What questions would you like answered at the Zimmerman trial? [W:209:368:403]

[Excon]

re: What questions would you like answered at the Zimmerman trial? [W:209]

You have the.evidence confused. It's obvious since we have the actual quote on suffocation.

No. That would be you who are confused.
He did not say he was trying to suffocate him.
He indicates that ™ was trying to silence him and he felt suffocated by it.

 

[SheWolf]

re: What questions would you like answered at the Zimmerman trial? [W:209]

No. Do you not like reading actual quotes?

No. That would be you who are confused.
He did not say he was trying to suffocate him.
He indicates that ™ was trying to silence him and he felt suffocated by it.

 

[Grim17]

re: What questions would you like answered at the Zimmerman trial? [W:209]

No. Do you not like reading actual quotes?

I think there is either some confusion here, or some willful misintepreting of the facts on the smothering issue. There are 3 element to this thing as stated by Zimmerman and people are mixing them up. According to Zimmerman, there were Martin's actions, Martin's intent by those actions, and what resulted from those actions.

Action: Martin covering Zimmerman's mouth with his hand(s)
Intent: To silence Zimmerman's cries for help.
Results: It was smothering Zimmerman and made it difficult for him to breath (likely the broken nose contributed to that)

You all are taking what Zimmerman said was the result of Martin covering his mouth, and claiming he stated that as Martin's intent... That's not what he told investigators. He told them it was to silence his screams for help. As for the Hannity quote, I think it's missing a few key things... Here is the WHOLE quote you are referring to:

ZIMMERMAN: I felt him take -- he had -- after he couldn't hit my head on the concrete anymore, he started to try to suffocate me. And I continued to take -- push his hands off of my mouth and my nose, particularly because it was excruciating having a broken nose and him putting his weight on it. And that's the point in time when he started telling me to shut up, shut up, shut up.​

Did you catch that last part? Since Hannity was familiar with what he told police in interviews, a minute or so later Hannity went back to that subject:

HANNITY: That was your voice?

ZIMMERMAN: Yes, sir.

HANNITY: And the police said they heard at one point 14 screams, you were screaming that loud?

ZIMMERMAN: Yes, sir.

HANNITY: And you said to the police at one point that he put his hand over your mouth. Do you think that was to silence you from screaming?

ZIMMERMAN: Yes, sir. I believe he -- from what the investigators told me, he knew that I was talking to the police. And I was yelling so that -- I believed that the police officer was there and they just couldn't me. So, I was yelling in the hopes that they were in the vicinity and they would come when they heard me yelling.​

That's what called a clarification... Hannity wanted Zimmerman to clarify what he believed was Martin's intent, and he made it clear it wasn't an attempt to stop him from breathing, but rather to stop him from screaming for help.

Do you all have that straight now, or should I expect this BS to be recycled AGAIN in a week or so like you all always do?

 

[Excon]

re: What questions would you like answered at the Zimmerman trial? [W:209]

No. Do you not like reading actual quotes?

I do know what was said, which is why I keep telling you, you are wrong.

I think there is either some confusion here, or some willful misintepreting of the facts on the smothering issue. There are 3 element to this thing as stated by Zimmerman and people are mixing them up. According to Zimmerman, there were Martin's actions, Martin's intent by those actions, and what resulted from those actions.

Action: Martin covering Zimmerman's mouth with his hand(s)
Intent: To silence Zimmerman's cries for help.
Results: It was smothering Zimmerman and made it difficult for him to breath (likely the broken nose contributed to that)

You all are taking what Zimmerman said was the result of Martin covering his mouth, and claiming he stated that as Martin's intent... That's not what he told investigators. He told them it was to silence his screams for help. As for the Hannity quote, I think it's missing a few key things... Here is the WHOLE quote you are referring to:

ZIMMERMAN: I felt him take -- he had -- after he couldn't hit my head on the concrete anymore, he started to try to suffocate me. And I continued to take -- push his hands off of my mouth and my nose, particularly because it was excruciating having a broken nose and him putting his weight on it. And that's the point in time when he started telling me to shut up, shut up, shut up.​

Did you catch that last part? Since Hannity was familiar with what he told police in interviews, a minute or so later Hannity went back to that subject:

HANNITY: That was your voice?

ZIMMERMAN: Yes, sir.

HANNITY: And the police said they heard at one point 14 screams, you were screaming that loud?

ZIMMERMAN: Yes, sir.

HANNITY: And you said to the police at one point that he put his hand over your mouth. Do you think that was to silence you from screaming?

