[W:148] Affirmative Action promotes systemic racial discrimination.

[jaypatriot]

People of color? What do "people of color" have to do with what i said and the facts i pointed out?
THis is what happens when posters get triggered and post moronic meltdowns that have nothing to do with what I posted . . . WOW

Fact remains the claims in the OP and the thread title itself has nothing to prove that its factual. Maybe read them again and read things I actually posted.
Let me know if there's any other factual mistakes i can help you with, you're welcome!

As long as you keep pushing affirmative action and CRT, you are on the losing side of logic.

 

[AGENT J]

As long as you keep pushing affirmative action and CRT, you are on the losing side of logic.

CRT?? another moronic strawman bites the dust
Fact remains the claims in the OP and the thread title itself has nothing to prove that its factual and anything that discriminates/breaks the law by taking into consideration (take into regard) race, gender, etc etc is by definition is NOT AA

 

[TurtleDude]

Asians are a people of color. They are being discriminated against by people who believe African-Americans deserve to be preferred over Asians who worked hard to achieve academic success. But you can't see that.

the avoidance and evasion he is engaging in , is really hilarious.

NO ONE CAN DENY that affirmative action HARMS applicants with better applications and REWARDS those who have not worked as hard PURELY DUE TO RACE

 

[Logician Man]

the avoidance and evasion he is engaging in , is really hilarious.

NO ONE CAN DENY that affirmative action HARMS applicants with better applications and REWARDS those who have not worked as hard PURELY DUE TO RACE

Not true. Anyone can deny anything they want. ( fact )

 

[jotathought]

People of color? What do "people of color" have to do with what i said and the facts i pointed out?
THis is what happens when posters get triggered and post moronic meltdowns that have nothing to do with what I posted . . . WOW

Fact remains the claims in the OP and the thread title itself has nothing to prove that its factual. Maybe read them again and read things I actually posted.
Let me know if there's any other factual mistakes i can help you with, you're welcome!

Are you suggesting that black and hispanic americans are not benefiting from Affirmative Action compared to white and Asians?

 

[RealityChecker]

RC,
You make some excellent points.
It is interesting how Sleepy Joe continues to hold onto his ratings while he can't hold a complete thought while talking to a reporter.
But the mainstream media is doing an excellent job of covering for Old Joe, Nasty Kamala, and Joe's sleazebag son.
It's a good thing there is still FoxNews, the WSJ, the Daily Wire, and a number of excellent Conservative pundits on the radio and creating podcasts.
Otherwise fantasists like Agent might continue to influence more people with half a brain.

Thanks - What concerns me is that the progressive left zealots pose an existential threat to the principles and values that made America arguably the best country ever. The public school system has increasingly moved from educating people how to think critically to indoctrinating kids what to believe. I have spent my life understanding and debunking pseudoscientific nonsense. AGENT J, like so many others indoctrinated into the collectivist Marxist-inspired cult members may be dupes that are still far from the majority but this political cult is large enough to pose existential to the US. We have seen zealots like Mao, Castro, Hitler, and Lenin take over their countries even though they were far from a majority. In most cases, we see corrupt ruling elites that set the stage for these collectivist zealots to take over. America's two corrupt political parties and the growing DC bureaucracy have sown so much antipathy from Americans they are not very motivated to defend either corrupt party. The progressive left cult now largely controls the Democrat party. That party is acting more and more like the evil party that Orwell warned about in "1984". Today's cancel culture makes the McCarthyism of the 1950s look rather pathetic as an existential threat. I hope I am wrong and in 2022 the Democrats are routed from power in Congress and also the RINOs. And in 2024 the next POTUS really does far more than Trump could accomplish to drain the DC Swamp.

 

[AGENT J]

Are you suggesting that black and hispanic americans are not benefiting from Affirmative Action compared to white and Asians?

What on God's green earth? Another post that makes zero sense. How could you arrive at such a conclusion?
EVERYBODY benefits from actual AA.

