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[W: #18] Jesus is GOD
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still waiting on why the Bible says to worship Jesus;
the Bible says to worship God not anything else.
still waiting for an answer.
and waiting.
.
Scripture?
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you asked for it: you got it, the Scripture...
Yes, Jesus was worshiped according to the Bible, and He accepted worship, which affirms His divinity as the second Person of the Trinity. Several passages across the New Testament show people worshiping Jesus during His earthly ministry and after His resurrection.
- The Magi worshiped the infant Jesus by bowing down and offering gifts (Matthew 2:11).
- After Jesus walked on water, those in the boat worshiped Him, saying, “Truly you are the Son of God” (Matthew 14:33).
- After His resurrection, women who met the risen Jesus clasped His feet and worshiped Him (Matthew 28:9).
- Thomas, doubting the resurrection, worshiped Jesus upon seeing His wounds, declaring, “My Lord and my God!” (John 20:28).
- The disciples worshiped Jesus after His resurrection (Matthew 28:17).
- Various individuals, including a healed leper, a ruler whose son was healed, a Canaanite woman, and a blind man, worshiped Jesus during His ministry (Matthew 8:2; 9:18; 15:25; John 9:38).
- The apostles worshiped Jesus in Luke 24:52 after His ascension
Jesus never rebuked those who worshiped Him, unlike the angels who discouraged worship directed at them (Acts 10:25–26; Revelation 19:9–10). This acceptance of worship is a strong biblical indication of His divine status.
In summary, the Bible clearly records that Jesus was worshiped both during His life and after His resurrection, and He accepted such worship as fitting for God Himself
.https://www.perplexity.ai/search/jesus-was-worshipped-in-the-bi-pY1cPSDKSze1O58woeyQBQ
Obeisance is not the same as worshship...one can show obeisance to someone out of respect, worship results from love...
Obeisance:
Definition: The act of complying with a command or request.
Motivation: Can be based on duty, fear of consequence, or a desire to please the authority figure.
Focus: Primarily on carrying out the specific action or directive.
Worship:
Definition: The act of showing reverence or adoration, often towards a deity.
Motivation: Often stems from love, respect, and a sense of awe towards the deity.
Focus: On the relationship with the deity and expressing reverence for their divine nature.
1. Obeisance:
In essence: Obeisance is about showing respect to earthly authority, while worship is about expressing devotion to a higher power. While actions like bowing or kneeling might appear in both practices, their underlying intent and the entity they are directed towards are fundamentally different.
Google
- Definition: Obeisance is the act of showing deference or respect towards someone in a position of power or authority.
- Focus: It emphasizes obedience, submission, and honoring a superior, such as a king, leader, or elder.
- Nature: Obeisance can be formal, ritualistic, or practical, often involving physical actions like bowing, kneeling, or curtsying.
- Context: Obeisance is rooted in social hierarchy and expressing acknowledgement of someone's higher status or position.
- Definition: Worship is the act of expressing reverence, adoration, and devotion towards a deity or something considered sacred.
- Focus: It emphasizes a personal relationship with the divine and expressing awe, love, and gratitude.
- Nature: Worship can manifest in various forms, including prayer, singing, rituals, and acts of service, all intended to connect with and honor the divine.
- Context: Worship is inherently religious or spiritual, focused on connecting with the sacred and seeking a deeper relationship with a higher power.
| Feature | Obeisance | Worship |
|---|---|---|
| Target | Someone with higher status or authority | Deity or something considered sacred |
| Emphasis | Obedience, submission, respect | Reverence, adoration, devotion |
| Motivation | Acknowledging social hierarchy and power | Seeking a relationship with the divine |
| Context | Social, political | Religious, spiritual |
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The Holy Bible does not refer to Obeisance or was there a call to practice it.
However, we are called to worship the Lord our God
1 Chronicles 16:23-31
23 Sing to the LORD, all the earth; proclaim his salvation day after day.24 Declare his glory among the nations, his marvelous deeds among all peoples.
25 For great is the LORD and most worthy of praise; he is to be feared above all gods.
26 For all the gods of the nations are idols, but the LORD made the heavens.
27 Splendor and majesty are before him; strength and joy are in his dwelling place.
28 Ascribe to the LORD, all you families of nations, ascribe to the LORD glory and strength.
29 Ascribe to the LORD the glory due his name; bring an offering and come before him. Worship the LORD in the splendor of his holiness.
