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What End of Bush Tax Cuts Means for You [W: 1475]

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Taylor said:
I think you know the answer to that. At least, I hope you do.
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Sorry I pulled a Conservative, my bad.

It numbs one's mind talking with that guy.

Politicians always put up cuts and then.....

So what cuts are we talking about from an out going politician trying to make his party look good?
 
winston53660 said:
Politicians always put up cuts and then.....

So what cuts are we talking about from an out going politician trying to make his party look good?
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Outgoing politicians don't know who will take over for them when they write their last budget, so it would be to make themselves look good if anything(?)

Too many cuts to list them all. Here's a sample - a good chunk of the programs slated for elimination in the Dept. of Education.
Looking through the list, you can see why the Dems did not act on the Bush budget:

Alaska Native Education Equity ................................................................................................................................................... 33 — 33
Alcohol Abuse Reduction ............................................................................................................................................................... 32 — 32
Arts in Education ............................................................................................................................................................................... 38 — 38
B.J. Stupak Olympic Scholarships .............................................................................................................................................. 1 — 1
Byrd Honors Scholarships.............................................................................................................................................................. 40 — 40
Career and Technical Education National Programs............................................................................................................. 8 — 8
Career and Technical Education State Grants ........................................................................................................................ 1,161 — 1,161
Civic Education................................................................................................................................................................................... 32 — 32
Close-Up Fellowships ...................................................................................................................................................................... 2 — 2
Comprehensive School Reform................................................................................................................................................... 2 — 2
Education for Native Hawaiians.................................................................................................................................................... 33 — 33
Educational Technology State Grants........................................................................................................................................ 267 — 267
Elementary and Secondary School Counseling ..................................................................................................................... 49 — 49
Even Start............................................................................................................................................................................................. 66 — 66
Excellence in Economic Education............................................................................................................................................. 1 — 1
Foundations for Learning................................................................................................................................................................ 1 — 1
Higher Education Demonstrations for Students with Disabilities ...................................................................................... 7 — 7
Historic Whaling and Trading Partners ...................................................................................................................................... 9 — 9
Javits Gifted and Talented Education......................................................................................................................................... 7 — 7
Leveraging Educational Assistance Programs ........................................................................................................................ 64 — 64
Mental Health Integration in Schools ......................................................................................................................................... 5 — 5
Mentoring Program........................................................................................................................................................................... 49 — 49
National Writing Project................................................................................................................................................................... 24 — 24
Parental Assistance Information Centers ................................................................................................................................. 39 — 39
Perkins Loan Cancellations ........................................................................................................................................................... 64 — 64
Physical Education............................................................................................................................................................................ 76 — 76
Projects with Industry....................................................................................................................................................................... 19 — 19
Reading is Fundamental................................................................................................................................................................. 25 — 25
Ready to Teach .................................................................................................................................................................................. 11 — 11
School Leadership ............................................................................................................................................................................ 14 — 14
Smaller Learning Communities .................................................................................................................................................... 80 — 80
Special Olympics Education Programs ..................................................................................................................................... 12 — 12
 
Taylor said:
Outgoing politicians don't know who will take over for them when they write their last budget, so it would be to make themselves look good if anything(?)

Too many cuts to list them all. Here's a sample - a good chunk of the programs slated for elimination in the Dept. of Education.
Looking through the list, you can see why the Dems did not act on the Bush budget:

