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When Is It Obstruction Of Justice?

When Is It Obstruction Of Justice?

  • When you threaten to break kneecaps

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • When you make any threat in order to influence a witness's testimony

    Votes: 19 86.4%
  • When you aren't president

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • MAGA!! OBAMA!! HILLARY!!!

    Votes: 3 13.6%

  • Total voters
    22
Dream on. Why did Trump bring it up? Just happened to occur to him? This from a prez who thinks the AG should be his personal lawyer, his Roy Cohn. It was like the line by Al Pacino as Michael concerning Fredo in Godfather II, “I don’t want anything to happen to my brother while our mother is still alive.” The intent of the comment was clear. Trump trying to intimidate Cohen. Michael suggesting his brother is to be killed.

The deep state and other liberals do their best to intimidate, fabricate and threaten Trump every chance they get. The guy fights back. Good to see him take a few swings. Batter up, buttercup.
 
Debate and obsession are two different things, unless you're a liberal Trump hater. You are obsessed. Trump lives in your head.

Trump is the President of the United States. It doesn't say much for what's living in anyone's head if he or she doesn't know that, or if he or she comes to a board with the name "Debate Politics" and expresses surprise that the President of the United States is discussed on the board every day.

This doesn't sound like the board for you. You may want to find a board where politics isn't discussed if it offends you that people discuss President Trump.
 
Trump is the President of the United States. It doesn't say much for what's living in anyone's head if he or she doesn't know that, or if he or she comes to a board with the name "Debate Politics" and expresses surprise that the President of the United States is discussed on the board every day.

This doesn't sound like the board for you. You may want to find a board where politics isn't discussed if it offends you that people discuss President Trump.

Discuss Trump all you want. Getting your feelings out is good therapy. Not as good as real therapy, but few here can probably afford that. If ranting on Trump here on the discussion board prevents you from going postal at work then I'm all for it. So let it out, buttercup. Snowflakes need an outlet. Consider Debate Politics a safe space. As Frazer Crane says; I'm listening......
 
that's not at all like what Trump said. Trump didn't threaten anyone. He never said something bad would happen to anyone's business. Trump lives in your head.

Why would he bring it up, especially shortly after the news breaks Cohen may testify to Congress? I honestly think you do know he was trying to influence Cohen (cannot bring myself to believe anyone is this ignorant), and you are just being an ultra-loyalist.
 
Discuss Trump all you want. Getting your feelings out is good therapy. Not as good as real therapy, but few here can probably afford that. If ranting on Trump here on the discussion board prevents you from going postal at work then I'm all for it. So let it out, buttercup. Snowflakes need an outlet. Consider Debate Politics a safe space. As Frazer Crane says; I'm listening......

Somehow, I doubt you would call the people still obsessed over Obama and Hillary snowflakes. As Tres said, Trump is president. He makes the news every single day.

Btw, it is Frasier.
 
Why would he bring it up, especially shortly after the news breaks Cohen may testify to Congress? I honestly think you do know he was trying to influence Cohen (cannot bring myself to believe anyone is this ignorant), and you are just being an ultra-loyalist.

Because politics is hardball, especially where Trump is concerned. Anything goes. They all take their best shots. Truth and justice don't matter to either side. Of course Trump is trying to influence Cohen, just like Mueller is trying to influence Cohen,. Mueller desperately needs something big on Trump from Cohen, even if Cohen has to make it up. Otherwise Mueller is going to look foolish spending millions and millions and going nowhere on Trump. It's no holds barred, and has been since Trump announced his candidacy. Well, even before that they were discounting him. It's been great fun watching you liberals go all ape shyte over Trump. Still can't believe it, can you. It was supposed to be Hillary in a land slide; the end of the Republican Party for all time and on to that promised liberal utopia. Trump sure threw a wrench into that dream. Trump has lived in your heads ever since.
 
Because politics is hardball, especially where Trump is concerned. Anything goes.

You’re right, anything goes with Trump, including breaking the law. Thanks for confirming my point.
 
The deep state and other liberals do their best to intimidate, fabricate and threaten Trump every chance they get. The guy fights back. Good to see him take a few swings. Batter up, buttercup.