30 Tremble before him, all the earth! The world is firmly established; it cannot be moved.
31 Let the heavens rejoice, let the earth be glad; let them say among the nations, “The LORD reigns!”
John 4:21-24
21 “Woman,” Jesus replied, “believe me, a time is coming when you will worship the Father neither on this mountain nor in Jerusalem.22 You Samaritans worship what you do not know; we worship what we do know, for salvation is from the Jews.
23 Yet a time is coming and has now come when the true worshipers will worship the Father in the Spirit and in truth, for they are the kind of worshipers the Father seeks.
24 God is spirit, and his worshipers must worship in the Spirit and in truth.”
30 Bible Verses About Worship - Inspiring Scripture Quotes on Praise
Focus your mind and heart on God with these worship Bible Verses and let your praise go up. Jesus said we are to worship in Spirit and truth, and these verses will help you do that.
www.biblestudytools.com
Worship is not asked to be given to the anointed King whom Jehovah God sets upon his holy hill of Zion, namely, his Son Jesus Christ, but due submission and respect are asked of the kings and judges of the earth, in these words: “Serve Jehovah with fear, and rejoice with trembling. Kiss the son, lest he be angry, and ye perish in the way, for his wrath will soon be kindled.” (Ps. 2:11, 12, AS) This agrees with the recognition that the apostle Paul says must yet be given to the glorified Jesus by all living creation, at Philippians 2:9-11 (NW): “God exalted him to a superior position and kindly gave him the name that is above every other name, so that in the name of Jesus every knee should bend of those in heaven and those on earth and those under the ground, and every tongue should openly confess that Jesus Christ is Lord to the glory of God the Father.” The knee is bent in the name of Jesus as Lord and in worship to the Father as God, and the tongue confesses openly that Jesus Christ is Lord, but this is done to the glory of God the Father, all this showing the superiority of the Father. Thus, “all may honor the Son just as they honor the Father.”—John 5:22, 23, NW.
Consequently, since the Scriptures teach that Jesus Christ is not a trinitarian co-person with God the Father, but is a distinct person, the Son of God, the answer must be that no distinct worship is to be rendered to Jesus Christ now glorified in heaven. Our worship is to go to Jehovah God. However, we show the proper regard for God’s only-begotten Son by rendering our worship to God through and in the name of Jesus Christ. Even now when we kneel in prayer, as Paul did according to Ephesians 3:14-19, we offer prayer in the name of Jesus Christ in obedience to his own directions (John 15:16; 16:23-26), but the prayer itself is addressed, not to Jesus, but to God his Father. In this way we keep things in their relative positions.
https://wol.jw.org/en/wol/d/r1/lp-e/1954008
Consequently, since the Scriptures teach that Jesus Christ is not a trinitarian co-person with God the Father, but is a distinct person, the Son of God, the answer must be that no distinct worship is to be rendered to Jesus Christ now glorified in heaven. Our worship is to go to Jehovah God. However, we show the proper regard for God’s only-begotten Son by rendering our worship to God through and in the name of Jesus Christ. Even now when we kneel in prayer, as Paul did according to Ephesians 3:14-19, we offer prayer in the name of Jesus Christ in obedience to his own directions (John 15:16; 16:23-26), but the prayer itself is addressed, not to Jesus, but to God his Father. In this way we keep things in their relative positions.
https://wol.jw.org/en/wol/d/r1/lp-e/1954008
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The FATHER is person of the TRINITY. Not three GOD's, not one real strong GOD and one less mighty GOD, plus a FORCE. Three persons united in an entity called GOD. All three are equally powerful. Each person has a their own personality. I would even suggest that each of their personalities are revealed in the choices of their designations. But each of these persons have always existed, and will always exist. The SON/MESSIAH/CHRIST apparently has always been the one who assumed a human form. HE walked with Shadrach, Meshach, and Abednego in the fiery furnace. HE talked with Abraham regarding Sodom & Gomorrah and the other cities. HE wrestled with Jacob. And HE walked in Eden with Adam. The HOLY SPIRIT is the person who comforts and indwells. He took on the form of a dove when JESUS was baptized. The FATHER likely spoke to Moses from the flaming bush and the cloud on Mount Sinai. The FATHER spoke from heaven regarding CHRIST. When one does something all the others feel it, know it, and are attuned to it. HOWEVER, in the position of the form the SON of MAN / SON of GOD ---- JESUS needed to set aside HIS power for moment in time to interact like one of us. And it was as CHRIST, this person of the TRINITY was perceived by Satan to be at HIS most vulnerable. HE willingly portrayed a perfect human and depended on the FATHER, the HOLY SPIRIT, and the angels. And this need and action is what is seen by some to indicate that JESUS CHRIST was nothing but a created being ------ special, but created and not GOD. This is entirely WRONG. And it is shear denial on our part to imagine that we as mere mortals know how all this works. The Witnesses re-imagine everything to suit their doctrinal expectations. They are wrong. And they go door to door, not seeking to spread the GOSPEL of SALVATION, but to usher in the kingdom they believe that is their duty to reveal and perhaps even initiate in some peculiar way with themselves in command.