Alaska Native Education Equity ................................................................................................................................................... 33 — 33
Alcohol Abuse Reduction ............................................................................................................................................................... 32 — 32
Arts in Education ............................................................................................................................................................................... 38 — 38
B.J. Stupak Olympic Scholarships .............................................................................................................................................. 1 — 1
Byrd Honors Scholarships.............................................................................................................................................................. 40 — 40
Career and Technical Education National Programs............................................................................................................. 8 — 8
Career and Technical Education State Grants ........................................................................................................................ 1,161 — 1,161
Civic Education................................................................................................................................................................................... 32 — 32
Close-Up Fellowships ...................................................................................................................................................................... 2 — 2
Comprehensive School Reform................................................................................................................................................... 2 — 2
Education for Native Hawaiians.................................................................................................................................................... 33 — 33
Educational Technology State Grants........................................................................................................................................ 267 — 267
Elementary and Secondary School Counseling ..................................................................................................................... 49 — 49
Even Start............................................................................................................................................................................................. 66 — 66
Excellence in Economic Education............................................................................................................................................. 1 — 1
Foundations for Learning................................................................................................................................................................ 1 — 1
Higher Education Demonstrations for Students with Disabilities ...................................................................................... 7 — 7
Historic Whaling and Trading Partners ...................................................................................................................................... 9 — 9
Javits Gifted and Talented Education......................................................................................................................................... 7 — 7
Leveraging Educational Assistance Programs ........................................................................................................................ 64 — 64
Mental Health Integration in Schools ......................................................................................................................................... 5 — 5
Mentoring Program........................................................................................................................................................................... 49 — 49
National Writing Project................................................................................................................................................................... 24 — 24
Parental Assistance Information Centers ................................................................................................................................. 39 — 39
Perkins Loan Cancellations ........................................................................................................................................................... 64 — 64
Physical Education............................................................................................................................................................................ 76 — 76
Projects with Industry....................................................................................................................................................................... 19 — 19
Reading is Fundamental................................................................................................................................................................. 25 — 25
Ready to Teach .................................................................................................................................................................................. 11 — 11
School Leadership ............................................................................................................................................................................ 14 — 14
Smaller Learning Communities .................................................................................................................................................... 80 — 80
Special Olympics Education Programs ..................................................................................................................................... 12 — 12
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LOL Alaskan cuts when the VP candidate is from Alaska. Ya gotta be kidding me.

BTW do you have a link?
 
Unfortunately I closed the window. I think if you go to the wiki page for the 2009 budget, they reference "summary tables" (something like that) - will give you a summary of Bush's 2009 budget and how that compared to the 2008 budget (among other things). Program cuts and cancelations were toward the end, with spending increases at the very end.
 
Taylor said:
The 2009 budget is what's relevant here. When you look at that one you'll see that the FY2009 budget was not signed by Bush, but by Obama.

[...]

So you see, Bush had much less to do with the 2009 budget than you think.
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WTF???

Bush signed a continuing budget resolution to keep the government going for the first half of FY2009 and then Obama signed one for the second half. Bush is responsible for half of FY2009; and in reality, more than that given the state of the economy he passed on to Obama.

Bush signs continuing resolution extending E-Verify until March 6, 2009 - 10/15/08
 
AdamT said:
Seems conservatives have a hard time understanding this. The AHCA raises over all health care spending, but *reduces* government health care spending. Thus, repealing AHCA would increase the debt.
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Malarkey. It will IF the numbers on Medicare and Medicaid do not increase (they are because emplyers are finding paying fines cheaper than insuring people), IF health care costs do not rise from all the taxes and regulation pushed onto areas of healthcare that were not taxed as much like prosthetics, semipermanent medical equipment, medical paraphanalia (costs are up).

It decreases costs in unicorn, fairy fantasy land. In the real world its creating a staggering shortfall of nearly a trillion dollars in unfunded or underfunded liabilities.
 
Catawba said:
[h=3]Why the Senate hasn't passed a budget[/h]
"It is true that the Senate can pass a budget resolution with a simple majority vote. But for that budget resolution to take effect, it must have either the cooperation of the house, or at least 60 votes in the Senate."