ZIMMERMAN: Yes, sir. I believe he -- from what the investigators told me, he knew that I was talking to the police. And I was yelling so that -- I believed that the police officer was there and they just couldn't me. So, I was yelling in the hopes that they were in the vicinity and they would come when they heard me yelling.​

That's what called a clarification... Hannity wanted Zimmerman to clarify what he believed was Martin's intent, and he made it clear it wasn't an attempt to stop him from breathing, but rather to stop him from screaming for help.

Do you all have that straight now, or should I expect this BS to be recycled AGAIN in a week or so like you all always do?

Should be settled now.

 

[Excon]

re: What questions would you like answered at the Zimmerman trial? [W:209]

No. Do you not like reading actual quotes?

Do you like not knowing the evidence in toto? Or what it actually says?

start @ 31:45

Then I really... I... I started screaming for help
And .. he covered my nose with one hand, and then my mouth with the other one
and tells me to "shut the **** up" and ah, I couldn't breath, I was suffocating.​

Now you can go around pretending that ™ was trying to suffocate him instead of silencing him all you want. It just makes ™ seem more hostile.

Or you can look at the evidence in toto and see what it says.

 

[tashatexas77048]

re: What questions would you like answered at the Zimmerman trial? [W:209]

I'm sorry Captain Obviousl to the rescue!

It does not matter why he said Martin covered his mouth because just like all of his other convuluted bullshiggity it makes no sense whatsoever. My original point was physical, forensic and voice capture evidence says THIS NEVER HAPPENED AT ALL. Now just like you rocket scientists continue to say we have no EVIDENCE to prove our assertions and you even twist what people say or say those are just words and not evidence then let me remind you that there is no evidence that Martin...ever covered Zimmerman's nose and face for any reason and the law says we don't have to take his word for it.

Point me to even one piece of physical evidence that proves Zimmerman was SUFFOCATED with Martin covering his nose and mouth. If you...have no proof beyond what he he said then in this instance I say you shut up.

Further, I would like to point out the the quote from Zimmerman I posted has him saying Martin grew tired of banging his heard on concrete and started trying to suffocate him. In fact, this suffocation was the last thing that was happening before he pulled the trigger so Excon is saying Martin was killed, not for attempting murder via suffocation but because he was politely covering Zimmerman's mouth and nose at the time and was simply asking him to shut up. Got it.


Book em, Dano.

 

[Excon]

re: What questions would you like answered at the Zimmerman trial? [W:209]

I'm sorry Captain Obviousl to the rescue!

Who? You?
That is hilarious! :lamo

It does not matter why he said Martin covered his mouth because just like all of his other convuluted bullshiggity it makes no sense whatsoever. My original point was physical, forensic and voice capture evidence says THIS NEVER HAPPENED AT ALL.

Wrong!
And that is all that needs to be said. You are simply wrong.
You are asserting that which you can not.

Further, I would like to point out the the quote from Zimmerman I posted has him saying Martin grew tired of banging his heard on concrete and started trying to suffocate him. In fact, this suffocation was the last thing that was happening before he pulled the trigger so Excon is saying Martin was killed, not for attempting murder via suffocation but because he was politely covering Zimmerman's mouth and nose at the time and was simply asking him to shut up. Got it.

Book em, Dano.

:doh
You clearly have no idea of what you speak.

 

[buck]

re: What questions would you like answered at the Zimmerman trial? [W:209]

Whether Trayvon ran or skipped is a big deal for people who foolishly said two things, 1. Martin could have made it home. 2. Zimmerman couldn't have caught up to the speedy Martin.

He skipped off or he ran off.. Neither would have prevented Martin from making it the 200 feet home in the 2 minutes Zimm was on the phone with NEN. We'll have to see exactly what Zimm meant by skipping off, but I do not suspect it is what you think it is.

Now for what I would like to know: IF ZIMMERMAN'S FLASHLIGHT DIDN'T WORK AS HE CLAIMED WASNT THAT MORE INCENTIVE TO STOP LOOKING FOR AN "ADDRESS" AND TAKE HIS DUMB ASS IMMEDIATELY BACK TO HIS CAR?What kind of address was he hoping to find when it was dark as hell? So now we are to believe he walked around in the dark looking for an address for several minutes before standing at the T? Clearly common sense dictates that if he had a flashlight that worked he was looking for something besides an address considering he never called back with one and if he didn't have a flashlight that worked HE WASN'T LOOK FOR AN ADDRESS AT ALL.

