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[W#271][W:914] Charlie Kirk Reportedly Shot in Utah: Live Updates

Wait, who's getting killed? Have no idea what's going on in this thread anymore.

Why did we stop talking about the topic?
Your criticism of @Josie veering off topic is noted.

It makes sense when you realize that some people look at every object and think to themselves, how can I use this as a cudgel to beat the left with?
 
I'd say that's the reason. She can't do that. Also, Jung's profile has been scrubbed from the facility's website.

People need to keep their mouth shut.
Or at least have the sense to use an alias.
 
Holy balls. Look at all these people:


Gotta make American MAGAts feel great to know that Britain has its own share of bigots and fascists being drawn together in support for their U.S. brethren by widely known and properly reviled far-right criminal fascist Tommy Robinson.

Really something to be proud of.
 
I don't know if that's true. Nothing is ever static. For one thing, Trump has been hemorrhaging support from Latinos. Every election is a new electorate.
Yes, the situation will eventually change. Trump himself does seem to be speeding the process up. But my read right now is that the situation has too much momentum for one person to change it.

Here’s why: let’s rewind back to 2008, with the financial crisis. A lot of ordinary folks lost their shirts. My wife lost her high-paying job in finance as a result, for example (she was a software developer for banks, nothing to do directly with the bad guys in the crisis). That was the last straw in a long litany of insults and injuries to the working class, that had been seeing longer hours and fewer benefits over time while during the same period their purchasing power was either staying flat or declining, all while a few people were attaining massive levels of wealth for comparatively little work.

The electorate wanted change, which is how Obama was elected. He turned out to be a centrist who protected the bankers from the consequences of the mess they caused, even when those bankers took taxpayer funds to do stock buybacks and pay themselves huge bonuses. The level of anger that was growing was obvious to anyone who cared to look. Obama was able to win reelection mainly because of the ACA and the fact that his opponent was perceived as even more of a flunkie for those same economic elite.

Trump cared to look. He saw all of this, and played to it. The voters were looking for someone to blow up the system that had been screwing them raw for fifty years. The fact that the Dems twice ran centrist business-as-usual candidates when they had a progressive option just shows that the Dems were unaware (and largely still are) of the reality. Convention wisdom would say there’s no way America would elect a professed socialist to the presidency. But conventional wisdom twice said the same about Trump. No way America would elect a p*ssy grabber. No way America would elect a con man and a felon. The reason he got elected is that folks are tired of business as usual.

The problem the Dems invoked by running Hillary and then Harris is they showed the voters they stand for business as usual. And that’s going to be a very difficult image to shake. The blow-it-up party is now Trump’s party, and it’s going to be hard to get people to listen to the counter message. Trump can certainly help that process along and he seems to do so on a regular basis, but nothing he’s done yet is so bad a screw up that voters wouldn’t vote for him again against anyone with a D after their name. It won’t be permanent, but the Dems running Bernie now would just seem like cheap imitation or insincere gimmickry. I’m afraid I don’t see an easy way out.

The problem does go even deeper: the perception is that Dems are generally milquetoast politicians who will refrain from taking bold moves when needed. The Reps do not suffer from such an image. Again, hugely problematic right now. The Republicans made it into a street fight in 1994, and since then it’s been the Dems thinking they in an adjudicated points match when in fact they’ve been in a brawl complete with knives and bats, pistols and shotguns, and they just seem unable to grasp the simple facts of the case. To change all of this will take a massive effort. The old guard will have to slither off and die, most likely, before there will be a chance for it.
 
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Trump cared to look. He saw all of this, and played to it. The voters were looking for someone to blow up the system that had been screwing them raw for fifty years.
And then he handed their medicaid over to billionaires.

His fans are suckers. Marks. Rubes.
 
And then he handed their medicaid over to billionaires.

His fans are suckers. Marks. Rubes.
Absolutely! He’s just great at managing perceptions. He knows that in times of great anger and injustice, image is what wins elections, not substance.
 
You think they hand out licenses to pilots who don't get their hours and certs because of Blackness, eh?
Critical thinking is missed on you. Apparently reading is too...
 