 

[jotathought]

What on God's green earth? Another post that makes zero sense. How could you arrive at such a conclusion?
EVERYBODY benefits from actual AA.

Hmm .. let's see .. the Asian population applying for grants / scholarships at public colleges? Really? Work ratios? male / female / race...

Notice .. RACE being the key characteristic.

 

[AGENT J]

Hmm .. let's see .. the Asian population applying for grants / scholarships at public colleges? Really? Work ratios? male / female / race...

Notice .. RACE being the key characteristic.

Notice how nothing you said has anything to do with the facts I pointed out about the claims in the OP and thread title LMAO

The fact remains the claims in the OP and the thread title itself has nothing to prove that its factual. Maybe read them again and read things I actually posted.

Let me know if there are any other factual mistakes i can help you with, you're welcome!

 

[jotathought]

What on God's green earth? Another post that makes zero sense. How could you arrive at such a conclusion?
EVERYBODY benefits from actual AA.

If you just look up the definition, you'll see this:

“Affirmative action” means positive steps taken to increase the representation of women and minorities in areas of employment, education, and culture from which they have been historically excluded.

 

[AGENT J]

If you just look up the definition, you'll see this:

You mean this actual definition:

CORNELL LAW

Affirmative Action​

Definition​

A set of procedures designed to eliminate unlawful discrimination among applicants, remedy the results of such prior discrimination, and prevent such discrimination in the future. Applicants may be seeking admission to an educational program or looking for professional employment. In modern American jurisprudence, it typically imposes remedies against discrimination on the basis of, at the very least, race, creed, color, and national origin.

Legal Origins​

While the concept of affirmative action has existed in America since the 19th century, it first appeared in its current form in President Kennedy's Executive Order 10925 (1961): "The contractor will take affirmative action to ensure that applicants are employed and that employees are treated during employment, without regard to their race, creed, color, or national origin."

affirmative action

www.law.cornell.edu

Im very familiar with it, EVERYBODY benefits from actual AA, thanks! LOL

 

[AGENT J]

Seems we need to review due to all the posted lies, deflections, strawmen and meltdowns LOL

Heres the OP Title and its "claims"

----------------------------------------

Affirmative Action promotes systemic racial discrimination.​

- Over time AA has evolved into laws and regulations that support systemic racism.
- Like so many progressive left programs AA actually creates systemic racial discrimination and undermines individual liberty.
- No doubt the intent of AA was to reduce race based discrimination, but the effect of AA is now the only form of government promoted and condoned race-based discrimination.
- AA is immoral and conflicts with the civil rights laws which were intended to outlaw and discourage racial discrimination.
- AA seriously undermine merit and demands people be judged less on objective qualifications and more based on race, ethnicity, and gender indenity.
------------------------------------------

So far, 7 days, 230+ posts later, not one person or one shred of proof has been provided to make OP thread title and claims above factually true. not one . . . .
Please let us know when that fact changes, thanks!

 

[RealityChecker]

What on God's green earth? Another post that makes zero sense. How could you arrive at such a conclusion?
EVERYBODY benefits from actual AA.

Actually plenty are people are hurt by AA policies that lead to less qualified applicants getting accepted. Obviously the Asian-American student who could have graduated from a top tier university is likely going to be less well off as a result of AA. But even those who get accepted despite being far less academically prepared all too often end up suffering too. How So?

Even those who gain acceptance to elite universities via AA are harmed. The harms of AA to these less qualified blacks and Hispanics is becoming increasingly clear. Academic mismatch of less prepared academically blacks and Hispanics results in them ending up lower grades and a higher dropout rates for students who needed an AA racial preference to gain admission at these elite universities. So basing admission more on race rather than merit alone as AA policies do only contributes to the dearth of minorities in STEM fields. Why? Thanks to AA we have bitter blacks and Hispanics doing "diversity training" rather than ending up as engineers, and scientists. If it were not for AA putting these top black and Hispanic students in a highly competitive academic environment for which they are clearly less prepared (based on their much lower SAT scores than whites and especially Asian have in these STEM majors they end up flunking out, dropping out or switching to some easier major where they can still graduate like say education. No person should be disadvantaged by the color of his or her skin, no matter how sincere the intentions of AA proponents are. As they say: "The road to Hell is paved with good intentions."