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Your rebuttals are so lame.
Do you perform the eating of the bread in your church (Last Supper)?
If so.................for what reason?
To remember.
To honor and appreciate.
To be thankful for.
To be worthy of that gift!
It's GLORIFICATION of His sacrifice in saving us!
Glorification, is worship!
This isn't about winning the argument, Daisy.
This is about enlightenment.
This is about...................... KNOWING.....................THE TRUTH.
This is about humility.
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Your only problem is turning the Christ of God into God, making multiple gods even though you deny it. Jesus is the Christ, the Messiah, the Son, our High Priest, our Mediator, our Comforter......the one who leads us to God/Father. There are not multi-persons of God.
The trinity draws people away from the fact that "God was in Christ" to "Christ is God", a difference of immense proportions. The "Word" Jesus spoke was NOT his own, it was His Fathers. Jesus gives all the credit, glory, and power to His Father whom he calls the only true God, yet trinitarianism wishes to subvert this by disowning the Father and giving it all to the Son, in essence dishonoring them both, imo.
(Deu 18:15) The LORD thy God will raise up unto thee a Prophet from the midst of thee, of thy brethren, like unto me; unto him ye shall hearken;
(Deu 18:16) According to all that thou desiredst of the LORD thy God in Horeb in the day of the assembly, saying, Let me not hear again the voice of the LORD my God, neither let me see this great fire any more, that I die not.
(Deu 18:17) And the LORD said unto me, They have well spoken that which they have spoken.
(Deu 18:18) I will raise them up a Prophet from among their brethren, like unto thee, and will put my words in his mouth; and he shall speak unto them all that I shall command him.
(Deu 18:19) And it shall come to pass, that whosoever will not hearken unto my words which he shall speak in my name, I will require it of him.
Who's 'word' did Jesus speak?
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No - you said it yourself.
Don't try to paddle back.
What you said means - take Jesus as GOD/FATHER!
YOU SAID IT!
I think - you stumbled into the TRUTH!
Perhaps - you were taken there by GOD.
This isn't about winning the "argument."
This is about enlightenment.
This is about...................... KNOWING.....................THE TRUTH.
This is about humility.
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It's not that I don't believe in hell, I just don't believe in mainstream's interpretation. The wages of sin is death not life and an eternal death is an eternal consequence. Hell is the grave, a cool, dark place, from the old english word, a place where they would bury potatoes. Hollywood Christianity mixed with paganism has brought you Dante's fabled hell, lol.
Ah, refreshing to see some truth.
Been studying scripture for 45 years now and without trinitarian glasses, it's simply and perfectly seen to be false doctrine.
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I said this:
"We are to believe Jesus is the Christ, the Son of the living God taking upon us the same Father/God as Jesus......this is true Christianity."
Meaning we are to have the same God as Jesus......trinitarianism does not.
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To the FATHER, any of HIS creation delegated to eternal separation from interaction with GOD would be regarded most certainly a second "DEATH". And tell me, what could anyone accomplish in Hell, but ponder one's life choices, missed opportunities, what might have been, missed friends/relatives, disregarded truth? That sounds like HELL to me. The fire might be figurative, but no less painful.
CHRIST does deserve our worship after all, or of what value is this light you perceive..?
Here are groups that do not accept the Trinity:
- Christadelphians
- Church of God General Conference (Abrahamic Faith)
- The Cooneyites
- Iglesia ni Cristo
- Jehovah's Witnesses
- The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints teach that Christ and the Holy Spirit are equally divine and that they share in the Father's "comprehension of all things".
- The Members Church of God International believes in the divinity of Christ but rejects the doctrine of Trinity.