As he stated, he was looking for an address on RVC, which is the street he could recall the name of. As I have stated, I believe he initially got out of his car to follow Martin. When advised it was not necessary he stopped and due to the (very obvious) problems telling the dispatcher where his car was and as he was already out, he decided to go for an address to provide. I imagine there are probably street lights over there, plus people that have their lights on. So, it wouldn't have been nearly as dark as you seem to think. Plus, he said he had his headlights (which stay on for a period) pointing in the direction he was walking.

False. Zimmerman told Frank Taaffe and Chief Lee that he approached Martin and asked what he was doing there. That's the same version the phone witness DeeDee heard and it's foolish to discount the story of a near eyewitness whose story was corroborated unwittingly by two people who supported Zimmerman. As for the punch, that changed from he dropped instantly at the T to he fought his way down the sidewalk but doesn't remember how he fell down yet everything that belonged to Martin was south of the T. Why if the conflict started at the T? The blood and other DNA evidence proves Zimmerman's mouth was never covered.

Please provide a cite to the Chief Lee claim that you made. Both Zimm and Dee both claim that Martin approached first.

BDLR: And what do you hear Trayvon saying?
Dee Dee: “Why you followin’ me for?”
...
BDLR: And then what happened?
Dee Dee: I hear this, ya know, man… it wa’ like a ol’ man…
BDLR: OK.
Dee Dee: …say, ‘Wha’ you doin’ aroun’ here?’

 

[tashatexas77048]

re: What questions would you like answered at the Zimmerman trial? [W:209]

Zimmerman even claims Martin took one hand off of his nose and began reaching for his firearm which would mean one hand was still covering Zimmerman's mouth yet a clear scream was heard when the shot was fired.

Anyway, think about how he is describing Martin lying on him and then consider the fact in an instant after the shot rang out a witness looked outside and saw Zimmerman on Martin. How did they change places in an instant?

 

[tashatexas77048]

re: What questions would you like answered at the Zimmerman trial? [W:209]

He skipped off or he ran off.. Neither would have prevented Martin from making it the 200 feet home in the 2 minutes Zimm was on the phone with NEN. We'll have to see exactly what Zimm meant by skipping off, but I do not suspect it is what you think it is.



As he stated, he was looking for an address on RVC, which is the street he could recall the name of. As I have stated, I believe he initially got out of his car to follow Martin. When advised it was not necessary he stopped and due to the (very obvious) problems telling the dispatcher where his car was and as he was already out, he decided to go for an address to provide. I imagine there are probably street lights over there, plus people that have their lights on. So, it wouldn't have been nearly as dark as you seem to think. Plus, he said he had his headlights (which stay on for a period) pointing in the direction he was walking.



Please provide a cite to the Chief Lee claim that you made. Both Zimm and Dee both claim that Martin approached first.

Lets cut the biggest piece of bull FIRST, DeeDee says Zimmerman caught up to Martin. Why are you lying?

 

[Paperview]

re: What questions would you like answered at the Zimmerman trial? [W:209]

Do you like not knowing the evidence in toto? Or what it actually says?

start @ 31:45

Then I really... I... I started screaming for help
And .. he covered my nose with one hand, and then my mouth with the other one
and tells me to "shut the **** up" and ah, I couldn't breath, I was suffocating.​

Now you can go around pretending that ™ was trying to suffocate him instead of silencing him all you want. It just makes ™ seem more hostile.

Or you can look at the evidence in toto and see what it says.

Later in the tape, he also mentions the suffocating again:

Start at about 40:00

George—well, one hand was going towards the gun, he took it off my mouth, and I was trying to get his hand, he was suffocating me so I was trying to get his hands off my face, so when I felt his hand ( he slides his hand down his shirt) he let go of my mouth so I wasn’t trying to do anything again w/ my right hand, so I grabbed my gun and I don’t know if he did at the same time or…what the case was, but, I got to it 1st.

George—no, he was like putting all of his weight on my nose and my mouth trying to suffocate me ..so he was like creating a crevice, with his body, and then he like, when he slid to go for my gun...

 

[tashatexas77048]

re: What questions would you like answered at the Zimmerman trial? [W:209]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yXB1LWOEJPg&feature=youtube_gdata_player

 

[tashatexas77048]

re: What questions would you like answered at the Zimmerman trial? [W:209]

Zimmerman never even.admitted to questioning Trayvon after a while so.why are we believing his story again?

The witness in the Youtube video says the back and forth was brief, just like DeeDee said but there was definitely more than one person speaking so why did Zimmerman claim the only thing he said was "I don't have a problem. " Even that is a lie.

