What is your definition of resisting arrest?

MaggieD · Nov 25, 2011

LEO says, "You're under arrest. Come with me."

After a LEO says that to you, at what point are you considered to be resisting arrest?

Jetboogieman · Nov 25, 2011

Are you talking about on the street or in the bedroom?

Because one goes very well for me, the other... not so much :lol:

Temporal · Nov 25, 2011

MaggieD said:
LEO says, "You're under arrest. Come with me."

If that's all they said, I would ask to know the charges. If they don't give any, then I would resist to the fullest. We live in turbulent times and who knows what they could do with you.

Not that I would ever end up in a position to be arrested in the first place!

HonestJoe · Nov 25, 2011

I'm not sure how relevant my opinion would be. There will be legal difinitions of it which are key.

This seesm to make sense to me though;

Resisting arrest - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Resisting arrest is a term used to describe a criminal charge against an individual who has committed, depending on the jurisdiction, at least one of the following acts:

- threatening a police officer with physical violence while being arrested
- physically struggling to get out from being restrained (handcuffed or put into the police vehicle)
- attacking a police officer while being arrested
- providing an officer with false identification (either verbally or by presentation of a false official document, i.e. a fake ID)

MaggieD · Nov 25, 2011

Temporal said:
If that's all they said, I would ask to know the charges. If they don't give any, then I would resist to the fullest. We live in turbulent times and who knows what they could do with you.

Not that I would ever end up in a position to be arrested in the first place!

Let's assume you're a protester who has been ordered to leave private property.

HonestJoe said:
I'm not sure how relevant my opinion would be. There will be legal difinitions of it which are key.

This seesm to make sense to me though;

Resisting arrest is a term used to describe a criminal charge against an individual who has committed, depending on the jurisdiction, at least one of the following acts:

- threatening a police officer with physical violence while being arrested
- physically struggling to get out from being restrained (handcuffed or put into the police vehicle)
- attacking a police officer while being arrested
- providing an officer with false identification (either verbally or by presentation of a false official document, i.e. a fake ID)

Do you think you are resisting arrest when the policeman takes you by the arm and you refuse to move?

HonestJoe · Nov 25, 2011

MaggieD said:
Do you think you are resisting arrest when the policeman takes you by the arm and you refuse to move?

If it's an attempt to arrest you then yes, that would be "physically struggling to get out from being restrained".

If it wasn't an attempt to arrest you but was an attempt to move you away from somewhere you have no legal right to be (such as private property the owner has asked you to leave), it wouldn't be resisting arrest (but could well be some other offence).

Ontologuy · Nov 25, 2011

I read the OP and I ask myself, "What the heck's a LEO?" So I Google "LEO definition", but I get stuff that doesn't make any contextual sense. Then I pause, thinking, well, it must have something to do with law enforcement, so I position my cursor in front of "LEO definition" to key, and get about as far as "law enforc" before, well .. Okay, laugh at me, go ahead, laugh, ha ha ha, he's not very bright, rather sloooooowwww I'd say, ... :3oops:

Okay, first the "LEO" has to say "you're under arrest ...", then if I do anything that can reasonably be deemed an act intending to interfere in any way with the LEO's process of arresting me, I think that qualifies.

Even if I've not been arrested, if a LEO directs me to do something and I refuse to comply, then I'm resisting a LEO, though not (yet) resisting arrest.

Okay, I may be slow, but look how quickly I adapted to the use of a term!

Tigger · Nov 25, 2011

MaggieD said:
LEO says, "You're under arrest. Come with me."

After a LEO says that to you, at what point are you considered to be resisting arrest?

...At any point where you are not directly following his orders and doing exactly what you've been told to do.

Tigger · Nov 25, 2011

MaggieD said:
Let's assume you're a protester who has been ordered to leave private property.

The first moment you are not moving to comply with that order, you are Resisting Arrest so far as I am concerned

MaggieD said:
Do you think you are resisting arrest when the policeman takes you by the arm and you refuse to move?

I feel you are. As I said.... Any action or inaction which is contrary to what you've been ordered to do by the Officer.

Aunt Spiker · Nov 25, 2011

MaggieD said:
LEO says, "You're under arrest. Come with me."

After a LEO says that to you, at what point are you considered to be resisting arrest?

When you don't let them cuff and arrest you.

Risky Thicket · Nov 25, 2011

MaggieD said:
Let's assume you're a protester who has been ordered to leave private property.

Do you think you are resisting arrest when the policeman takes you by the arm and you refuse to move?

If you refuse to leave private property when asked by the property owner or legal custodian of the property or by a cop, then you have broken the law. Yes, if you don't move when the cop takes you by the arm and places you under arrest you can be charged with resisting arrest.

MaggieD · Nov 25, 2011

Tigger said:
...At any point where you are not directly following his orders and doing exactly what you've been told to do.

Risky Thicket said:
If you refuse to leave private property when asked by the property owner or legal custodian of the property or by a cop, then you have broken the law. Yes, if you don't move when the cop takes you by the arm and places you under arrest you can be charged with resisting arrest.

The reason for my posting this question is to clarify what resisting arrest means -- and ask posters to put this in context with the UC-Davis protesters who were pepper sprayed for refusing direct orders to leave and then resisting arrest by linking arms.

I just wonder what we expect LEOs to do in situations like this. They'd been ordered to clear the area. Is it then necessary to use Sumo Wrestling techniques to arrest them when they refuse to do so? Other than letting these people continue tresspassing on private property, what should the police have done?

Thunder · Nov 25, 2011

MaggieD said:
LEO says, "You're under arrest. Come with me."

After a LEO says that to you, at what point are you considered to be resisting arrest?

when he in any way physically resists being cuffed, put in the squad car, etc.