- Oneness Pentecostalism
- Sabbatarian tradition (Armstrongism)
- Swedenborgianism
- Unitarian Christian organizations
- Islam
- Shintoism
- Buddhism
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taking upon us the same Father/God as Jesus
Indeed, we are to believe that Jesus is the Christ. The Son of God.
BUT - we are also to believe that Jesus is The Word which was sent by God to fulfill His Messianic purpose, and we are to believe that the Word is GOD.
Ironic that..................
............the way you worded it - came out to mean exactly this:
GOD as JESUS (human form).
Jesus is GOD.
You're the one who composed that statement, I assume.
The way you composed it - coincidence? Accident?
I don't think so.
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Again, the wages of sin is death, not life. Eternal life is the gift from God through Christ. All others receive their wages through the lack of the covering of Jesus' sacrifice. There is no eternal life for those without and they don't live forever separated from God in agony or a torturous chamber of Dante.....they are "dead". God has no need or so small to literally torture part of His creation forever, because they wouldn't accept the truth, for it was He who made us weak in the first place.
I can say worship of Jesus as the Christ, our Lord is okay, but worship to the one true God goes to the Father only. In this I give honor to them both in their rightful positions of authority.
Groups which accept the trinity:
1) Babylon
2) Egypt
3) Greece
4) India
5) Rome
6) Much of modern day Christianity
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taking upon us the same Father/God as Jesus
Indeed, we are to believe that Jesus is the Christ. The Son of God.
BUT - we are also to believe that Jesus is The Word which was sent by God to fulfill His Messianic purpose, and we are to believe that the Word is GOD.
Ironic that..................
............the way you worded it - came out to mean exactly this:
GOD as JESUS (human form).
Jesus is GOD.
You're the one who composed that statement, I assume.
The way you composed it - coincidence? Accident?
I don't think so.
You are reading things into my words similar you do with scripture. Unless one is wearing trinitarian glasses they would never take from my words to mean, Jesus is God.
We are never told that we must believe Jesus is God in scripture.....it's totally absent. Jesus is the Christ, the son of the living God. Is "God" to you similar to a species, i.e. mammal, insect, fish, bird......then derive somehow that this species consists only of three persons who you call a singular being?
Raise it to a "Mystery" which must be believed, aspired unfathomable to the human mind, which must be accepted else you are not a Christian? All who do not are to be anathema, disregarded, hated for Christ's sake?.......it has become precisely the thing Jesus hated.
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In such cases the death is a spiritual one ---- separation from GOD. Some don't understand this because they refute any belief in an eternal spirit. The SPIRIT is what concerns GOD and not the body.
As TRIUNE one is free to worship CHRIST, but anything other would be regarded as sinful. Only one GOD are we supposed to worship. Since the FATHER, SON and HOLY SPIRIT are ONE GOD ---- there is no issue...
The above is list entirely false. They all believed in a multitude of individual gods and goddesses (often city/state god's). They were petty, fighting among themselves, having very human characteristic with immortality and the ability to do things. These are in no way compatible with Orthodox Christianity which believes in ONE GOD ESSENCE who has revealed HIMSELF to be THREE persons of equal eternal vitality and not
I feel that you will find that most "modern Christian" sects don't even follow CHRIST and HIS teachings, let alone understand the Trinity or even care. Women pastors, disregarding the virgin birth as important, the deity of CHRIST, gay marriage, gay clergy, all beliefs are okay...
Bible Believing Trinitarian CHRISTIANS are in fact very small a percentage in comparison to all the other worldly religions.
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I'm not reading it into your words.
That's what you wrote!
But - if you say you mean it a different way - well, okay.
I'm just saying............how ironic that the way you worded it, is also saying what I've been saying. GOD is Jesus in human form.
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The following is from Daniel Chapter 7: 13- 14
13 “In my vision at night I looked, and there before me was one like a SON of MAN coming with the clouds of heaven. HE approached the Ancient of Days and was led into his presence. 14 HE was given authority, glory and sovereign power; all nations and peoples of every language worshiped him. HIS dominion is an everlasting dominion that will not pass away, and HIS kingdom is one that will never be destroyed.
WHO IS THIS SON OF MAN AND IS HE OR IS HE NOT WORSHIPED?!?!?!?!? If this is CHRIST then if the Witnesses are not worshiping HIM, why are they not? The Bible clearly says this SON of MAN is worshiped. And it doesn't say that to do so is in error or wrong. In fact, this passage indicates that this is what should be done.
