Why all states should ban pit bulls

[EMNofSeattle]

I was delighted last month when the Arkansas legislature roundly defeated a bill that would repeal local breed specific laws.

Bill intended to prohibit local bans of specific dog breeds fails in Arkansas House | Northwest Arkansas Democrat-Gazette

A bill intended to bar municipalities from issuing bans targeting specific dog breeds failed to advance from the House on Tuesday.

www.nwaonline.com

This doesn’t go far enough however, because it allows cities to permit people to own these dangerous animals. States should ban them outright.

Pit bulls and any true bulldog or bully breed should be illegal for general ownership as a pet. This is for several reasons

1) they are evolutionary adapted to cause permanent injury and death.

These dogs stem from an English sport called “bull baiting” where dogs would be arranged to kill bulls, as Bull baiting fell out of favor then new blood sports such as dog fighting and ratting emerged, for which bulldogs were crossed with terriers to make a strong and agile dog with a ferocious bite and high pain tolerance. This is the origin of modern pitbulls.

2) pitbulls are the least wanted dog in America, many pitbulls are given to shelters quickly as naive people realize these animals are dangerous. The pit Bull is the most euthanized dog in America and I this overpopulation is in part because insufficient bsl exists to prosecute breeders for making this animals
3) pitbulls are indisputably the most dangerous animals in America, 2/3 of all serious dog attacks on humans and over 90% of serious dog attacks on domesticated animals are from pit bulls, which are less then ten percent of dogs. The next dog after pitbulls are dobermans which are trained to be actual property guard dogs and it’s less than a quarter of pit Bull numbers. https://coloradoinjurylaw.com/dog-b...higher morbidity,than attacks by other breeds.

3) pit bulls have high prey drive, they will attack their own owners, their owners children, their owners parents, sometimes even strangers and they do it without warning. Pit bulls will attack infants for crying because it triggers their prey drive
4) pit bulls have locking jaws which cause serious injury. Lucas County Ohio Dog Warden Tom Skeldon once presented a video in court of a dog that wouldn’t release its grasp on a cable after being tranquilized. Even pit Bull activists recommend carrying “break sticks” to pry the jaws of the dog when it attacks another dog.

5) existing lesser laws are inadequate. Most laws involving dangerous animals are meant to deal with normal dog breeds which are nuisances, not for fatal attacks by dogs like pit bulls. Breed specific laws allow accountability for people who choose to adopt dangerous animals

 

[Phys251]

I was delighted last month when the Arkansas legislature roundly defeated a bill that would repeal local breed specific laws.

Bill intended to prohibit local bans of specific dog breeds fails in Arkansas House | Northwest Arkansas Democrat-Gazette

A bill intended to bar municipalities from issuing bans targeting specific dog breeds failed to advance from the House on Tuesday.

www.nwaonline.com

This doesn’t go far enough however, because it allows cities to permit people to own these dangerous animals. States should ban them outright.

Pit bulls and any true bulldog or bully breed should be illegal for general ownership as a pet. This is for several reasons

1) they are evolutionary adapted to cause permanent injury and death.

These dogs stem from an English sport called “bull baiting” where dogs would be arranged to kill bulls, as Bull baiting fell out of favor then new blood sports such as dog fighting and ratting emerged, for which bulldogs were crossed with terriers to make a strong and agile dog with a ferocious bite and high pain tolerance. This is the origin of modern pitbulls.

2) pitbulls are the least wanted dog in America, many pitbulls are given to shelters quickly as naive people realize these animals are dangerous. The pit Bull is the most euthanized dog in America and I this overpopulation is in part because insufficient bsl exists to prosecute breeders for making this animals
3) pitbulls are indisputably the most dangerous animals in America, 2/3 of all serious dog attacks on humans and over 90% of serious dog attacks on domesticated animals are from pit bulls, which are less then ten percent of dogs. The next dog after pitbulls are dobermans which are trained to be actual property guard dogs and it’s less than a quarter of pit Bull numbers. https://coloradoinjurylaw.com/dog-bite-statistics/#:~:text=Pitbulls are 2.5x more,and 63% of ocular injuries.&text=Pitbull attacks have higher morbidity,than attacks by other breeds.