Risky Thicket · Nov 25, 2011

Well, it gets a bit sticky at this point. If the students were enrolled at UC-Davis and if they were sitting peacefully in a university/public area the resisting arrest question gets a little dodgy. I'm not an lawyer, but I think there may be a problem. Can the university president direct the university police to commit unlawful acts? Yes, she can. She can direct them to do anything she wants. They have a legal obligation to follow the law. If she directs them to act unlawfully they have a legal obligation to refuse her direction.

In my opinion it's going to come down to a finger pointing between the UC-Davis president and the UC-Davis Chief of Police and the students. The first and most obvious move will be to justify the police action by identifying unlawful behavior. Next, and I think this will be a real problem is to justify excessive force. If they cannot successfully accomplish either then the battle will rage on between who takes the blame for pepper spraying students. The UC-Davis Top Cop will lose that one because no matter what the president said it is the Chief's responsibility to know the law. Of course the Board of Trustees could come in a fire both of them. Or it might be that the courts find the students were acting unlawfully and that the force used by the police was justified in reducing the the threat. (That one's going to be difficult as I see it.)

Temporal · Nov 25, 2011

MaggieD said:
Let's assume you're a protester who has been ordered to leave private property.

Depends on the situation. If the private property being inhabited is guilty of crimes against humanity or is directly responsible for the destruction of society, then I may just resist. If there are so many people there that it's practically an open revolt, then I would probably fight police.

This is all hypothetical though. I guess my point is, the police do not get automatic carte blanche on anything. They have to demonstrate probable cause and, in some cases, just cause. Some causes are worth being arrested for.

But again... I can't imagine myself in a situation where I would be faced with this.

radcen · Nov 25, 2011

MaggieD said:
LEO says, "You're under arrest. Come with me."

After a LEO says that to you, at what point are you considered to be resisting arrest?

I have heard said that simply saying "no" can be considered as resisting arrest. And it seems to be fast becoming one of those "let's throw some **** against the wall and hope something sticks" kind of charges.

I have concerns because it seems to be being over-used to the point of being abused, of late.

radcen · Nov 25, 2011

MaggieD said:
Do you think you are resisting arrest when the policeman takes you by the arm and you refuse to move?

In THIS case, I would consider it resisting arrest, also, but... I would also classify it as civil disobedience, so any complaints are hypocritical. You're doing what you're doing purposely to make a point. Points often have consequences. Deal with it.

MaggieD · Nov 25, 2011

radcen said:
In THIS case, I would consider it resisting arrest, also, but... I would also classify it as civil disobedience, so any complaints are hypocritical. You're doing what you're doing purposely to make a point. Points often have consequences. Deal with it.

WTF does that mean??

Tigger · Nov 25, 2011

MaggieD said:
WTF does that mean??

It means that when you go out to purposely cause trouble you can't be surprised when you find more of it than you counted on. Or.... Careful what you wish for, you might just get it.

Risky Thicket · Nov 25, 2011

"Purposely to cause trouble" is a in the California and/or Davis criminal code? I suspect Tigger and radcen are on shaky ground with purposely to cause trouble.

Risky Thicket · Nov 25, 2011

radcen said:
In THIS case, I would consider it resisting arrest, also, but... I would also classify it as civil disobedience, so any complaints are hypocritical. You're doing what you're doing purposely to make a point. Points often have consequences. Deal with it.

So if the president of UC-Davis had ordered the students to be beaten and shot it would be within the university's right to do so, according to radcen.

MaggieD · Nov 25, 2011

Risky Thicket said:
So if the president of UC-Davis had ordered the students to be beaten and shot it would be within the university's right to do so, according to radcen.

That's not what he said. I'm not sure what he said there, but he didn't imply what you infer.

Risky Thicket · Nov 25, 2011

MaggieD said:
That's not what he said. I'm not sure what he said there, but he didn't imply what you infer.

Oops! Sorry then. I'm watching football and posting. I'm not sure what he meant.

Aunt Spiker · Nov 25, 2011

Risky Thicket said:
So if the president of UC-Davis had ordered the students to be beaten and shot it would be within the university's right to do so, according to radcen.

Yeah sure - if the President of UC-Davis had the power to tell the police force what to do and if the police had adequate reason to use lethal force But that's not how things work.

jamesrage · Nov 25, 2011

MaggieD said:
LEO says, "You're under arrest. Come with me."

After a LEO says that to you, at what point are you considered to be resisting arrest?

If you are asking for one's personal opinion on what resisting arrest is then I list the following-

1.Trying to fight or physically struggle with the police officer so that he or she may not arrest you.

2.Running away/fleeing form the police officer.

3.Deliberately hanging onto someone or something so that the police officer can not physically remove you.

3.Refusing to get up in order to deliberately impair the police officer's ability to arrest you.

4.Giving false ID,which may include lying about your own ID or whereabouts.

5.Barricading yourself in order to prevent police officer form arresting you. This does not include your home, because anyone should be allowed to put bars on the outside of their home,reenforce their doors or even put a brace on the door so that thugs will not be able to kick the door down.

6.Making threats against the police officer.This includes trying to extort or black mail the police officer into not arresting you as well as trying to threaten the police officer's job.

7.Trying to bribe a police officer into not arresting you.

What is your definition of resisting arrest?

MaggieD

Jetboogieman

Somewhere in Babylon

Temporal

HonestJoe

MaggieD

HonestJoe

Ontologuy

Tigger

Tigger

Aunt Spiker

Cheese

Risky Thicket

Sewer Rat

MaggieD

Thunder

Risky Thicket

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Temporal

radcen

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MaggieD

Tigger

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MaggieD

Risky Thicket

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Aunt Spiker

Cheese

jamesrage

What is your definition of resisting arrest?

Somewhere in Babylon

Cheese

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