Why do we listen to the UN when it comes to human rights?

[NatMorton]

Ah-huh.....no permanent member of the UN Security Council stands the remotest chance of EVER being a second class member. So again...its a MOOT POINT.

As for keep our own counsel, based on what...our sterling record of Human Rights?

It was a hypothetical. Geesh.

Yes, even with our faults our human rights record is as good, or better, than any nation in history.

 

[jnug]

It was a hypothetical. Geesh.

Yes, even with our faults our human rights record is as good, or better, than any nation in history.

In history....wrong again.

Try the Netherlands, Denmark, Finland, New Zealand, even Canada if you want to stay in this hemisphere has a better Human Rights record than the US. Those are just noted highlights of the list of countries with a better Human Rights record than the US. Now if we would get our act together and walk the walk of the talk from our Founding Documents, that might be a different story. But since Fat Donald knocked us back 50-100 years closer to the stone ages, we are far behind on that score.

 

[NatMorton]

In history....wrong again.

Try the Netherlands, Denmark, Finland, New Zealand, even Canada if you want to stay in this hemisphere has a better Human Rights record than the US. Those are just noted highlights of the list of countries with a better Human Rights record than the US. Now if we would get our act together and walk the walk of the talk from our Founding Documents, that might be a different story. But since Fat Donald knocked us back 50-100 years closer to the stone ages, we are far behind on that score.

Sorry, didn’t realize I was dealing with a case of TDS. My error.

 

[Aunt Antifa]

While this OP is not about Israel, recently threads about the current Israel/Hamas hostilities got me thinking. Often in such discussions someone will chime in with the UN's record of condemning Israel for human rights violations. Okay, but it begs a question, why do we see the UN as an authority on which nations have crossed some human rights line?

I suppose it's natural to look at the UN as the world's parliament thus the UN's actions can be seen as those of a "global democracy." But here's the thing, Wikipedia has a handy list of UN members categorized by their form of government (source: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_..._of_government#UN_member_states_and_observers) and that list confirms that 56% of the members of the UN are representing authoritarian governments. These are countries like Iraq, China, Cuba, Ethiopia, Sudan, Belarus, etc.

So I ask the question again, why should we take heed of an organization like the UN -- with a majority of members representing authoritarian regimes -- when it comes to issues on human rights?

One might as well give Team Trump the final say on election reform.

Why are we an authority by your own logic? We have a long and brutal history of terrorism, violent overthrows of governments, and assassinations.

Yipes.

 

[Aunt Antifa]

Sorry, didn’t realize I was dealing with a case of TDS. My error.

You know they have NOOOOOTHING when “TDS” is wheeled out.

 

[jnug]

Sorry, didn’t realize I was dealing with a case of TDS. My error.

The US did not have a great Human Rights record before Fat Donald. Then he decided to rip children from the arms of their parents with no plan nor even the intent of reuniting them.

Some means are acceptable to achieve an end. I for one believe that punitive measure at the border are valid as long as they are a part of an overarching plan designed to really deal with what brings people to the border in the first place. Not only did Fat Donald have no plan for reuniting families he had separated nor even the intent to do same, he stripped out programs we had designed to keep people from coming North in the first place.

So whatever credibility we had on Human Rights that was left after centuries of Slavery followed by decades of apartheid, Donnie stripped away in his four riotous years of drunken rights violation orgy sponsored by Herr Stephen Miller. But of course Trumpers reveled in it. DUMBASSES!!!

 

[NatMorton]

The US did not have a great Human Rights record before Fat Donald. Then he decided to rip children from the arms of their parents with no plan nor even the intent of reuniting them.

Some means are acceptable to achieve an end. I for one believe that punitive measure at the border are valid as long as they are a part of an overarching plan designed to really deal with what brings people to the border in the first place. Not only did Fat Donald have no plan for reuniting families he had separated nor even the intent to do same, he stripped out programs we had designed to keep people from coming North in the first place.