 

[Excon]

re: What questions would you like answered at the Zimmerman trial? [W:209]

Later in the tape, he also mentions the suffocating again:

Start at about 40:00

George—well, one hand was going towards the gun, he took it off my mouth, and I was trying to get his hand, he was suffocating me so I was trying to get his hands off my face, so when I felt his hand ( he slides his hand down his shirt) he let go of my mouth so I wasn’t trying to do anything again w/ my right hand, so I grabbed my gun and I don’t know if he did at the same time or…what the case was, but, I got to it 1st.

George—no, he was like putting all of his weight on my nose and my mouth trying to suffocate me ..so he was like creating a crevice, with his body, and then he like, when he slid to go for my gun...

Ah hello!
And again. Evidence in toto. Or do you not understand what in toto means?

Zimmerman can not speak to ™'s intent unless ™ told him what he intended.
Zimmerman is speaking about what he feels.

Here we know ™ told him to "shut the **** up" as he placed his hands over Zimmerman's nose and mouth.
That is an act of silencing. Period. Stop playing these absurd games.

 

[buck]

re: What questions would you like answered at the Zimmerman trial? [W:209]

Lets cut the biggest piece of bull FIRST, DeeDee says Zimmerman caught up to Martin. Why are you lying?

I Didn't lie at all. Both Dee and Zimmerman claim that Trayvon approached and spoke first - most likely in an aggressive manner as other witnesses state.

Dee claims that Trayvon was so scared that he ran and ran... About 200 feet until he was so tired he just couldn't run anymore. I don't believe that for a second. Even had he walked, Trayvon could have been home well before Zimm even hung up with the NEN dispatcher. Which means that Trayvon was doing something other then "running home" as Dee claims.

 

[tashatexas77048]

re: What questions would you like answered at the Zimmerman trial? [W:209]

The stupid word games. are being played by someone looking at the word csuffocation" and then attempting to redefine it lol.

 

[tashatexas77048]

re: What questions would you like answered at the Zimmerman trial? [W:209]

I Didn't lie at all. Both Dee and Zimmerman claim that Trayvon approached and spoke first - most likely in an aggressive manner as other witnesses state.

Dee claims that Trayvon was so scared that he ran and ran... About 200 feet until he was so tired he just couldn't run anymore. I don't believe that for a second. Even had he walked, Trayvon could have been home well before Zimm even hung up with the NEN dispatcher. Which means that Trayvon was doing something other then "running home" as Dee claims.

Now you've lied twice. Time to ignore you. This level of ignorance, lies and general makeupfactsitis exhibited by you is not conducive for an honest discussion. I'll just post DeeDee's entire interview so people can determine you're a liar without me just typing it.

 

[Paperview]

re: What questions would you like answered at the Zimmerman trial? [W:209]

Zimmerman never even.admitted to questioning Trayvon after a while so.why are we believing his story again?

The witness in the Youtube video says the back and forth was brief, just like DeeDee said but there was definitely more than one person speaking so why did Zimmerman claim the only thing he said was "I don't have a problem. " Even that is a lie.

Thank you for that video.

That witness sure does back up DeeDee's story. Same tone and all.

 

[Excon]

re: What questions would you like answered at the Zimmerman trial? [W:209]

Now you've lied twice. Time to ignore you. This level of ignorance, lies and general makeupfactsitis exhibited by you is not conducive for an honest discussion. I'll just post DeeDee's entire interview so people can determine you're a liar without me just typing it.

:doh
:lamo
DeeDee is the known liar here.


And here is a link to transcript of her sworn statement. You know, the one where she lied. :lamo

http://www.talkleft.com/zimm/deedeestatetranscript.pdf

 

[dolphinocean]

re: What questions would you like answered at the Zimmerman trial? [W:209]

Do you like not knowing the evidence in toto? Or what it actually says?

start @ 31:45

Then I really... I... I started screaming for help
And .. he covered my nose with one hand, and then my mouth with the other one
and tells me to "shut the **** up" and ah, I couldn't breath, I was suffocating.​

Now you can go around pretending that ™ was trying to suffocate him instead of silencing him all you want. It just makes ™ seem more hostile.

Or you can look at the evidence in toto and see what it says.

So, zimmerman claimed Trayvon slammed his head repeatedly into the concrete until he couldn't slammed anymore and still didn't put a dent into zimmerman's hardcore head, i.e. no dizziness, no loss of consciousness but on the contrary it made zimmerman more alert and more conscious to be aware of every fine detail of what Trayvon was doing to him and what his jacket was doing in the dark. After that Trayvon had to pummel zimmerman face repeatedly and again without any success, i.e. no swelling face, no black eyes, no bruising and no broken and swollen lip or broken teeth. Then, Trayvon was said to silent zimmerman's scream by putting all his weight by pressing his hands on zimmerman's nose and mouth and yet we could hear the loud and continuous blood curdling scream in the background of a 911 call.

