We have a Spending Problem, NOT a tax revenue problem

[Conservative]

interest on the debt has gone down?

how did that happen? we refinance our loan?

Record low interest rates by the Fed affect the debt service due to a very weak economy that Obama hasn't improved.

 

[Conservative]

Wrong. bush* was given a surplus, but destroyed it because republicans want to destroy the economy so they can make money short-selling bonds.

The U.S. Treasury which is the bank account of the United States and the source for debt numbers doesn't show a surplus. There was no surplus given to Bush as the debt grew every year

 

[sangha]

Oh, good lord, what does Obama have to do with interest rates? unbelieveable how brainwashed you are. Please tell me that all this is for attention?

conservative thinks economic policies have NO affect on interest rates!!

 

[sangha]

The U.S. Treasury which is the bank account of the United States and the source for debt numbers doesn't show a surplus. There was no surplus given to Bush as the debt grew every year

Of course they don't show a surplus. bush* spent the surplus because republicans want to destroy the economy so they can make money short-selling govt bonds

 

[Conservative]

conservative thinks economic policies have NO affect on interest rates!!

Obama's sure have, they have kept the economy very week and thus the Fed has kept record low interest rates which affect debt service. Guess you ignored the Obama record.

0bama record, 14.7 officially unemployed with 15.8% total unemployment, 4 trillion added to the debt, double digit misery index, 1.8% GDP growth, record budgets, no leadership skills at all, 29 fund raisers, 76 rounds of golf. Yes, that is leadership and a record to be proud of.

January 2001-December 2007 7.1% to 8.8%
January 2008-December 2008 8.8% to 13.6
January 2009-May 201114.1-15.8%

 

[Sheik Yerbuti]

0bama record, 14.7 officially unemployed with 15.8% total unemployment, 4 trillion added to the debt, double digit misery index, 1.8% GDP growth, record budgets, no leadership skills at all, 29 fund raisers, 76 rounds of golf. Yes, that is leadership and a record to be proud of.

January 2001-December 2007 7.1% to 8.8%
January 2008-December 2008 8.8% to 13.6
January 2009-May 201114.1-15.8%

I responded to your post. :lamo :lamo :lamo

You posted those numbers. Now you cry because I point out the sucking head wound in the numbers you posted????

:naughty

 

[sangha]

Obama's sure have, they have kept the economy very week and thus the Fed has kept record low interest rates which affect debt service. Guess you ignored the Obama record.

0bama record, 14.7 officially unemployed with 15.8% total unemployment, 4 trillion added to the debt, double digit misery index, 1.8% GDP growth, record budgets, no leadership skills at all, 29 fund raisers, 76 rounds of golf. Yes, that is leadership and a record to be proud of.

January 2001-December 2007 7.1% to 8.8%
January 2008-December 2008 8.8% to 13.6
January 2009-May 201114.1-15.8%

Conservatives' arguments are so befuddled that even he won't defend them

A few minutes ago, he argued that eco policy had NOTHING to do with interest payments on the debt.

Now, it does!!!

 

[Conservative]

Of course they don't show a surplus. bush* spent the surplus because republicans want to destroy the economy so they can make money short-selling govt bonds

You really don't know how the budget process works. Where was the surplus that Bush inherited? I cannot belive this, You really are misinformed

 

[Conservative]

I responded to your post. :lamo :lamo :lamo

You posted those numbers. Now you cry because I point out the sucking head wound in the numbers you posted????

:naughty

I posted those numbers because percentage change doesn't trump 14.7 million unemployed Americans and people not paying much in FIT

 

[sangha]

You really don't know how the budget process works. Where was the surplus that Bush inherited? I cannot belive this, You really are misinformed

The surplus that bush* inherited was spent by bush* and the repubicans so they could destroy the economy and make money short selling bonds

 

[TurtleDude]

Taxes are a very practical dollars-and-cents issue which has tremendous impact on the entire government and how it serves the American people. Your admission that the radical right decides many things on the gut level of pure emotion is noted and accepted. Those of us on the progressive side have made a rational and fact based decision about taxation free from emotion. We take the extreme radical, communist, socialist, marxist, progressive, menshivik, bolshevik, stalinist, trotskyite, leninist position that there are two sides to a budget and both must be dealt with.

Yes, I realize that such a position completely defies all libertarian standard accounting 101 textbooks where they tell us that a budget only needs one side... but we have cast our lot with the wide eyed wooly academic extremists who actually think there are two sides to a budget and it is wise to deal with both.

What does it say about the right wing today that they not only want to make over all poltical science, but now they want to rip whole chapters out of basic accounting books and ignore that a budget has two sides.

And there is nothing EMOTIONAL about that.

does this quote from Haymarket sound FREE OF EMOTION

 

[Conservative]

The surplus that bush* inherited was spent by bush* and the repubicans so they could destroy the economy and make money short selling bonds

There was no surplus, surpluses would reduce the debt not affect the next years budget. You don't have a clue. Fiscal year of the United States runs from October-Sept. and surpluses if any never carry over, they reduce the debt

 

[Sheik Yerbuti]

Do you ever ****in' stop lying?? I never said that. Why are you so incapable of debating people on what they say and stop arguing strawmen you create because you can't understand what people tell you??