13 “In my vision at night I looked, and there before me was one like a SON of MAN coming with the clouds of heaven. HE approached the Ancient of Days and was led into his presence. 14 HE was given authority, glory and sovereign power; all nations and peoples of every language worshiped him. HIS dominion is an everlasting dominion that will not pass away, and HIS kingdom is one that will never be destroyed.
WHO IS THIS SON OF MAN AND IS HE OR IS HE NOT WORSHIPED?!?!?!?!? If this is CHRIST then if the Witnesses are not worshiping HIM, why are they not? The Bible clearly says this SON of MAN is worshiped. And it doesn't say that to do so is in error or wrong. In fact, this passage indicates that this is what should be done.
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The following is from Daniel Chapter 7: 13- 14
13 “In my vision at night I looked, and there before me was one like a SON of MAN coming with the clouds of heaven. HE approached the Ancient of Days and was led into his presence. 14 HE was given authority, glory and sovereign power; all nations and peoples of every language worshiped him. HIS dominion is an everlasting dominion that will not pass away, and HIS kingdom is one that will never be destroyed.
WHO IS THIS SON OF MAN AND IS HE OR IS HE NOT WORSHIPED?!?!?!?!? If this is CHRIST then if the Witnesses are not worshiping HIM, why are they not? The Bible clearly says this SON of MAN is worshiped. And it doesn't say that to do so is in error or wrong. In fact, this passage indicates that this is what should be done. And Jesus answered him, “It is written, “'You shall worship the Lord your God, and him only shall you serve.'”
NEW WORLD TRANSLATION technically says the very same thing...
13 “I kept watching in the visions of the night, and look! with the clouds of the heavens, someone like a son of man+ was coming; and he gained access to the Ancient of Days,+ and they brought him up close before that One. 14 And to him there were given rulership,+ honor,+ and a kingdom, that the peoples, nations, and language groups should all serve him.+ His rulership is an everlasting rulership that will not pass away, and his kingdom will not be destroyed.+
13 “In my vision at night I looked, and there before me was one like a SON of MAN coming with the clouds of heaven. HE approached the Ancient of Days and was led into his presence. 14 HE was given authority, glory and sovereign power; all nations and peoples of every language worshiped him. HIS dominion is an everlasting dominion that will not pass away, and HIS kingdom is one that will never be destroyed.
WHO IS THIS SON OF MAN AND IS HE OR IS HE NOT WORSHIPED?!?!?!?!? If this is CHRIST then if the Witnesses are not worshiping HIM, why are they not? The Bible clearly says this SON of MAN is worshiped. And it doesn't say that to do so is in error or wrong. In fact, this passage indicates that this is what should be done. And Jesus answered him, “It is written, “'You shall worship the Lord your God, and him only shall you serve.'”
NEW WORLD TRANSLATION technically says the very same thing...
13 “I kept watching in the visions of the night, and look! with the clouds of the heavens, someone like a son of man+ was coming; and he gained access to the Ancient of Days,+ and they brought him up close before that One. 14 And to him there were given rulership,+ honor,+ and a kingdom, that the peoples, nations, and language groups should all serve him.+ His rulership is an everlasting rulership that will not pass away, and his kingdom will not be destroyed.+
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The Holy Scripture even in the NWT says only serve ONE GOD “It is written, “'You shall worship the Lord your God, and him only shall you serve.'” Matthew 4:10 and Luke 4:8
Daniel 7:13-14 NWT
13 “I kept watching in the visions of the night, and look! with the clouds of the heavens, someone like a son of man+ was coming; and he gained access to the Ancient of Days,+ and they brought him up close before that One. 14 And to him there were given rulership,+ honor,+ and a kingdom, that the peoples, nations, and language groups should all serve him.+ His rulership is an everlasting rulership that will not pass away, and his kingdom will not be destroyed.+
Obeisance ---- showing deference or respect towards someone in a position of power or authority doesn't apply here, because the word is "SERVICE" and not "Obeisance". The Witnesses have a real problem and love to make excuses applying semantics. I know that you cannot talk to your Witness leaders because they would likely ask you why you're visiting secular religious websites. I know how it works. You need to stop thinking that the Witnesses know what they are talking about. They are a religion of excuses and putting down Christians who do not show obeisance to their leadership.