What are your views on Huey Long?

[Nomad4Ever]

His wiki page is pretty robust and is probably the best free resource out there. There are some good books but not as easily available online. A quick summary for those who don't know who he was in my own words;

Basically he was what I can only describe as a mob boss left wing politician. The most interesting thing about him is he is probably the only example of an authoritarian who actually did seem to genuinely care people. He used extreme measures to get people to vote for his bills, even going as far as arresting politicians who opposed them, but then the bill he was bulling people to pass was like free literacy night schools for poor people (1930s Louisiana had very poor education, especially for Black people). He was able to get away with all this because he was staggeringly popular, mostly because he made huge insane promises...but he actually did do them and life got noticeably better for many people in the state during his governorship.

Some quick excerpts from his wiki.

Huey Long - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Huey Pierce Long Jr. (August 30, 1893 – September 10, 1935), byname "The Kingfish", was an American politician who served as the 40th governor of Louisiana from 1928 to 1932 and as a United States senator from 1932 until his assassination in 1935.

In 1915, Long established a private practice in Winnfield. He represented poor plaintiffs, usually in workers' compensation cases.

After earning the Democratic nomination, he easily defeated the Republican nominee in the general election with 96.1 percent of the vote.[52] At age 35, Long was the youngest person ever elected governor of Louisiana.

He would appear unannounced on the floor of both the House and Senate or in House committees, corralling reluctant representatives and state senators and bullying opponents.[59][60] When an opposing legislator once suggested Long was unfamiliar with the Louisiana Constitution, he declared, "I'm the Constitution around here now."

Long was unusual among southern populists in that he achieved tangible progress. Williams concluded "the secret of Long's power, in the final analysis, was not in his machine or his political dealings but in his record—he delivered something".

Long's night schools taught 100,000 adults to read.[21] His provision of free textbooks contributed to a 20 percent increase in school enrollment.[121] He modernized public health facilities and ensured adequate conditions for the mentally ill.[117] He established Louisiana's first rehabilitation program for penitentiary inmates.[122] Through tax reform, Long made the first $2,000 in property assessment free, waiving property taxes for half the state's homeowners.

And of course his absolutely incredible Share Our Wealth plan to end the Great Depression.

Huey Long - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

At the time he was compared to Hitler, Stalin, or Marx. But I think we have a more analogous example in the modern day. Really he was more like a left wing version of Trump, except objectively MORE authoritarian, MORE of a demagogue, and MORE corrupt.

I think he is interesting because it presents a sort of "do the ends justify the means" kind of question.

Huey Long Quotes: In His Own Words

Explore Huey Long’s most famous quotes—his bold words on politics, power, and the forces that shaped his reforms and fiercest political battles.

www.hueylong.com

 

[Nomad4Ever]

I think I would have supported him at the time, but his tactics would be dangerous and destabilizing today.

At the time, at lot of what he did wasn't actually that out of the norm for Louisiana. Only previous politicians had used the power to collude with the oil companies or KKK while repressing political opposition. He is correct that if he had played by the rules his bills likely wouldn't have passed. For example the KKK was very powerful in the state at the time, and they opposed even his free school textbooks and night schools bill as "un-American" because it would teach "Negros" how to read.

However today I think both the harm of normalizing that kind of behavior and the damage it would do to our institutions, which are much stronger and more robust than they were in the 1930s, would outweigh any good that could be done using these kinds of methods.

What are your thoughts?

 

[Questerr]

Long was a fascist demagogue and a kleptocrat. All of his “left wing” identity and policies were purely performative. His “every man a king” bullshit was exactly that, bullshit.

He used welfare purely to enhance his public image and had no problem denying access to people and groups that didn’t kowtow to him. For instance, for all his vaunted programs to educate black people in Louisiana, when they “got uppity”, he had no problem letting the KKK and other white supremacist groups go after them.

He used the state police as his own secret police, went after political opponents, filled the government with his cronies and family members, and absolutely robbed the state blind into his own pockets.