3) pit bulls have high prey drive, they will attack their own owners, their owners children, their owners parents, sometimes even strangers and they do it without warning. Pit bulls will attack infants for crying because it triggers their prey drive
4) pit bulls have locking jaws which cause serious injury. Lucas County Ohio Dog Warden Tom Skeldon once presented a video in court of a dog that wouldn’t release its grasp on a cable after being tranquilized. Even pit Bull activists recommend carrying “break sticks” to pry the jaws of the dog when it attacks another dog.

5) existing lesser laws are inadequate. Most laws involving dangerous animals are meant to deal with normal dog breeds which are nuisances, not for fatal attacks by dogs like pit bulls. Breed specific laws allow accountability for people who choose to adopt dangerous animals

Ninety-nine percent of the problem is bad owners. I've been around pit bulls that were nothing but nice.

 

[EMNofSeattle]

Ninety-nine percent of the problem is bad owners. I've been around pit bulls that were nothing but nice.

Really? You think the young mother whose adored family pets attacked is responsible for her dog mauling her infant? Well she is for bringing the pit into the home, but this idea that it’s “bad owners” is simply wrong. In most cases these are naive people who’ve adopted these dogs in good faith who end up victimized

 

[PeacefulWarrior]

I was delighted last month when the Arkansas legislature roundly defeated a bill that would repeal local breed specific laws.

Bill intended to prohibit local bans of specific dog breeds fails in Arkansas House | Northwest Arkansas Democrat-Gazette

A bill intended to bar municipalities from issuing bans targeting specific dog breeds failed to advance from the House on Tuesday.

www.nwaonline.com

This doesn’t go far enough however, because it allows cities to permit people to own these dangerous animals. States should ban them outright.

Pit bulls and any true bulldog or bully breed should be illegal for general ownership as a pet. This is for several reasons

1) they are evolutionary adapted to cause permanent injury and death.

These dogs stem from an English sport called “bull baiting” where dogs would be arranged to kill bulls, as Bull baiting fell out of favor then new blood sports such as dog fighting and ratting emerged, for which bulldogs were crossed with terriers to make a strong and agile dog with a ferocious bite and high pain tolerance. This is the origin of modern pitbulls.

2) pitbulls are the least wanted dog in America, many pitbulls are given to shelters quickly as naive people realize these animals are dangerous. The pit Bull is the most euthanized dog in America and I this overpopulation is in part because insufficient bsl exists to prosecute breeders for making this animals
3) pitbulls are indisputably the most dangerous animals in America, 2/3 of all serious dog attacks on humans and over 90% of serious dog attacks on domesticated animals are from pit bulls, which are less then ten percent of dogs. The next dog after pitbulls are dobermans which are trained to be actual property guard dogs and it’s less than a quarter of pit Bull numbers. https://coloradoinjurylaw.com/dog-bite-statistics/#:~:text=Pitbulls are 2.5x more,and 63% of ocular injuries.&text=Pitbull attacks have higher morbidity,than attacks by other breeds.

3) pit bulls have high prey drive, they will attack their own owners, their owners children, their owners parents, sometimes even strangers and they do it without warning. Pit bulls will attack infants for crying because it triggers their prey drive
4) pit bulls have locking jaws which cause serious injury. Lucas County Ohio Dog Warden Tom Skeldon once presented a video in court of a dog that wouldn’t release its grasp on a cable after being tranquilized. Even pit Bull activists recommend carrying “break sticks” to pry the jaws of the dog when it attacks another dog.

5) existing lesser laws are inadequate. Most laws involving dangerous animals are meant to deal with normal dog breeds which are nuisances, not for fatal attacks by dogs like pit bulls. Breed specific laws allow accountability for people who choose to adopt dangerous animals

I'd much rather see all states ban guns.

Far more dangerous.

 

[Phys251]

Really? You think the young mother whose adored family pets attacked is responsible for her dog mauling her infant?

I refer you to my previous response. Read it as many times as you need.