So whatever credibility we had on Human Rights that was left after centuries of Slavery followed by decades of apartheid, Donnie stripped away in his four riotous years of drunken rights violation orgy sponsored by Herr Stephen Miller. But of course Trumpers reveled in it. DUMBASSES!!!

I recommend a 12 step program.

 

[jnug]

I recommend a 12 step program.

That is not an answer. Typical Rightie whimpering away in defeat more like it. I would add embarrassment but since Righties are now as Shameless as Donnie, embarrassment is not in the realm of possibility.

 

[diz]

Ah-huh.....no permanent member of the UN Security Council stands the remotest chance of EVER being a second class member. So again...its a MOOT POINT.

As for keep our own counsel, based on what...our sterling record of Human Rights?

The inevitability of this topic leading to bashing on the USA is so incredibly high.

What countries would you say have done the most for the cause of individual rights in the last few centuries?

 

[jnug]

The inevitability of this topic leading to bashing on the USA is so incredibly high.

What countries would you say have done the most for the cause of individual rights in the last few centuries?

Of course the Right tries to find SOME PAST CENTURY it could make a case for. Good luck with that bogus argument. How far back do you want to go....the 14th Century...how about 200BC...does that suit your fancy. The US has only been around since the late 18th Century. No need to go back farther than that.

Lets see:
- US started in Chattel Slavery and remained so till 1865.
- Then completely usurped and erased the Reconstruction
- that led to Jim Crow and 80 years of apartheid
- and Fat Donald tops it off by ripping children from the arms of their parents with no intention of reuniting broken families, the literal duplicate of the Chattel Slavery Family perspective adopted by Slavers here. In the meantime Fat Donnie defunded even our faulty effort to keep migrants in the Northern Triangle. Herr Miller's hold them by the nose while we kick them in the ass program

So you can busy yourself seeing how many countries have a worse record over the same time period. I am sure there are some with a record as bad. SO WHAT. Is that the bar you want to set? You don't have to answer that. I know the answer is YES! There is surely one that is worse......Germany....family Drumpf's Fatherland. The Donnie apple did not fall far from that tree now did it!

 

[ataraxia]

The inevitability of this topic leading to bashing on the USA is so incredibly high.

What countries would you say have done the most for the cause of individual rights in the last few centuries?

Yes, that included the spearheading the Universal Declaration of Human Rights back in 1948 after WWII. These included the rights to food, clean water, shelter, a basic education, and access to healthcare. That is why seeing those ideas so under siege now right back here at home with the rise of Trumpism with things like an appeal to social Darwinism, survival of the fittest, and freedom of the jungle now seems so un-American.

 

[ataraxia]

It was a hypothetical. Geesh.

Yes, even with our faults our human rights record is as good, or better, than any nation in history.

Earlier, you had said you support the idea of human rights. Something tells me that was just tongue-in-cheek, amiright?

 

[Nickyjo]

Same reason we listen to Trump when he says he is patriotic, yet trashes American ideals. Flawed humans and institutions abound in the world.

 

[Deuce]

All well and good, but when a matter comes before the UN about whether one nation is or isn't living up to this declaration, doesn't the UN's decision lose credibility when the likes of North Korea and Chad are allowed to vote on it?

Does your opinion of human rights changed based on how North Korea votes?

 

[Fishking]

While this OP is not about Israel, recently threads about the current Israel/Hamas hostilities got me thinking. Often in such discussions someone will chime in with the UN's record of condemning Israel for human rights violations. Okay, but it begs a question, why do we see the UN as an authority on which nations have crossed some human rights line?

I suppose it's natural to look at the UN as the world's parliament thus the UN's actions can be seen as those of a "global democracy." But here's the thing, Wikipedia has a handy list of UN members categorized by their form of government (source: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_..._of_government#UN_member_states_and_observers) and that list confirms that 56% of the members of the UN are representing authoritarian governments. These are countries like Iraq, China, Cuba, Ethiopia, Sudan, Belarus, etc.