Obviously, zimmerman's story is proving that his life is not in imminent danger since by his own account Trayvon was just like a five year old who was incapable of causing any serious serious bodily harm let alone imminent danger.

 

[dolphinocean]

re: What questions would you like answered at the Zimmerman trial? [W:209]

I might add that zimmerman claimed that he believed the police was there somewhere nearby when the alleged attack by Trayvon was going on. That's why he screamed so he could get the attention of the police nearby. With his own proven account of how inept Trayvon was in causing him any serious harm, zimmerman had no justification to shoot and kill Trayvon in that 40 second time span of encounter which he caused to happen.

 

[tashatexas77048]

re: What questions would you like answered at the Zimmerman trial? [W:209]

Witness Summary:
The interview was conducted by Florida Assistant State Attorney Bernie de la Rionda. She says that Trayvon told her that a white man in a car was watching him from a car. He said that the man watching was on the phone. Trayvon said that he was going to start walking. Phone hung up and she called him back. He said the man was still watching him. He put his hoodie on because it was still raining. She told him to run to his dad’s house. He said that he would run. She heard Trayvon running and could hear the wind. Trayvon said that he lost the guy. Then, he told her the guy was coming closer to him. She heard Trayvon say “Why you following me for?” An old man said, “What are you doing around here?” She called Trayvon’s name and he didn’t answer. She said someone bumped him, and she heard the phone drop. She could hear a little bit of sound. Trayvon was saying “Get off, get off.” Then, the phone hung up. She called him back two or three times. She states she has guilt about the situation.
*************

Here is a summary of DeeDee's statement, I'm sure someone can find the entire transcript. DeeDee says Trayvon thought he had lost Zimmerman until suddenly Zimmerman was on his tail again and coming closer to Martin.

Clearly DeeDee's story is that Martin tried to get away from Zimmerman but had stopped running because he thought he lost him. When he saw Zimmerman again she told him to run again but he said he wouldn't run because he was already tired. Martin thought that by running off the road and in between houses he would lose Zimmerman who was in a vehicle so he had no idea that Zimmerman had actually gotten out of his car and went after him until he saw Zimmerman outside of his car and approaching him in the dark.

I would like to know why Buck would wake up on a bright Sunday morning and post lies on this forum and expect no rebuttal. DeeDee clearly said Zimmerman approached Martin, that is a fact. It doesn't matter if she says Martin said are you following me first or Zimmerman asked why he was there first the point is Zimmerman approached Martin, lied about approaching him and lied about the fact that he had questioned Martin. Why if all of his actions are legally justified?

 

[sharon]

re: What questions would you like answered at the Zimmerman trial? [W:209]

All of the versions are the same. T approached Z, hit Z in the nose, got on top of him, hit his head to the concrete, punched him a few times, covered his nose/mouth, reached for the gun. Every single version George has told is the same.

You look at meaningless and slight differences in the narrative and insist it's just another version. It's not. It's why Serino, who is aware of all of this and has a lot of experience, indicated that there are a few, insignificant inconsistencies. These few insignificant inconsistencies becomes something much more significant to you and those like you.

Whether Trayvon ran or skipped, whether T approached and said "you got a problem homie" or "what you following me for" is so unimportant and are the same thing stated in different ways.

Have you listened to the interviews George had with Serino and Singleton and SPD?

 

[Excon]

re: What questions would you like answered at the Zimmerman trial? [W:209]

So, zimmerman claimed Trayvon slammed his head repeatedly into the concrete until he couldn't slammed anymore and still didn't put a dent into zimmerman's hardcore head, i.e. no dizziness, no loss of consciousness but on the contrary it made zimmerman more alert and more conscious to be aware of every fine detail of what Trayvon was doing to him and what his jacket was doing in the dark.
After that Trayvon had to pummel zimmerman face repeatedly and again without any success, i.e. no swelling face, no black eyes, no bruising and no broken and swollen lip or broken teeth. Then, Trayvon was said to silent zimmerman's scream by putting all his weight by pressing his hands on zimmerman's nose and mouth and yet we could hear the loud and continuous blood curdling scream in the background of a 911 call.

Wrong!
That is your spin and not the evidence.
And you clearly know not of what you speak.

 

[SheWolf]

re: What questions would you like answered at the Zimmerman trial? [W:209]

It's funny that Z is trying.to.explain Trayvon's intent in the first.

And the reason Excon is having trouble explaining why Z left the car, to follow Trayvon or to get a street sign is because Z's story hasn't been consistent about following Trayvon or not.