----but the solid nasty ones
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So you can't break into a gun cabinet?
 
I have proposed that 100% of the cost of gun safe be deductible from your taxes. Can’t seem to get any gun control folks to support that though.
 
JMB1911A1 said:
I have proposed that 100% of the cost of gun safe be deductible from your taxes. Can’t seem to get any gun control folks to support that though.
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I have proposed that a built in gun safe be mandatory in all new constructed dwellings, and retro-fitted to older dwellings when they come on the market.

The gun control folks certainly haven't been enthusiastic about that either. All I can conclude is that they don't think guns safes actually save any lives, or they don't care if gun safes save any lives.
 
RF667799 said:
I have proposed that a built in gun safe be mandatory in all new constructed dwellings, and retro-fitted to older dwellings when they come on the market.

The gun control folks certainly haven't been enthusiastic about that either. All I can conclude is that they don't think guns safes actually save any lives, or they don't care if gun safes save any lives.
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It is almost like they really don’t want to compromise at all. Their way or the highway.
 
RF667799 said:
I have proposed that a built in gun safe be mandatory in all new constructed dwellings, and retro-fitted to older dwellings when they come on the market.

The gun control folks certainly haven't been enthusiastic about that either. All I can conclude is that they don't think guns safes actually save any lives, or they don't care if gun safes save any lives.
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Anytime you ask anybody to define what safe storage means they can't. All they know is that whatever you're doing now there needs to be more of a burden on you. And that burden needs to apply to people maybe thinking about buying a firearms and if it's $20 or $20,000 they'll take it.

I would argue if there's no such thing as safe storage every safe every lock is crackable. And I would think making legislation like this would just have a punitive end. Let's see you buy a fancy pants safe for thousands of dollars and you lock your guns up in it or someone breaks into that safe oh you weren't storing your gun safely. So now you need a punishment so that other people considering purchasing guns for the first time think I don't want that to happen to me so I'm not going to do it.

That's the entire purpose that's why they won't say what's safe is
 
tshade said:
Wrong---guns can be safeguarded to a reasonable degree
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I define reasonable as locked in my car or in my house

tshade said:
No----holding those who are IRRESPONSIBLE GUN OWNERS accountable............................guns are to be taken SERIOUSLY
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responsible for being victims of a robbery ?

tshade said:
gun owners??? usually
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why not hold ALL victims of robberies accountable for not having enough safe guards to stop the robbers ?

tshade said:
Most good gun safes/cabinets................not the sissy little wood things----but the solid nasty ones
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I don't have a gun safe in my car

I don't have a gun safe in my bedroom

and if my guns are in my gun safe locked away how can I use them in immediate situations if I need them ?

and do you want all home owners to lock their "weapons" in safes at night? like all your knives and ball bats etc ?
 
stealthycat said:
I define reasonable as locked in my car or in my house


responsible for being victims of a robbery ?
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If the robbery was made too easy, yes
stealthycat said:
why not hold ALL victims of robberies accountable for not having enough safe guards to stop the robbers ?
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many items stolen do not affect the public as stolen guns would..............big diff
stealthycat said:
I don't have a gun safe in my car
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store it in a more responsible place
stealthycat said:
I don't have a gun safe in my bedroom
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then don't store it there
stealthycat said:
and if my guns are in my gun safe locked away how can I use them in immediate situations if I need them ?
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not talking about that.........................stolen when you are away, etc, etc
stealthycat said:
and do you want all home owners to lock their "weapons" in safes at night? like all your knives and ball bats etc ?
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it does not apply if the adult is there being responsible for the gun
 
tshade said:
If the robbery was made too easy, yes
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So, blaming the victim. Was her skirt too short?
tshade said:
many items stolen do not affect the public as stolen guns would..............big diff
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Theft is theft.
tshade said:
store it in a more responsible place
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In your vehicle or house is a responsible place.
tshade said:
then don't store it there

not talking about that.........................stolen when you are away, etc, etc

it does not apply if the adult is there being responsible for the gun
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tshade said:
unless you put them in a place they can be stolen, etc...........we need policies that put the gun owner in FULL responsibility for the gun. If that gun is stolen and it was found that you were careless about storage, then YOU should be held liable for whatever that gun is used for...............
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Depends on what you mean by that.

Can and should gun owners be held, at least in some respect civilly liable for acts that reach tort status in their failure to maintain access to their gun(s) by third parties that do harm with them? Probably so.

Should that be a criminal liability when they can't know the intentions of the third party involved if the gun was stolen or, more importantly, be held responsible for criminal actions when they themselves had no "mens rea"? Likely not.
 
ModernDiogenes said:
Depends on what you mean by that.

Can and should gun owners be held, at least in some respect civilly liable for acts that reach tort status in their failure to maintain access to their gun(s) by third parties that do harm with them? Probably so.

Should that be a criminal liability when they can't know the intentions of the third party involved if the gun was stolen or, more importantly, be held responsible for criminal actions when they themselves had no "mens rea"? Likely not.
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with guns it should be assumed that they are stolen to do harm................gun owners need to be liable when found careless..........
 
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