 

[AGENT J]

Actually plenty are people are hurt by AA policies that lead to less qualified applicants getting accepted.

Thanks for another failed post that has nothing to do with what I said LMAO

 

[RealityChecker]

What on God's green earth? Another post that makes zero sense. How could you arrive at such a conclusion?
EVERYBODY benefits from actual AA.

Au contraire mon capitan:

How Affirmative Action at Colleges Hurts Minority Students

On Dec. 9, the Supreme Court will hear oral argument in a case involving the University of Texas at Austin’s use of racial preferences in admissions. Though the Court has long accepted the practice of state-run schools factoring race and ethnicity into their decisions about whether to admit...

www.heritage.org

 

[AGENT J]

Au contraire mon capitan:

and another failed post that has nothing to do with me or the facts of what I posted LMAO
I can do this all day, see post 236 and 237

Let me know when those facts change, thanks!

 

[RealityChecker]

Even "The Atlantic" magazine, a rather far left publication has noted the unintended consequences of AA:

The Painful Truth About Affirmative Action

Why racial preferences in college admissions hurt minority students—and shroud the education system in dishonesty.

www.theatlantic.com

 

[AGENT J]

Even "The Atlantic" magazine, a rather far left publication has noted the unintended consequences of AA:

The Painful Truth About Affirmative Action

Why racial preferences in college admissions hurt minority students—and shroud the education system in dishonesty.

www.theatlantic.com

Post 236 and 237

 

[RealityChecker]

It is obvious that AA policies in practice are having deleterious effects on both those who get excluded from top tier universities because they are white- or Asian-American and the less qualified academically black- and Hispanic-Americans.

Add in the harm to society from having less qualified MDs, Lawyers, Scientist, Professors, Engineers, etc.. Do you want a woman fire fighter carrying your unconscious relative out of a burning building and down a ladder? Sometimes biological differences ought to lead to disparate results. I suspect the poorer performance of Blacks and Hispanics in academia has more to do with subcultural values that put little emphasis on educational achievement. Looks to me like AA is being used to hide the growing failure of public schools that started when the Federal government got way to involved in K-12 education back in the 1960s.

 

[rahl]

It is obvious that AA policies in practice are having deleterious effects on both those who get excluded from top tier universities because they are white- or Asian-American and the less qualified academically black- and Hispanic-Americans.

Add in the harm to society from having less qualified MDs, Lawyers, Scientist, Professors, Engineers, etc.. Do you want a woman fire fighter carrying your unconscious relative out of a burning building and down a ladder? Sometimes biological differences ought to lead to disparate results. I suspect the poorer performance of Blacks and Hispanics in academia has more to do with subcultural values that put little emphasis on educational achievement. Looks to me like AA is being used to hide the growing failure of public schools that started when the Federal government got way to involved in K-12 education back in the 1960s.

AA has nothing to do with any of that. As you have been shown, legally, by definition, AA can not do what you are ascribing to it. It's illegal.

 

[RealityChecker]

AA has nothing to do with any of that. As you have been shown, legally, by definition, AA can not do what you are ascribing to it. It's illegal.

Wrong again. AA is responsible for that. Again you want to argue semantics and ignore reality, The facts show AA has been used for decades to discriminate for or against people depending on race, gender, & ethnicity. So in reality AA has been used to systematically discriminate against men and especially white men although today at elite universities it is Asian-Americans that are discriminated against by AA. Hence the lawsuit against Harvard and other universities. You want to pretend based on no facts that because some lawyer at Cornell defined AA as not allowing racial preferences it means AA has not been used accept applicants for elite universities who are less qualified based on race. So in reality AA policies have long been using racial preferences even though elite universities insist AA does not do what it has been shown to do and that is judge applicants differently based on race or ethnicity. That is reality.