The “deep state.” Define it.
 
You’re right, anything goes with Trump, including breaking the law. Thanks for confirming my point.

Anything goes on BOTH sides, including breaking the law.
 
The “deep state.” Define it.

Those un-elected and their elected puppets with power and influence seeking to control politics. George Soros, the Koch brothers, etc. And more who don't make any headlines.
 
Where did you come up with the above

There is literally a link to a video of Giuliani himself saying that exact thing. There are also about 50 different tweets that Trump has sent out which easily constitute threats.
 
When President Trump says anything the democrats start screaming obstruction of justice!

It's the resist game that is being played. ;)
 
Until they run into Mueller.

You mean the Democrats gofer boy? He's a Democrat and his staff are all Democrats. He's a tool for getting Trump. He will do whatever it takes, including getting his perps to make stuff up. Would you trust an investigation made up of ALL Republicans? Cohen will say whatever it takes to save his own skin, get the best deal he can. Anybody would. It's human nature. The courts aren't about the truth; it's about how you can make things look. This investigation isn't about truth, it's about getting Trump. Even a rookie lawyer knows that.
 
So America's Lawyer (HA!) Rudy Giuliani said Trump's threat to Michael Cohen's father-in-law was not obstruction of justice. Obstruction of justice is defined: an act that "corruptly or by threat or force, or by any threatening letter or communication, influences, obstructs, or impedes, or endeavors to influence, obstruct, or impede, the due administration of justice."

No one can argue Trump was trying to influence Cohen's potential testimony to Congress with this threat. This alone should be bringing about impeachment.

Impeach away, who cares? Everyone already expects it. You have to get it past the Senate, which is never gonna happen. Just give it up and move on to more productive thinking.
 
You mean the Democrats gofer boy? He's a Democrat and his staff are all Democrats.

Mueller a Democrat? Get yourself out of the echo chamber, it will do you some good.
 
Just give it up and move on to more productive thinking.

I’m sure you told your conservative friends the same thing when they went on and on about Obama being Kenyan and how much he golfed. Difference this time is we have a president compromised by authoritarians.
 
Those un-elected and their elected puppets with power and influence seeking to control politics. George Soros, the Koch brothers, etc. And more who don't make any headlines.

Don’t the Soroos’s and the Koch’s balance each other out a bit? Is this something like the Illuminati? Seriously, the answer is to get money out of politics. But since we have decided that money not only talks, but it should decide, it seems like we are lost.
 
Mueller a Democrat? Get yourself out of the echo chamber, it will do you some good.

I thought he was an independent until I saw the team he assembled; full of Democrats, and not just Democrats, but even some big Democrat donor Democrats. Most of them donated some amount to Democrats, and most are registered as Democrats. Not exactly an impartial group. Name the REGISTERED Republicans on his team. At some point in the past Mueller was very independent; but he dislikes Trump, and, even as a member of the Republican establishment, who also dislike Trump, he is now on a mission to get Trump at all costs. Use whatever legal and extra-legal means at his disposal. He's GOT to get something on Trump or look very foolish. We have an adversarial system of justice, not a truth system of justice. It's NOT about truth; it's about how you can make the other side look. Any man who's ever been involved in a nasty divorce knows that fact all too well.
 
Don’t the Soroos’s and the Koch’s balance each other out a bit? Is this something like the Illuminati? Seriously, the answer is to get money out of politics. But since we have decided that money not only talks, but it should decide, it seems like we are lost.

Does power and corruption ever balance out? Or does it simply make puppets out of ALL elected officials, and by extension all of us? Obama surrounded himself with Wall Street types. So has Trump. Bankers run the SEC. Is there a deep state? Of course there is. Whenever an institution (govt) gets so large and involved in the smallest details of everyday life, there is going to be an urge to control that power.

150 years ago the average person probably couldn't tell you what the federal government actually did, besides having an army and maybe building a road here and there. Their lives were influenced by local politics, taxed by local politics,and somewhat by state politics. But since the Civil War federalism has grown to such an extent that the national government is highly influential in every aspect of everyday life. So now national politics is of prime IMPORTANCE. Everybody can see they have a big stake in selecting their national rulers. Because now those nationally elected officials, and their civil service bureaucracy are their rulers. You want, no... desperately need, to be ruled by powers favorable to your needs. You will NEVER get the money out of such a system.
 