Parliamentary procedure: Why the Senate hasn't passed a budget | The Economist
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LOL, so the reason the Senate hasn't submitted a budget is because they don't think it will pass the House? Not a very Brilliant argument, typical of you. You said it required a fillibuster proof vote and that is wrong, just another subject you know little about
 
Taylor said:
As I already explained, Obama had nothing to do with the 2008 budget. It was closed out months before he took office. He wasn't "handed" the 2008 budget. The first budget he got a hold of was the 2009 budget, and that was largely handed to him by his own party.
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Winston doesn't understand that the fiscal year of the U.S. Runs from October to September thus the 2009 budget went into effect on October 1, 2008 and it was stonewalled by Democrats. Obama actually signed the budget in 2009 after increasing spending
 
winston53660 said:
The 09 budget was what signed by Obama 2, 4 months in into his trm in office? He got handed a trillion dollar plus deficit budget.
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No he wasn't, he was handed a projected deficit and that deficit didn't include the stimulus or Afghanistan supplemental or the GM/Chrysler bailout. It also included TARP but much of that was paid back only to be recycled by Obama
 
OpportunityCost said:
Malarkey. It will IF the numbers on Medicare and Medicaid do not increase (they are because emplyers are finding paying fines cheaper than insuring people), IF health care costs do not rise from all the taxes and regulation pushed onto areas of healthcare that were not taxed as much like prosthetics, semipermanent medical equipment, medical paraphanalia (costs are up).

It decreases costs in unicorn, fairy fantasy land. In the real world its creating a staggering shortfall of nearly a trillion dollars in unfunded or underfunded liabilities.
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Like I said, it will reduce costs considerably according to the best available estimates. And while those estimates admittedly aren't very reliable ... they are still the best available.
 
winston53660 said:
Sorry I pulled a Conservative, my bad.

It numbs one's mind talking with that guy.

Politicians always put up cuts and then.....

So what cuts are we talking about from an out going politician trying to make his party look good?
Click to expand...

And like all liberals you ignore data and use projections in trying to make a point. All that does is make you look foolish although most liberals aren't smart enough to figure out how wrong you are
 
AdamT said:
I was just referring to federal spending, and yeah, based upon CBO estimates because, as flawed as they are, they're the best we've got.
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This is a good example of what frustrates me about many of your posts. I have to believe that itellectually you understand that the CBO numbers were gamed by Pelosi and Reid yet you cling to them. Next if anyone complains the script says that Republicans used it when it suited them and no one complained them. If do do not know that those numbers are beyond belief, and if you think you can add 30+ million people to anything and it will cost less, especially something like medical care which increases b by orders of magnitude to inflation annually then don't know what to tell you.
 
washunut said:
This is a good example of what frustrates me about many of your posts. I have to believe that itellectually you understand that the CBO numbers were gamed by Pelosi and Reid yet you cling to them. Next if anyone complains the script says that Republicans used it when it suited them and no one complained them. If do do not know that those numbers are beyond belief, and if you think you can add 30+ million people to anything and it will cost less, especially something like medical care which increases b by orders of magnitude to inflation annually then don't know what to tell you.
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How did Pelosi and Reid "game" the CBO numbers, specifically?
 
AdamT said:
How did Pelosi and Reid "game" the CBO numbers, specifically?
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Let me help here, CBO takes assumptions given them by Congress and if those assumptions are wrong then the projections are wrong. Obamacare was never about quality or cost control as it was always about access and access only. Congress always "games" CBO and CBO recognizes it. Go to their site and read "about CBO"
 
Conservative said:
Let me help here, CBO takes assumptions given them by Congress and if those assumptions are wrong then the projections are wrong. Obamacare was never about quality or cost control as it was always about access and access only. Congress always "games" CBO and CBO recognizes it. Go to their site and read "about CBO"
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That doesn't help at all. How did Pelosi and Reid "game" the CBO numbers, SPECIFICALLY?
 
Taylor said:
Yeah, they took it down to the deadline - wasn't introduced until late February, a month after Obama took office, and took another month to go through Congress.

Obama wasn't handed a trillion dollar deficit - the budget that Bush wrote called for hundreds of billions less in spending - cut a bunch of programs, scaled back Medicare/Medicaid to the tune of $200B, etc. etc. - as I said, it was for the most part ignored.
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You are wrong on multiple points.

The FY 2009 was already hammered out for the most part in 2008, and the signing off of various appropriations was done before Obama was sworn in. Example:

"Just prior to the start of the FY 2009 budget year on October 1, 2008, the complete FY 2009 appropriations bills for the Departments of Homeland Security, Veterans Affairs, and Defense were signed into law."