 

[EMNofSeattle]

Ninety-nine percent of the problem is bad owners. I've been around pit bulls that were nothing but nice.

This is 911 audio from an attack where a woman’s family pet raised since puppyhood took a 14 month old child she was baby sitting out of her arms and killed the child. She was later interviewed for the Canadian newsmagazine program fifth estate.

Both videos below





These were not bad owners with abused animals. In fact nearly all pit Bull attacks I see in the media involved well treated family pets

This “bad owner” stuff is just cope, if that poor woman was a bad owner who exactly isn’t for that breed?

It’s too dangerous to allow in public is if she’s a bad owner

 

[Phys251]

This is 911 audio from an attack where a woman’s family pet raised since puppyhood took a 14 month old child she was baby sitting out of her arms and killed the child. She was later interviewed for the Canadian newsmagazine program fifth estate.

Both videos below





These were not bad owners with abused animals. In fact nearly all pit Bull attacks I see in the media involved well treated family pets

Appeal to emotion. The fault lies with the owner 99% of the time.

 

[Ginger Ale]

I agree, so back gun control! You know, our children's greatest threat.

 

[EMNofSeattle]

Appeal to emotion. The fault lies with the owner 99% of the time.

In the sense they chose a dangerous dog that is true.

The way for the owner to not be at fault is to not adopt these dogs.

Get a poodle instead

 

[EMNofSeattle]

I agree, so back gun control! You know, our children's greatest threat.

These are seperate issues.

Besides guns are far more regulated then pit bulls in this country

 

[Phys251]

In the sense they chose a dangerous dog that is true.

The way for the owner to not be at fault is to not adopt these dogs.

You fail again. Many breeds of dog can be dangerous with bad owners. Should we ban all breeds that you don't like, EMN?

 

[EMNofSeattle]

You fail again. Many breeds of dog can be dangerous with bad owners.

And yet only one class of dogs, has consistently shown itself to be uniquely dangerous, which I explained in the OP. Other dogs, even dogs bred as guard dogs, attack only on a trained command or as part of a continuum that involves growling, posture, or bite and release. Pit bulls attack without warning and exhibit bite and hold with lots of shaking. Even pit Bull breeders as I linked above claim you should carry pry bars to open their jaws if they bite. You ever seen someone have to pry a Jack Russell terrier or a golden retriever?

Should we ban all breeds that you don't like, EMN?

No, we should stop breeding the 10 percent that causes the majority of fatal and serious injuries

 

[Phys251]

And yet only one class of dogs, has consistently shown itself to be uniquely dangerous, which I explained in the OP. Other dogs, even dogs bred as guard dogs, attack only on a trained command or as part of a continuum that involves growling, posture, or bite and release. Pit bulls attack without warning and exhibit bite and hold with lots of shaking. Even pit Bull breeders as I linked above claim you should carry pry bars to open their jaws if they bite. You ever seen someone have to pry a Jack Russell terrier or a golden retriever?

No, we should stop breeding the 10 percent that causes the majority of fatal and serious injuries

Rottweilers, dobermans, German shepherds, even dachshunds can be dangerous if they are trained poorly. Should we ban all of those breeds, EMN?

 

[beefheart]

Ninety-nine percent of the problem is bad owners. I've been around pit bulls that were nothing but nice.

Same here, we dogsit for our friends pit. My elderly female Irish Terrier is dominant to her.

The pit is an absolute softie, she is incredibly submissive.

 

[beefheart]

And yet only one class of dogs, has consistently shown itself to be uniquely dangerous, which I explained in the OP. Other dogs, even dogs bred as guard dogs, attack only on a trained command or as part of a continuum that involves growling, posture, or bite and release. Pit bulls attack without warning and exhibit bite and hold with lots of shaking. Even pit Bull breeders as I linked above claim you should carry pry bars to open their jaws if they bite. You ever seen someone have to pry a Jack Russell terrier or a golden retriever?

No, we should stop breeding the 10 percent that causes the majority of fatal and serious injuries

Well, then lets ban all the coyotes around my neighborhood, they are dangerous, and they kill cats and dogs, and have been known to attack people.