 

[rahl]

Wrong again.

it's the legal definition of AA. It quite demonstrably precludes race based hiring, as you keep suggesting. That is not debatable. You need to amend your argument and state that these universities (which you haven't actually proven yet) are violating AA laws.

AA is responsible for that. Again you want to argue semantics and ignore reality, The facts show AA has been used for decades to discriminate for or against people depending on race, gender, & ethnicity. So in reality AA has been used to systematically discriminate against men and especially white men although today at elite universities it is Asian-Americans that are discriminated against by AA. Hence the lawsuit against Harvard and other universities. You want to pretend based on no facts that because some lawyer at Cornell defined AA as not allowing racial preferences it means AA has not been used accept applicants for elite universities who are less qualified based on race. So in reality AA policies have long been using racial preferences even though elite universities insist AA does not do what it has been shown to do and that is judge applicants differently based on race or ethnicity. That is reality.

None of this has anything to do with AA, as you've been shown. AA by definition, precludes legally what you are claiming. If an institution or company is doing it, they are violating the law.

 

[jaypatriot]

the avoidance and evasion he is engaging in , is really hilarious.

NO ONE CAN DENY that affirmative action HARMS applicants with better applications and REWARDS those who have not worked as hard PURELY DUE TO RACE

Apparently Progressives, bleeding heart Liberals, and BLM supporters think that affirmative action has some merit other than just firing up Conservatives to oppose AA, CRT, and BLM.

 

[jaypatriot]

Seems we need to review due to all the posted lies, deflections, strawmen and meltdowns LOL

Heres the OP Title and its "claims"

----------------------------------------

Affirmative Action promotes systemic racial discrimination.​

- Over time AA has evolved into laws and regulations that support systemic racism.
- Like so many progressive left programs AA actually creates systemic racial discrimination and undermines individual liberty.
- No doubt the intent of AA was to reduce race based discrimination, but the effect of AA is now the only form of government promoted and condoned race-based discrimination.
- AA is immoral and conflicts with the civil rights laws which were intended to outlaw and discourage racial discrimination.
- AA seriously undermine merit and demands people be judged less on objective qualifications and more based on race, ethnicity, and gender indenity.
------------------------------------------

So far, 7 days, 230+ posts later, not one person or one shred of proof has been provided to make OP thread title and claims above factually true. not one . . . .
Please let us know when that fact changes, thanks!

How in the world can you waste so much time fighting to defend the indefensible?
It's like Biden say GOP voting laws are "Jim Crow on steroids".
Or Facebook is "killing people".
Are you also going to argue that Soylent Green is NOT people?

 

[RealityChecker]

it's the legal definition of AA. It quite demonstrably precludes race based hiring, as you keep suggesting. That is not debatable. You need to amend your argument and state that these universities (which you haven't actually proven yet) are violating AA laws.

If AA does not result in less qualified black applicants being accepted into elite universities like Harvard, Cornell, UC Berkeley, and Stanford why is there such a huge gap in the average black and Asian-American SAT scores in all of these and other elite universities? This gap is so large it could not possibly happen by coincidence. Since AA policies are violating the law then why have they continued for decades and no one doing this systemic race-based discrimination has ever been prosecuted for favoring black over Asian-American applicants? If a law is never enforced and no one is ever punished for breaking it is it a law or is it really just a sham?

None of this has anything to do with AA, as you've been shown. AA by definition, precludes legally what you are claiming. If an institution or company is doing it, they are violating the law.

You are making the same semantic argument as AGENT J. A semantic argument focuses on words rather than real life practices. Focusing on some definition that has no real impact on how AA is being used in the real world does not change reality and seems unimportant or trivial. It certainly is irrelevant or unrelated to this discussion.