Comparisons of him with Hitler are pretty spot on.

 

[Loulit01]

A criminal who should have been tried, convicted, and imprisoned.

 

[Nomad4Ever]

Long was a fascist demagogue and a kleptocrat. All of his “left wing” identity and policies were purely performative. His “every man a king” bullshit was exactly that, bullshit.

He used welfare purely to enhance his public image and had no problem denying access to people and groups that didn’t kowtow to him. For instance, for all his vaunted programs to educate black people in Louisiana, when they “got uppity”, he had no problem letting the KKK and other white supremacist groups go after them.

He used the state police as his own secret police, went after political opponents, filled the government with his cronies and family members, and absolutely robbed the state blind into his own pockets.

Comparisons of him with Hitler are pretty spot on.

I still feel like he was a weird left wing version of Trump more than Hitler. He politics and popularity were fueled almost exclusively on populist "little guy vs the big guy" rhetoric, and was notable to be the only Southern politician who didn't achieve power through race baiting.

I find him interesting, because as you note he was objectively corrupt and authoritarian...but his policies were also drastically better than anyone else who was running in Louisiana and probably most of the south.

It is almost like the embodiment of what conservatives think left wing politics is, which is using welfare or something to buy votes and maintain political power.

I still think for the time he was a better outcome for Luisiana than the other politicians, and many of his policies had good economic outcomes for the state that we can still see today.

 

[Questerr]

I still feel like he was a weird left wing version of Trump more than Hitler. He politics and popularity were fueled almost exclusively on populist "little guy vs the big guy" rhetoric, and was notable to be the only Southern politician who didn't achieve power through race baiting.

I find him interesting, because as you note he was objectively corrupt and authoritarian...but his policies were also drastically better than anyone else who was running in Louisiana and probably most of the south.

It is almost like the embodiment of what conservatives think left wing politics is, which is using welfare or something to buy votes and maintain political power.

I still think for the time he was a better outcome for Luisiana than the other politicians, and many of his policies had good economic outcomes for the state that we can still see today.

You realize Hitler also implemented welfare policies for groups he liked and wanted to use for his advantage like Long did right? Hitler was also a populist.

The “better outcome for Louisiana” is relative and marginal. His “good economic policies” are still resulting in some pretty terrible corruption in the state.

 

[TheParser]

I know almost nothing about him except:

1. He was feared by the Establishment as Donald Trump is today.

a. There was even talk, I believe, that he could even unseat FDR.

2. The little people in Louisiana loved him, for he promised them a better life.

3. He was a good speaker.

 

[Nomad4Ever]

You realize Hitler also implemented welfare policies for groups he liked and wanted to use for his advantage like Long did right? Hitler was also a populist.

I still think populist "common guy vs big corps" rhetoric is distinct from populist "our ethnic group vs The Jews/everyone else".

Also again, for a southern politician, and especially relative to other political candidates, he was notably less racist.

The “better outcome for Louisiana” is relative and marginal. His “good economic policies” are still resulting in some pretty terrible corruption in the state.

Imo the state was already corrupt. Government, especially local government, was just incredibly corrupt in that time. For example, firing all your political enemies and filling government positions with allies was basically common practice in Louisiana. It was the height of the Gilded Age and oil companies and the KKK were previously functionally running the state.

The way I see it is its kinda like arguing about who the "best" Roman emperor was, even though they were all varying degrees of bad. Or supporting the US revolution against the UK, even though the US was still pretty racist and had expansionary goals that were extremely bad for the Native Americans.

I'm glad he got killed when he did though. I wouldn't have wanted to see what happens if he was president.