 

[EMNofSeattle]

Rottweilers, dobermans, German shepherds, even dachshunds can be dangerous if they are trained poorly. Should we ban all of those breeds, EMN?

Produce for me a single time a dachshund has killed a police officer becsuse i Can produce multiples of that for pits

 

[The Mark]

I was delighted last month when the Arkansas legislature roundly defeated a bill that would repeal local breed specific laws.

Bill intended to prohibit local bans of specific dog breeds fails in Arkansas House | Northwest Arkansas Democrat-Gazette

A bill intended to bar municipalities from issuing bans targeting specific dog breeds failed to advance from the House on Tuesday.

www.nwaonline.com

This doesn’t go far enough however, because it allows cities to permit people to own these dangerous animals. States should ban them outright.

Pit bulls and any true bulldog or bully breed should be illegal for general ownership as a pet. This is for several reasons

1) they are evolutionary adapted to cause permanent injury and death.

These dogs stem from an English sport called “bull baiting” where dogs would be arranged to kill bulls, as Bull baiting fell out of favor then new blood sports such as dog fighting and ratting emerged, for which bulldogs were crossed with terriers to make a strong and agile dog with a ferocious bite and high pain tolerance. This is the origin of modern pitbulls.

2) pitbulls are the least wanted dog in America, many pitbulls are given to shelters quickly as naive people realize these animals are dangerous. The pit Bull is the most euthanized dog in America and I this overpopulation is in part because insufficient bsl exists to prosecute breeders for making this animals
3) pitbulls are indisputably the most dangerous animals in America, 2/3 of all serious dog attacks on humans and over 90% of serious dog attacks on domesticated animals are from pit bulls, which are less then ten percent of dogs. The next dog after pitbulls are dobermans which are trained to be actual property guard dogs and it’s less than a quarter of pit Bull numbers. https://coloradoinjurylaw.com/dog-b...higher morbidity,than attacks by other breeds.

3) pit bulls have high prey drive, they will attack their own owners, their owners children, their owners parents, sometimes even strangers and they do it without warning. Pit bulls will attack infants for crying because it triggers their prey drive
4) pit bulls have locking jaws which cause serious injury. Lucas County Ohio Dog Warden Tom Skeldon once presented a video in court of a dog that wouldn’t release its grasp on a cable after being tranquilized. Even pit Bull activists recommend carrying “break sticks” to pry the jaws of the dog when it attacks another dog.

5) existing lesser laws are inadequate. Most laws involving dangerous animals are meant to deal with normal dog breeds which are nuisances, not for fatal attacks by dogs like pit bulls. Breed specific laws allow accountability for people who choose to adopt dangerous animals

I tend to disagree with absolute solutions to non-absolute issues.

Of course, I also hold the position that absolutes do not exist, so there's that.

 

[EMNofSeattle]

Well, then lets ban all the coyotes around my neighborhood, they are dangerous, and they kill cats and dogs, and have been known to attack people.

Coyotes are wild animals. Not domesticated pets.

 

[beefheart]

Coyotes are wild animals. Not domesticated pets.

So, you don't care if they are dangerous.

Just Pit Bulls...

 

[Phys251]

Produce for me a single time a dachshund has killed a police officer becsuse i Can produce multiples of that for pits

And I can produce multiple examples of police dying from car wrecks--the number one killer of cops. Should cars be banned, EMN?

 

[beefheart]

And I can produce multiple examples of police dying from car wrecks--the number one killer of cops. Should cars be banned, EMN?

We got javalinas, they are mean and nasty, they can kill you...but good!

 

[EMNofSeattle]

And I can produce multiple examples of police dying from car wrecks--the number one killer of cops. Should cars be banned, EMN?

This isn’t about car wrecks. This is specifically about pit Bull dogs. You brought up dachshunds, show me how dachshunds are dangerous compared to pitbulls

 

[A Linoge]

I was delighted last month when the Arkansas legislature roundly defeated a bill that would repeal local breed specific laws.

