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What's your position on School Choice?

ttwtt78640 said:
It depends on how much the vouchers are. Frequently, the vouchers aren’t enough to cover the full cost (including transportation) for those who opt out of attending their local public school. Another problem is that private schools may refuse to accept (possibly by necessity) all students wanting to attend them.
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Good points. There may be things not included in what is covered and there certainly needs to be guidelines for admissions if you are getting federal/state dollars. Again that's a issue that people have to sit down and work out.
 
Ginger Ale said:
I agree somewhat but the public schools and charters out in AZ have scores to show if they're doing this well already. I honestly don't like it, I think back in the early days the teacher had more time to teach and less time spent on ditto pushing for test scores. I think kids who are always testing are at a disadvantage. IMO, of course. Some parents love constant testing.

A-F School and LEA Letter Grades | State Board of Education

azsbe.az.gov azsbe.az.gov

I have found that excessive testing leads to a funneled curriculum focus and doesn't measure deeper learning skills, like critical thinking and creativity. I think it hinders comprehensive development. I think it also increases student and teacher stress.
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Those are all good points and you see some of this to varying degrees. One of the problems with the ever increasing load on teachers is so much social agenda mandates that have grown to ridiculous proportions. I stated earlier, let's teach with the objective being a good education and that going back to the 3R's. If we are moving kids up the chain who cannot read, write or do math at grade level or very, very close and who have remediation programs to help catch them up we are going to have huge problems.
Testing is a tool. It's a necessity to determine where a student is at in achievement goals. I also think one of the very important things in schools is extra-curricular activities that foster communication, teamwork, being active, and most importantly mixing our widely diverse population together in different situations where they cooperate and learn with and from one another.
 
rational anarchist said:
with private its more the norm than the exception they are good and with public its more the norm they are bad,,

more so in large democrat run cities,,
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Here's the difference. Public schools have to take everyone, good, bad, indifferent. That's a challenge. Private schools often have a more settled, often more economically advanced and very often more involved parental group. That's a huge plus.
Dealing with low achievers and more kids with home and family impediments to success do plague many public schools. That's part of the point of school vouchers, it gets those kids into a better situation.
 
rational anarchist said:
its been 40 plus yrs and itts only getting worse,,

getting government out of education is the only way to fix it,,
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Right! We need those poor kids back in the fields and factories where they belong like back when America was great. LMAO!
 
rational anarchist said:
the one thing they all have in common is they are ran by a far away government,,

back before the creation of the dept of ed our schools rank high in the world now we are a laughing stock,,
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WTF? What exactly do you think the US Dept of Education does in K-12 schools?
 
Stealers Wheel said:
Right! We need those poor kids back in the fields and factories where they belong like back when America was great. LMAO!
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we need bad teachers fired but the unions wont let us fire them,,

not sure why you want more stupid people in the fields and factories,,
 
Integrityrespec said:
You realize we have citizens that are not paying any federal income tax? Based on income and exemptions they don't actually pay in. That's why I say citizenship could be a requirement, but it has to be a set of requirements to properly regulate it.
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That pesky constitution gets in the way
 
rational anarchist said:
wastes money and produce uneducated children is most of their record,,

and its getting worse by the yr
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LOL… We get it, you don’t have any idea.. just want to bitch and whine about the gubermint but put no effort into really understanding how any of it works
 
Blue Dog said:
I can support private schools receiving tax payer supported vouchers provided they are non religious institutions.
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Do you think SS, welfare and unemployment benefits should only be given provided none of it is donated to religious institutions?

How about EBT? That frees up money that the recipient might donate to religious institutions.
 
Show me a kid of normal intelligence in virtually any school district in America who is failing either academically or behaviorally and I will show you a parent who has checked out.

People are under the misconception that it is the schools' responsibility to educate their kids. This is not true. It is the parents' responsibility to educate their offspring. The schools are simply there to facilitate that objective. Unfortunately, no politician is willing to say this. Easy to blame the teachers. In reality, in almost every instance of a failure, the parents are the weakest link. And I am speaking as a parent myself.
 
Stealers Wheel said:
Show me a kid of normal intelligence in virtually any school district in America who is failing either academically or behaviorally and I will show you a parent who has checked out.

People are under the misconception that it is the schools' responsibility to educate their kids. This is not true. It is the parents' responsibility to educate their offspring. The schools are simply there to facilitate that objective. Unfortunately, no politician is willing to say this. Easy to blame the teachers. In reality, in almost every instance of a failure, the parents are the weakest link. And I am speaking as a parent myself.
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the best post on this entire thread.
 
I have to be honest. I am not sure how much better private schools would be if they also had to follow the Federal "Equity" rules for Federal funding. Or if the State they operate in also or separately have such "Equity" rules for State vouchers.

IMO the whole reason for allowing more private schooling access should be to allow parents to send their kids to school for an education, not social equity indoctrination.

