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Ukraine says they will make a nuke if Western nations stop helping them.

iguanaman said:
At the very least Ukrainians will be enslaved by Russia and they can make their own decisions about their lives and their country. Ukraine has come too far to ever surrender to Russia again. That is all they are saying. Putin must already know that he can never win in Ukraine and Ukraine is just saying they will also make Russians pay for their defeat should the west desert them. I do not expect they will especially now that nuclear war is on the table. Peace through strength is the answer.
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A Ukraine under Putzin's thumb would be nothing but brutal living.
 
Irredentist said:
That's not true. My family, who relies upon me to support them, cares a great deal. You should refrain from making those kind of personal attacks. It demeans only yourself.
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What attacks?
 
Irredentist said:
I don't appreciate being threatened. If Ukraine wants to commit suicide then I can't stop them, but neither will I support their efforts to do so.
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No one is asking for your support. Ukraine is simply reiterating what they have always maintained, that they will not surrender to Russia whether the west sends them weapons or not. In fact they will resort to making their own nukes before they will let Russia enslave them. Ukraine does not "appreciate" Russia invading their country either but if you want to avoid a nuclear exchange then you should support giving Ukraine the weapons they need to defeat Russia on their own soil. Is that what "threatens" you?
 
It is worth mentioning that the Kursk nuclear power plant is currently in range of Ukrainian rockets.

They don't need a nuke.
 
Irredentist said:
Would a Russian victory be better or worse than nuclear war?
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Would Ukraine nuking a Russian city be worse than sending them the weapons they need to defeat Russia in Ukraine? That is what Zelensky is asking the West.
 
Irredentist said:
It never does. Imperialist powers engage in Imperialism. That's what they do. That's what they'll always do. Americans have a hard time accepting that sometimes evil wins.
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No imperialist powers engage in imperialism if the rest of the world lets them. We have decided not to allow it since history has shown us that it just leads to more wars. Appeasing dictators is a sure way to guarantee more wars in the world. We did not accept evil winning in WWII did we? Besides Ukraine is the one making the choice now and we have to deal with it.
 
iguanaman said:
No imperialist powers engage in imperialism if the rest of the world lets them. We have decided not to allow it since history has shown us that it just leads to more wars. Appeasing dictators is a sure way to guarantee more wars in the world. We did not accept evil winning in WWII did we?
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I feel that Irredentist is very sad about that.
 
Luce said:
It is worth mentioning that the Kursk nuclear power plant is currently in range of Ukrainian rockets.

They don't need a nuke.
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I must say, it’s ****ing hilarious watching the people who were fantasizing about how Russia was supposedly going to cause a deliberate meltdown at a Ukrainian nuclear power plant and screaming about how that was justification for NATO to intervene suddenly do a 180 and defend such tactics.
 
Luce said:
I feel that Irredentist is very sad about that.
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Plenty in the US are very sad it didn’t support the Nazis, yes. Modern Ukraine’s even sadder given their heroes were fighting proudly alongside the Germans.
 
Tigerace117 said:
I must say, it’s ****ing hilarious watching the people who were fantasizing about how Russia was supposedly going to cause a deliberate meltdown at a Ukrainian nuclear power plant and screaming about how that was justification for NATO to intervene suddenly do a 180 and defend such tactics.
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What tactics are you talking about? Russia already blew up a dam and started a tire fire in a cooling tower for a Ukrainian nuclear plant. They cannot be trusted. Ukraine is just telling the world that they will not surrender no matter what the west does. If they resort to using nukes on Russia it will be our fault.
 
Irredentist said:
I quite like living, personally. But I notice you haven't answered my question. Would a Russian victory be better or worse than nuclear war? You claim to know EXACTLY what Russia will do, so you ought to be able to tell me.
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I would suggest you know as well what Russia would do, as shown by decades of their history of raping and pillaging behind them.

Given that the singular country involved threatening multiple times the use of nuclear weapons being Russia , why are you suggesting Ukraine "developing" a nuclear weapon as being the imperative you cling to. Is it your contention the Ukraine has somehow shown a disregard to human life to a greater extent than Russia during this unsought for debacle thrust upon them.

Perhaps lobbying your congress critter to lift the stupid restrictions placed upon the use of conventional weapons in a war they neither asked for or started would serve you better than getting your tighty whities in a bunch over the Ukraine threat to "develop" a nuke.

Are you not a proponent of MAD? Is it just the Ukraine you fear actually using a nuke while living in the one country that has many nukes and actually used nukes during a war.

Why is it only SOME countries having nukes you object to?
My questions could go on ad-infinitem about your singular choosing the Ukraine to prevent from having nukes of their own.

Liking life would seem to be your mantra regardless of it not being a linear objective from "developing" to actually "using". Were it so; the world would have ended in the fifties and on multiple occasions since.
 
Tigerace117 said:
Plenty in the US are very sad it didn’t support the Nazis, yes. Modern Ukraine’s even sadder given their heroes were fighting proudly alongside the Germans.
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LOL No one in Ukraine today ever fought with the Germans. You are delusional.
 
dandolo2k said:
Lets make a little nukie-war. A nuke from Ukraine and a nuke from Russia. One nuke if enough to level Kiev with the ground.
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Okay. If I get to pick the target in Russia.
 
dmpi said:
Nuke held together by duct tape vs. real tried & tested nukes. That's mighty smart thinking.
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As long as it works who cares what it looks like?

I imagine they have the capability to build a bomb but I'm unsure if they can get the parts needed as they aren't exactly sold at the local hardware store.
 
dandolo2k said:
Of course , but I think some very well known cities will follow the same way .
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Ukraine will only nuke Russia if the west fails to give them the weapons to win in Ukraine. It is up to the west now. Perhaps they think Russia should be nuked. Do you support the west giving Ukraine weapons? If not then you are asking for Russia to be nuked.
 
Peter said:
As long as it works who cares what it looks like?

I imagine they have the capability to build a bomb but I'm unsure if they can get the parts needed as they aren't exactly sold at the local hardware store.
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Plutonium is the only rare part needed to make a plutonium bomb. It is a byproduct of nuclear power plants which Ukraine has several of.
 
iguanaman said:
Plutonium is the only rare part needed to make a plutonium bomb. It is a byproduct of nuclear power plants which Ukraine has several of.
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Chornobyl still has it on site, best I can tell.
 
iguanaman said:
This is a brilliant move and not a bluff either. Ukraine has had the capability to make a plutonium bomb since the start of the war, that is a given. Ukraine will not surrender to Putin no matter what the west says or does. If the west is worried about a nuclear conflict between Russia and Ukraine they must give Ukraine the conventional weapons to win this war. It also make clear what a psycho Putin is. He has zero chance of getting his way in Ukraine and still does not care that 1000+ Russians a day are fighting a hopeless war.

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Ukraine has every right to do this. When they gave up their nukes, they did so with the explicit promise of the US, UK and Russia that those powers would not only respect Ukraine's independence and borders, but also Defend them. Russia is obviously in breach, but the US and UK are not performing either, dragging their feet on Ukraine's defense.

If Ukraine builds the bomb, they do not become a Great Power. But like the French Force de Frappe, it forces Moscow to ask itself whether it is willing to trade Moscow and St. Petersburg for Kyiv.
 
iguanaman said:
LOL No one in Ukraine today ever fought with the Germans. You are delusional.
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Modern Ukraine openly celebrates its Nazi collaborators as national heroes....much like the Baltic States.
 
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