I never said I believe in the current size of the government. I have said we need to cut spending. You can't deal with that. All you hear is that I want taxes raised.

That is the thread topic, suggest you stick to the topic.

Are you justifying your lying because you think I'm off topic?

 

[TurtleDude]

Conservative logic:
Reagan believed in "the American people solving problems" so he raised taxes 11 times
bush* increasing unemployment = good
obama decreasing unemployment = bad

what was the net result on taxes during the Reagan administration

In simpler terms what was the tax rates before Reagan took office vs after he left office

Thanks

 

[Sheik Yerbuti]

Bush's budget didn't include a 800 billion dollar Obama stimulus program Obamacare, the spending of 350 billion he left to Obama from TARP, or the 100 billion Afghanistan supplemental. Of course that is all Bush's fault too.

Bush's TARP ...

Bush's wars ...

... Obama's fault.

:roll:

 

[sangha]

There was no surplus, surpluses would reduce the debt not affect the next years budget. You don't have a clue. Fiscal year of the United States runs from October-Sept. and surpluses if any never carry over, they reduce the debt

There was a surplus and bush* spent it so his republican minions could make money short selling bonds

 

[TurtleDude]

Once again, a rightwinger runs away from his own argument. Conservative has repeatedly asked which president exceeded those #'s. When he got an answer, he suddenly doesn't want to know about past presidents. :lol:

the issue is --is there a spending problem- there obviously is and Obama has made it far worse

end of story

 

[TurtleDude]

If conservatives didn't make stuff up, they'd have nothing to say

More silly bs-is that lie from Colbert too or is it something you made up on your own?

 

[Thunder]

end of story

we wouldn't have as much of a spending problem if Bush followed his fiscal-Conservative roots and didn't lower taxes while spending on two unfunded wars.

Bush made the mess and Obama is trying to get us out of it....WITHOUT any help from the GOP.

 

[Conservative]

Bush's TARP ...

Bush's wars ...

... Obama's fault.

:roll:

The Obama record is Obama's fault

0bama record, 14.7 officially unemployed with 15.8% total unemployment, 4 trillion added to the debt, double digit misery index, 1.8% GDP growth, record budgets, no leadership skills at all, 29 fund raisers, 76 rounds of golf. Yes, that is leadership and a record to be proud of.

U-6 Unemployment

January 2001-December 2007 7.1% to 8.8%
January 2008-December 2008 8.8% to 13.6
January 2009-May 201114.1-15.8%

 

[TurtleDude]

Reagan Raised taxes 11 times and noone in his administration claimed lowering taxed raised revenue, just as Bruce Bartlett and David Stockman. Reagan lowered taxes and then realize they werre too low so he raised them. Did you agree with him when he said corporations need to pay "their fair share?"

what was the net affect upon taxes by the Reagan Administration

and what taxes did he lower and what were raised?

 

[Conservative]

There was a surplus and bush* spent it so his republican minions could make money short selling bonds

spouting the same lies over and over again don't make those lies true. You don't understand budget surpluses at all. Where was the surplus that you claim Bush inherited and spent?

 

[Sheik Yerbuti]

what was the net result on taxes during the Reagan administration

In simpler terms what was the tax rates before Reagan took office vs after he left office

Thanks

Hey, TurtleDude, did I miss your evidence to any of this ...

... let's see your evidence that 9.11 caused tax revenue to drop for 3 straight years. Let's see your evidence that 9.11, which occurred with little over 3.5 months left in 2001, caused tax revenue to drop in 2001? Let's see your evidence that "Clinton "jacked up" the luxury tax? Let's see your evidence that tax revenue fell after Clinton did that? Let's see your evidence that imposing a luxury tax (which occurred under Bush in 1990) led to a drop in tax revenue.

 

[TurtleDude]

Did FDR cause the unemployment situation or was it the rediculouly low tax rate (24%) that cause the stock market to crash in 1929?

Now that has to be one of the most stupid statements I have seen here. The claim that it was either FDR or the tax rate. FDR wasn't president until 33 and the tax rate was not the problem either

 

[Conservative]

we wouldn't have as much of a spending problem if Bush followed his fiscal-Conservative roots and didn't lower taxes while spending on two unfunded wars.

Bush made the mess and Obama is trying to get us out of it....WITHOUT any help from the GOP.

How did Bush spending cause Obama to put that spending on steroids? Obama record 2 1/2 years later seem to be ignored. Obama just didn't just take office. Is this the record you expected 2 1/2 years later?

0bama record, 14.7 officially unemployed with 15.8% total unemployment, 4 trillion added to the debt, double digit misery index, 1.8% GDP growth, record budgets, no leadership skills at all, 29 fund raisers, 76 rounds of golf. Yes, that is leadership and a record to be proud of.

U-6 Unemployment

January 2001-December 2007 7.1% to 8.8%
January 2008-December 2008 8.8% to 13.6
January 2009-May 201114.1-15.8%