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Seriously? Yeah, well, anyone who thinks pointing out that 110,000 Brits rallied in London because they think their country is being overrun by Muslims is hate speech can suck on a lemon. (I was actually thinking something that wasn’t quite as nice. 😆)
 
Now this is interesting. From your source:

As Krauthammer suggests, many left-leaning Americans see conservatives as sexist, racist, xenophobic, or just plain evil (Hart, 2018; Relman, 2019); in contrast, many right-leaning Americans see liberals as irresponsible, foolish, misguided, or downright stupid (Heston, 2019; Mullaney, 2019; Rinke, 2019; Stacy, 2018). Other narratives in social and mass media paint an alternative picture. Conservatives are unsophisticated, uneducated rednecks who vote against their self-interest (Brennan, 2016; Concha, 2019; Edsall, 2018; Edwards, n.d., Gregory, 2012); liberals are callous and cruel, promoting death panels (Reynolds, 2009) and baby killings (Berrien, 2020; Hedger, 2019).


I would point out that the Death Panels are pretty much isolated to the Obamacare debate, whereas accusations of sexism/racism/baby-killing/woman-suppressing etc. are generally constant, but that's a worthy spread.

Of the four experiments done in this source, one of them claims to be representative, and produces the following scores:

_Snip

It feels like you are coming up with excuses to split hairs, engage in cherry picking and throw out examples you don't like (conservatives talking about death panels and saying liberals are baby killers, etc) and ignore the conclusion of the study I posted.

"Conclusion
As political tensions continue to rise, social and mass media are filled with narratives about why we are becoming so polarized. One often-discussed driver of polarization—and its negative impacts—is negative perceptions of the “other side.” Although it is undoubtedly true that people often see political opponents as evil, they are even more likely to see them as stupid.."


I think you are coming to a conclusion first and then trying to fit the facts around that conclusion rather than the other way around. Frankly, I think you are acting in bad faith and instead of acting objectively are trying to skew things the results to fit your narrative. I don't trust you, and I don't trust your research methodology, because I have seen similar arguments in the past and upon reflection, they were bad-faith arguments. The only way I would trust you is if you actually showed humility, and that would be impossible.
 
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Seriously? Yeah, well, anyone who thinks pointing out that 110,000 Brits rallied in London because they think their country is being overrun by Muslims is hate speech can suck on a lemon. (I was actually thinking something that wasn’t quite as nice. 😆)
The fact that the rally organizer is a far right, anti immigration, anti-Muslim, criminal shit head is a good indication of the types of shit heads that attended the rally.
 
I think you are coming to a conclusion first and then trying to fit the facts around that conclusion rather than the other way around. Frankly, I think you are acting in bad faith and instead of acting objectively are trying to skew things the results to fit your narrative.
That is a common failing of his narrative. It's not subtle, but it is consistent.
I don't trust you, and I don't trust your research methodology, because I have seen similar arguments in the past and upon reflection, they were bad-faith arguments. The only way I would trust you is if you actually showed humility, and that would be impossible.
Hmm. Humility. Good goal.
 
Nick Fuentes says the shooting had nothing to do with his groyper boys, but then went on camera to pray there is no further violence, and disavowed his violent supporters.

That's like saying you hope there aren't anymore robberies, but if there are, the people who did it are definitely not friends of yours anymore.

That sounds like a guilt free conscience to me!

🫠
That also sounds exactly like Trump, especially when talking about Epstein.
 
Fuentes causes all my alarms to go off. He is no good IMO. Look-like one thing. Protest too much. Manipulate.
 
Use of the terminology like that may be more acceptable among kids who are more socially conservative.

Maybe, but I wouldn't go anywhere close to saying that its use was "obviously" anti-LGB+
 
Maybe, but I wouldn't go anywhere close to saying that its use was "obviously" anti-LGB+
It’s probably obvious to more liberal kids then, but yeah, I think it’s pretty obvious.
 
It’s probably obvious to more liberal kids then, but yeah, I think it’s pretty obvious.

No, and there are other explanations for it, particularly for kids who have spent time on the internet.

More importantly: You responded to a post of mine at 4:20 am, and then within a couple of minutes of this one. You alright, broski?
 
No, and there are other explanations for it, particularly for kids who have spent time on the internet.

More importantly: You responded to a post of mine at 4:20 am, and then within a couple of minutes of this one. You alright, broski?
Ultimately this is a cultural thing and if the shooter turns out to be liberal, they are likely to be sensitive to that terminology. I just checked with my younger kid and she said it would be offensive unless the kid was more conservative.

I tend to wake up early and go to bed early. On top of that my body just resist changing schedule.
 
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