So I ask the question again, why should we take heed of an organization like the UN -- with a majority of members representing authoritarian regimes -- when it comes to issues on human rights?

One might as well give Team Trump the final say on election reform.

We shouldn't. They've had Saudi Arabia sitting on the UN's Human Rights Counsel before, demonstrating it to be an utter joke.

 

[jnug]

I am ashamed to say that I forgot to add the genocide committed on Native Americans in this Hemisphere to post #35 and since we are discussing the record of the United States specifically in this country.

There were between 4 and 4.5 Million Native Americans living in what became the contiguous 48 states. By 1900 that number had been cut to less than 250,000 in blood lust and land grabs committed during the country's move West. That is a larger proportional reduction than European Jews suffered as a consequence of Hitler's genocide. So by that standard alone we were worse than Hitler's Germany! Add Chattel Slavery, the death of the Reconstruction, Jim Crow and an additional 100 years of apartheid to that plus Fat Donnie adding the final touches in the last four years in his entirely punitive fracturing of families at the Southern Border and GOOD LUCK arguing for some sort of enviable Human Rights record by the United States.

 

[diz]

Of course the Right tries to find SOME PAST CENTURY it could make a case for. Good luck with that bogus argument. How far back do you want to go....the 14th Century...how about 200BC...does that suit your fancy. The US has only been around since the late 18th Century. No need to go back farther than that.

Lets see:
- US started in Chattel Slavery and remained so till 1865.
- Then completely usurped and erased the Reconstruction
- that led to Jim Crow and 80 years of apartheid
- and Fat Donald tops it off by ripping children from the arms of their parents with no intention of reuniting broken families, the literal duplicate of the Chattel Slavery Family perspective adopted by Slavers here. In the meantime Fat Donnie defunded even our faulty effort to keep migrants in the Northern Triangle. Herr Miller's hold them by the nose while we kick them in the ass program

So you can busy yourself seeing how many countries have a worse record over the same time period. I am sure there are some with a record as bad. SO WHAT. Is that the bar you want to set? You don't have to answer that. I know the answer is YES! There is surely one that is worse......Germany....family Drumpf's Fatherland. The Donnie apple did not fall far from that tree now did it!

When you start dismissing individual people “the right” I generally taking as a sign you aren’t good at the whole “individual” thing. The rest of your post confirms it.

Support for Individual rights is not realty about partisan slamming of groups you don’t like. It’s about having principles consistent with individual rights.

 

[jnug]

When you start dismissing individual people “the right” I generally taking as a sign you aren’t good at the whole “individual” thing. The rest of your post confirms it.

Support for Individual rights is not realty about partisan slamming of groups you don’t like. It’s about having principles consistent with individual rights.

Yup, because you act like sheep driven by a mad dog. Principles ...give me a break. Your post is a distraction which is all you boys have. Either contribute something consistent with the thread or find another hobby.

This country has aspirations expressed in its Founding Documents which THE RIGHT appears entirely contrary to because you just don't like how things worked out. The closer we get those aspirations, the more you fight them. Why don't you just find an island, buy it, move there, create a set of founding documents that are consistent with what you aspire to AND knock your minds out!

 

[diz]

Yup, because you act like sheep driven by a mad dog. Principles ...give me a break. Your post is a distraction which is all you boys have. Either contribute something consistent with the thread or find another hobby.

This country has aspirations expressed in its Founding Documents which THE RIGHT appears entirely contrary to because you just don't like how things worked out. The closer we get those aspirations, the more you fight them. Why don't you just find an island, buy it, move there, create a set of founding documents that are consistent with what you aspire to AND knock your minds out!

Ok well you seem to be the one who apropos of nothing gets sparked into partisan rants.

 

[Roadvirus]

We shouldn't. They've had Saudi Arabia sitting on the UN's Human Rights Counsel before, demonstrating it to be an utter joke.

China is currently on the UN's Human Rights Counsel too.

You just can't make this shit up.