None of this "they/them, xe/xem, ze/zim, sie/hir" or other nonsense pronouns and other ridiculous examples of woke DEI/Whatever ideologies. Better yet, all of that nonsense of word and identity gaming needs to stop being pushed in public schools at all levels, and definitely not a requirement for funding any private schools.

Now if some "socially enlightened" parents want to pay to send their kids to a private school that plays the woke agenda, then (sadly) they can do so.

But Public schools should not be allowed to spread this mind virus amongst our children. If they do, then parents should be able to use school vouchers equal to the amounts given to Public schools to send their kids to an honest private educational facility.

​

 
Captain Adverse said:
I have to be honest. I am not sure how much better private schools would be if they also had to follow the Federal "Equity" rules for Federal funding. Or if the State they operate in also or separately have such "Equity" rules for State vouchers.

IMO the whole reason for allowing more private schooling access should be to allow parents to send their kids to school for an education, not social equity indoctrination.

None of this "they/them, xe/xem, ze/zim, sie/hir" or other nonsense pronouns and other ridiculous examples of woke DEI/Whatever ideologies. Better yet, all of that nonsense of word and identity gaming needs to stop being pushed in public schools at all levels, and definitely not a requirement for funding any private schools.

Now if some "socially enlightened" parents want to pay to send their kids to a private school that plays the woke agenda, then (sadly) they can do so.

But Public schools should not be allowed to spread this mind virus amongst our children. If they do, then parents should be able to use school vouchers equal to the amounts given to Public schools to send their kids to an honest private educational facility.

​

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If you're going to send MY tax dollars to a private school, I DEMAND accountability on how it is being spent. I will not tolerate my dollars being wasted on religious indoctrination. I will not tolerate my dollars going to schools that refuse to admit POC. Now, tell me I am wrong to insist on accountability.
 
Captain Adverse said:
I have to be honest. I am not sure how much better private schools would be if they also had to follow the Federal "Equity" rules for Federal funding. Or if the State they operate in also or separately have such "Equity" rules for State vouchers.

IMO the whole reason for allowing more private schooling access should be to allow parents to send their kids to school for an education, not social equity indoctrination.

None of this "they/them, xe/xem, ze/zim, sie/hir" or other nonsense pronouns and other ridiculous examples of woke DEI/Whatever ideologies. Better yet, all of that nonsense of word and identity gaming needs to stop being pushed in public schools at all levels, and definitely not a requirement for funding any private schools.

Now if some "socially enlightened" parents want to pay to send their kids to a private school that plays the woke agenda, then (sadly) they can do so.

But Public schools should not be allowed to spread this mind virus amongst our children. If they do, then parents should be able to use school vouchers equal to the amounts given to Public schools to send their kids to an honest private educational facility.

​

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Hmm… if Johnny or Sally wants to self-identify as a rabbit, nudist, superhero, King or Queen then their wish (delusion?) must be accepted and properly respected. ;)
 
j brown's body said:
"They **** you up, your mum and dad.
They may not mean to, but they do.
They fill you with the faults they had
And add some extra, just for you."

Link

I'm always impressed by the right-wing's mania for regulating schools but unregulating home schooling.

Scary stuff.
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Just to let you know another view on that. Some schools offer home school as an alternative to getting expelled for their bad behavior. It's a pretty good choice for both but often parents discover the problem really is their kid.
 
Stealers Wheel said:
If you're going to send MY tax dollars to a private school, I DEMAND accountability on how it is being spent. I will not tolerate my dollars being wasted on religious indoctrination. I will not tolerate my dollars going to schools that refuse to admit POC. Now, tell me I am wrong to insist on accountability.
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Actually I live in an area that has lots of private schools and have always lived where that was the case. I haven't seen any that were actively trying to keep people of color out. It's discipline issues they are trying to keep out. Many private schools have great extracurricular programs and sports team in particular and I see lots of integration there most of the time.
Those old days of privates being a place for white flight just isn't the case much anymore, that's a thing of the past. They now move for better academics and safer schools along with many who want their kids to get a religiously based education.
As far as your tax dollars none of us get much say in the final determination. Believe me, lots of my dollars go on things I abhor.
 
The only thing vouchers do is defund public schools for the kids that have nowhere else to go 🤷‍♀️


Your kid isn’t going to be attending the $20K annual tuition private school my kid goes to with a voucher.

Maybe they can go to St Throw up a shingle private school…or ABC learning academy with staff that’s being paid minimally.

But they aren’t competing with the elite private schools.



And who else do we refund tax dollars to?

The childless couple?
The empty nesters no longer having kids in schools?
The single people?

Do they all get their tax money back also?

🙄
 
ttwtt78640 said:
Hmm… if Johnny or Sally wants to self-identify as a rabbit, nudist, superhero, King or Queen then their wish (delusion?) must be accepted and properly respected. ;)
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Not exactly. If they think they are a King and want to start ruling, that's an issue. In addition when the government starts funding the delusion there are some points where too far is too far. IMO.
 
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