For the past two years I was convinced that Trump would eventually be impeached. I've changed my mind, I believe that he's going to end up in prison for crimes, not only collusion or conspiracy but other crimes like witness intimidation, coercion and threats of physical harm. It will come out.
 
Does power and corruption ever balance out? Or does it simply make puppets out of ALL elected officials, and by extension all of us? Obama surrounded himself with Wall Street types. So has Trump. Bankers run the SEC. Is there a deep state? Of course there is. Whenever an institution (govt) gets so large and involved in the smallest details of everyday life, there is going to be an urge to control that power.

150 years ago the average person probably couldn't tell you what the federal government actually did, besides having an army and maybe building a road here and there. Their lives were influenced by local politics, taxed by local politics,and somewhat by state politics. But since the Civil War federalism has grown to such an extent that the national government is highly influential in every aspect of everyday life. So now national politics is of prime IMPORTANCE. Everybody can see they have a big stake in selecting their national rulers. Because now those nationally elected officials, and their civil service bureaucracy are their rulers. You want, no... desperately need, to be ruled by powers favorable to your needs. You will NEVER get the money out of such a system.

You're probably right in a larger sense, but the Supreme Court decision was ridiculous, suggesting that I can go one on one with some corporation or labor union. Control on donations can help things.

Local is always better, but my theory is that people looked to the Feds when locals denied their rights, the first, biggest example of this (in reverse) is what happened in the South post reconstruction, as rights were lost when the Feds pulled out. Local is almost always better. But if Mississippi won't allow you to vote, if local troops shoot you when you go on strike, if you are paid less for the same work and the state doesn't care, if you are locked in a factory and it catches fire, if your rivers are polluted and state inspectors are nowhere to be found, you look to DC to get involved in the details of your life. Most people don't care which fire department shows up when their house is burning. And of course, some who cry deep state think holding people without charging them and waterboarding is all right. Kafka is in the eye of the beholder.
 
I thought he was an independent until I saw the team he assembled; full of Democrats, and not just Democrats, but even some big Democrat donor Democrats.

Department of Justice policy and the Civil Service Reform Act prevent Mueller from considering political affiliation when hiring. Go ahead and boo-hoo '12 Angry Democrats' all you want. If the facts are on Trump's side then he will be cleared.
 
You're probably right in a larger sense, but the Supreme Court decision was ridiculous, suggesting that I can go one on one with some corporation or labor union. Control on donations can help things.

Local is always better, but my theory is that people looked to the Feds when locals denied their rights, the first, biggest example of this (in reverse) is what happened in the South post reconstruction, as rights were lost when the Feds pulled out. Local is almost always better. But if Mississippi won't allow you to vote, if local troops shoot you when you go on strike, if you are paid less for the same work and the state doesn't care, if you are locked in a factory and it catches fire, if your rivers are polluted and state inspectors are nowhere to be found, you look to DC to get involved in the details of your life. Most people don't care which fire department shows up when their house is burning. And of course, some who cry deep state think holding people without charging them and waterboarding is all right. Kafka is in the eye of the beholder.

Beg to differ on the court case. Corporations have long been considered "individuals" with the rights and responsibilities of individuals. The SC was upholding a strong precedent. And there are good reasons for viewing corporations as individuals. You wouldn't have contracts, how would you sue a corporation; you would have to sue each member and each stockholder individually. Without corporations holding "person" status, the whole system falls apart.

But you are right about how the federal government got sooooo big. When you can't get justice "locally", or convince locals to join with you on an issue, federalizing it is often the way to go. And I'm not arguing that that is even the wrong course of action. I'm just saying that the more you "nationalize" and federalize issues the more important national politics becomes. And everything around national politics. Even journalists will become obsessed with "national" news and end up taking sides themselves. And the more money it attracts. And then that huge amount of power goes up for bids. Then people behind the scenes take over and that's the end of your democracy. Now you live in a world controlled by a "deep state".
 
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