 

[justabubba]

best thing i can post about him is that he mentored Jimmie Davis

 

[Fishking]

His wiki page is pretty robust and is probably the best free resource out there. There are some good books but not as easily available online. A quick summary for those who don't know who he was in my own words;

Basically he was what I can only describe as a mob boss left wing politician. The most interesting thing about him is he is probably the only example of an authoritarian who actually did seem to genuinely care people. He used extreme measures to get people to vote for his bills, even going as far as arresting politicians who opposed them, but then the bill he was bulling people to pass was like free literacy night schools for poor people (1930s Louisiana had very poor education, especially for Black people). He was able to get away with all this because he was staggeringly popular, mostly because he made huge insane promises...but he actually did do them and life got noticeably better for many people in the state during his governorship.

Some quick excerpts from his wiki.

Huey Long - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

And of course his absolutely incredible Share Our Wealth plan to end the Great Depression.

Huey Long - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

At the time he was compared to Hitler, Stalin, or Marx. But I think we have a more analogous example in the modern day. Really he was more like a left wing version of Trump, except objectively MORE authoritarian, MORE of a demagogue, and MORE corrupt.

I think he is interesting because it presents a sort of "do the ends justify the means" kind of question.
View attachment 67456656

Huey Long Quotes: In His Own Words

Explore Huey Long’s most famous quotes—his bold words on politics, power, and the forces that shaped his reforms and fiercest political battles.

www.hueylong.com

Authoritarian methods are very efficient. In fact, they are the most efficient, in a sense. However, they are the most easily corruptible, which is why authoritarianism has so many bad results in the end. It's not sustainable, even if you do have a "benevolent king".

Tangential point, Ceasar was actually much more for the regular people than the Roman Senate was. It's a big misconception of Roman history that the Roman Senate was for the regular people and Ceasar was this tyrant that ruined a good system. The Roman Senate was absolutely tyrannical, murderous, and oppressive.

 

[Craig234]

It was the height of the Gilded Age and oil companies and the KKK were previously functionally running the state.

Actually, the gilded age was the late 19th century, ended with Progressive reforms, but the 'Roaring 20's' returned to great inequality and brought the Great Republican Depression.

 

[Tigerace117]

All hail the American Union State!

Which is probably what Huey’s most known for these days anyway.

 

[Fearandloathing]

His wiki page is pretty robust and is probably the best free resource out there. There are some good books but not as easily available online. A quick summary for those who don't know who he was in my own words;

Basically he was what I can only describe as a mob boss left wing politician. The most interesting thing about him is he is probably the only example of an authoritarian who actually did seem to genuinely care people. He used extreme measures to get people to vote for his bills, even going as far as arresting politicians who opposed them, but then the bill he was bulling people to pass was like free literacy night schools for poor people (1930s Louisiana had very poor education, especially for Black people). He was able to get away with all this because he was staggeringly popular, mostly because he made huge insane promises...but he actually did do them and life got noticeably better for many people in the state during his governorship.

Some quick excerpts from his wiki.

Huey Long - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

And of course his absolutely incredible Share Our Wealth plan to end the Great Depression.

Huey Long - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

At the time he was compared to Hitler, Stalin, or Marx. But I think we have a more analogous example in the modern day. Really he was more like a left wing version of Trump, except objectively MORE authoritarian, MORE of a demagogue, and MORE corrupt.

I think he is interesting because it presents a sort of "do the ends justify the means" kind of question.
View attachment 67456656

Huey Long Quotes: In His Own Words

Explore Huey Long’s most famous quotes—his bold words on politics, power, and the forces that shaped his reforms and fiercest political battles.

www.hueylong.com

How do you 'support' a guy who's been dead nearly a century?

You cannot judge history with any accuracy unless you know the whole story, and you need to be a fully informed historian who takes the culture of the times into account. In the old south a man could be forced to watch his family hanged because he was nice to a black man they had different names for blacks we can't even say today without being banned from this site.

So you're trying to measure water with a sieve as completely different rules apply. None of the people in my dad's generation, seen to be liberal at least racially, EVER used the "N" word, but they never said "black" either. The words they found acceptable to them are not today. As an aside, it was how "brother" came about as blacks needed a friendly expression for white friends.

I read a book about him in my teens and saw a movie. That's not sound data on which to form an opinion