Those "scaled back" MC/MD budgets were going to be spread out over 5 years, NOT in the one year of 2009. The projected spending in FY2009 for Medicare was $420B, actual spending was $430B.

You can also see that FY2009 was a $3.1T budget, actual spending came in at $3.5T, I believe most of that difference came in the form of UI and stimulus spending.
The reason the deficit was so much higher was due to the lack of revenue, the expected/budgeted deficit was supposed to be $4B, actual was $1.4T.
 
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Sheik Yerbuti said:
:damn


He voted for it?? I love how you just make stuff up out of whole cloth to fit your political agenda.


H.R. 2638: U.S. Senate Roll Call Votes


:naughty


... next time, just let Bush take the responsibility for what he signed.
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Give Conservative a break. Because Obama didn't vote, that means he voted for it. He was thinking unions here, except with unions, the Republican line is if you don't vote then you really voted no. Conservative was just extending that to the Senate, except not voting means a yes vote. It's really easy to understand........ If you are one of today's Republicans. LOL.
 
Gimmesometruth said:
You are wrong on multiple points.

The FY 2009 was already hammered out for the most part in 2008, and the signing off of various appropriations was done before Obama was sworn in:

"Just prior to the start of the FY 2009 budget year on October 1, 2008, the complete FY 2009 appropriations bills for the Departments of Homeland Security, Veterans Affairs, and Defense were signed into law."

Those "scaled back" MC/MD budgets were going to be spread out over 5 years, NOT in the one year of 2009. The projected spending in FY2009 for Medicare was $420B, actual spending was $430B.

You can also see that FY2009 was a $3.1T budget, actual spending came in at $3.5T, I believe most of that difference came in the form of UI and stimulus spending.
The reason the deficit was so much higher was due to the lack of revenue, the expected/budgeted deficit was supposed to be $4B, actual was $1.4T.
Click to expand...

Those are called continuing resolutions and not a complete budget. What you and others fail to recognize is that we are in 2012 and Obama still doesn't have a clue how our economy works and keeps demonizing capitalism.
 
Gimmesometruth said:
You are wrong on multiple points.

The FY 2009 was already hammered out for the most part in 2008, and the signing off of various appropriations was done before Obama was sworn in:

"Just prior to the start of the FY 2009 budget year on October 1, 2008, the complete FY 2009 appropriations bills for the Departments of Homeland Security, Veterans Affairs, and Defense were signed into law."

Those "scaled back" MC/MD budgets were going to be spread out over 5 years, NOT in the one year of 2009. The projected spending in FY2009 for Medicare was $420B, actual spending was $430B.

You can also see that FY2009 was a $3.1T budget, actual spending came in at $3.5T, I believe most of that difference came in the form of UI and stimulus spending.
The reason the deficit was so much higher was due to the lack of revenue, the expected/budgeted deficit was supposed to be $4B, actual was $1.4T.
Click to expand...
The projected deficit of $4 billion was much earlier in 2008, before the economy collapsed. The CBO came out with a new projection in early 2009, before Obama was even in office, based on the housing and credit markets' collapse and estimated the shortfall would be around $1.2 trillion. Their estimate was not off by much.
 
Conservative said:
Those are called continuing resolutions and not a complete budget. What you and others fail to recognize is that we are in 2012 and Obama still doesn't have a clue how our economy works and keeps demonizing capitalism.
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Meanwhile, the private sector has produced a net gain of jobs under Obama. Something Bush couldn't accomplish in his 8 years in office.
 
Sheik Yerbuti said:
Meanwhile, the private sector has produced a net gain of jobs under Obama. Something Bush couldn't accomplish in his 8 years in office.
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There is no net gain in employment from when the recession began and in fact is down about 4 million jobs, high number of discouraged workers each month, and 5.2 trillion added to the debt in less than 4 years. If you spent that kind of money and got these results you would be fired. Liberals like you would never survive me
 
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