Bill intended to prohibit local bans of specific dog breeds fails in Arkansas House | Northwest Arkansas Democrat-Gazette

A bill intended to bar municipalities from issuing bans targeting specific dog breeds failed to advance from the House on Tuesday.

www.nwaonline.com

This doesn’t go far enough however, because it allows cities to permit people to own these dangerous animals. States should ban them outright.

Pit bulls and any true bulldog or bully breed should be illegal for general ownership as a pet. This is for several reasons

1) they are evolutionary adapted to cause permanent injury and death.

These dogs stem from an English sport called “bull baiting” where dogs would be arranged to kill bulls, as Bull baiting fell out of favor then new blood sports such as dog fighting and ratting emerged, for which bulldogs were crossed with terriers to make a strong and agile dog with a ferocious bite and high pain tolerance. This is the origin of modern pitbulls.

2) pitbulls are the least wanted dog in America, many pitbulls are given to shelters quickly as naive people realize these animals are dangerous. The pit Bull is the most euthanized dog in America and I this overpopulation is in part because insufficient bsl exists to prosecute breeders for making this animals
3) pitbulls are indisputably the most dangerous animals in America, 2/3 of all serious dog attacks on humans and over 90% of serious dog attacks on domesticated animals are from pit bulls, which are less then ten percent of dogs. The next dog after pitbulls are dobermans which are trained to be actual property guard dogs and it’s less than a quarter of pit Bull numbers. https://coloradoinjurylaw.com/dog-bite-statistics/#:~:text=Pitbulls are 2.5x more,and 63% of ocular injuries.&text=Pitbull attacks have higher morbidity,than attacks by other breeds.

3) pit bulls have high prey drive, they will attack their own owners, their owners children, their owners parents, sometimes even strangers and they do it without warning. Pit bulls will attack infants for crying because it triggers their prey drive
4) pit bulls have locking jaws which cause serious injury. Lucas County Ohio Dog Warden Tom Skeldon once presented a video in court of a dog that wouldn’t release its grasp on a cable after being tranquilized. Even pit Bull activists recommend carrying “break sticks” to pry the jaws of the dog when it attacks another dog.

5) existing lesser laws are inadequate. Most laws involving dangerous animals are meant to deal with normal dog breeds which are nuisances, not for fatal attacks by dogs like pit bulls. Breed specific laws allow accountability for people who choose to adopt dangerous animals

bad dogs no bad owners and trainers and breeders yes

 

[Binary_Digit]

These were not bad owners with abused animals. In fact nearly all pit Bull attacks I see in the media involved well treated family pets

This “bad owner” stuff is just cope, if that poor woman was a bad owner who exactly isn’t for that breed?

It’s too dangerous to allow in public is if she’s a bad owner

Being a "bad owner" isn't just about abusing them. If you don't know how to firmly establish yourself as the pack leader, then the dog will decide on its own to be the pack leader whenever it finds itself in confusing and/or stressful situations. They instinctively want to look to the pack leader for guidance and leadership on how to feel and react to any given situation. If they don't know who that is, then what can we expect?

Dog 1: Is great until someone comes to the door. Then it snarls & growls and barks at the person until they leave.
Dog 2: Is great until passing other dogs while walking on a leash. Then it goes completely insane barking at the other dogs until finally being dragged away.
Dog 3: Is great until it gets the chance to slip outside while the door is open. Then it goes on an adventure all over the neighborhood and keeps running away whenever the owners try to catch it.

Three radically different misbehaviors, all caused by the same problem: The dogs don't know who the pack leader is, so in certain situations they'll decide to be the leader themselves.

With most dogs, this ignorance on the part of humans isn't a major problem. But with special-case dogs like pit bulls, it's totally irresponsible to not know how to properly lead a dog like that.

I would be on board with requiring owners to take a safety class and carry a license to own a pit bull and maybe others breeds as well.

 

[KevinKohler]

In the sense they chose a dangerous dog that is true.

The way for the owner to not be at fault is to not adopt these dogs.

Get a poodle instead

I've heard that same argument used for ar15s.